Caster of Magic Release thread : latest version 6.06!

[zitro1987]

Radical proposal for 3.0: eliminating the quickly-obsolete spearmen (making bowmen/swordsmen the tier-1 units). This opens up various slots that stay more relevant beyond the very beginning of the game. Examples:
_Halfling halberdiers
_A barbarian unit with immolation
_Gnoll Assassins - ranged poison units
_A fighter's guild klackon melee unit that burrows ('merging')
_A melee unit with 20 caster
_A fighter's guild melee unit with a resist-or-die (most likely stoning) ability
_High Elves priests

[Seravy]

Radical proposal for 3.0: eliminating the quickly-obsolete spearmen (making bowmen/swordsmen the tier-1 units). This opens up various slots that stay more relevant beyond the very beginning of the game. Examples:
_Halfling halberdiers
_A barbarian unit with immolation
_Gnoll Assassins - ranged poison units
_A fighter's guild klackon melee unit that burrows ('merging')
_A melee unit with 20 caster
_A fighter's guild melee unit with a resist-or-die (most likely stoning) ability
_High Elves priests

Interesting idea. The AI is forced to produce Smithy first anyway so they won't be affected by this.
The human player on the other hand...spearmen are useless in combat but I produce them often anyway
-To reduce unrest
-To send into lairs for scouting the type of secondary enemies
-To have something in the city so that I can defend myself with spells in emergencies
-And as a spell based tactic to start combat, like cast 3 Fire bolts per spearmen used up until the enemy is all dead.

However...this doesn't rule out the possibility in one case. If we add a race neutral unit that takes on the role of the Spearmen then we can have something for each race, yet still have slots for 1 new unit per race. Except I don't really have a good idea for a mechanical basic unit .

About the specific ideas :
Halflings not having halberdiers is an important trait of their race and I want to keep it that way.
Barbarians having magic spells on them is not suitable for the race at all.
Gnolls are a race with no ranged units, that's kinda the point. I fail to see why a race of superior melee wolf people would use poisoned arrows. Assassin sounds more like a High Men or Elf unit to me, though they don't really need it.
Caster 20 melee unit sounds interesting. Melee isn't very elf-ish though and the other arcanus races are not very magical. I suppose beastmen could be one but they already have magicians and a very large selection of units. Would make sense for Dark Elf but then they'd be ranged anyway because of the race...
Stoning/Death on a normal unit : big no.
High Elf priests : I like them not having one. I mean, elves should be a race weak to corruption I believe, traditionally pollution angers them a lot.
Merging klackon : This would be nice. It defeats the purpose of being a race with no ranged capability unfortunately.

[namad]

Melee infantry gnoll with poison wouldn't be that bad, but I don't think they really need it. Orcs might though.
Caster melee 20 would make sense for paladins in some games, obviously paladins don't need it though. If it were an elf unit it's melee could just be bad, tactically interesting because often you're just attacking with magicians depending on the situation.
Klackons could maybe use a mage, perhaps one that only knows a single life or nature buff spell? (like doom bolt only something more military and shamanistic? The awful spells you removed like giant strength or some such were so weak they could've fit on a normal unit, not sure what's left that's fair.) Alternatively that might make sense for gnolls too. Neither race needs a defensive buff on basic normal units that badly though.

I'm not a big fan of beastmen myself, is anyone? could they use a buff? or are they useful an economic myyran race who can hope to capture neutral cities of literally any other race and gold rush the new city into a military powerhouse?

A normal unit that can cast web once per combat would be cool, call them a "netter" or gladiator? Pretend webs are nets? Perhaps the net is magically enchanted to act like a giant spider's magical web? Not sure what race it would fit as.

None of these ideas feels basic enough to give every race as a replacement for spearmen, that's for sure though.

EDIT: would it be possible to have a unit cast web on itself automatically when combat started? (Might make a merging klackon fair and reasonable, call it some sort of metamorphosis cocoon or w/e)

[Seravy]

A normal unit that can cast web once per combat would be cool, call them a "netter" or gladiator?

Thought about this one but it would be really overpowered. I guess Magicians already are if you play Nature but this would do the same even if you don't. With 9 webs you can stall any unit for 18 turns when you're the defender...only 7 more somehow and that unstoppable unit will just retreat every turn.

EDIT: would it be possible to have a unit cast web on itself automatically when combat started?

Yes but that would be a really weird unit. And if they reduce their attack strength with spells, it'll never get a turn (not that it needs any if it has zero attack) :D

[Nelphine]

I'd be OK with a weird unit.

I'd also be OK with a buff - or more, a change - to beast man. They feel like the weak version of dwarves and dark elves.

Maybe give them a melee caster?

Orcs with early poison could fit, but don't really match the racial theme of Uber bland.

[namad]

Beastmen are the version of dwarves and dark elves with vastly higher population growth. Maybe just buff beastman population growth more? It's only a minor lead ATM. Basically beastmen are the orcs of myrran, imo.

[Nelphine]

That's true. And yeah, population growth when all of them get Granary and Farmers Market is not that huge a difference.

[Seravy]

It's only a minor lead ATM. Basically beastmen are the orcs of myrran, imo.

They kinda are but they're much better than orcs, obviously. I don't see a problem with them, they have every building, they have some good units, they produce power...dwarves have stronger military but no flying units and horrible magic power. Dark Elves have better power but way slower growth and no strong melee unit like minotaurs.

[Nelphine]

This has been happening for a few turns, although I didn't recognize what it was until now; but every time I go into the armies page, and then right click on Jaer's portrait (he's the first hero), the game freezes. It does not happen if I go into the Items page first.

Edit: Addendum, I just froze the game trying to click OK on the Armies page. Apparently NOT just Jaer/first place hero.

[namad]

Technically dark elves have access to three more buildings than beastmen.
I actually edited my post, before up above, I was going to say all the buildings and better population, turns out they're missing four buildings. Consider giving back some?
Either that or this is out of date http://www.realmsbeyond.net/forums/showt...p?tid=8062
I have zero beastmen cities in my current game so I just relied on the forum. They're missing ship yard, which means merchant's guild and martime guild, and they're missing fantastic stable (Although they don't need a fantastic stable)...

Orcs of myrran would definitely need a merchant's guild though I think to qualify as having "every building" even if you leave the martime guild and fantastic stables off.
I think the ship yard and merchant's guild would be a minor and possibly useful buff, much less interesting though than giving them an assassin.