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Turn 105:
When I opened my save, I was greeted by a message that once again eastern continent is plunged in war: oledavy with his city states allies Carthage and Hattusa declared war on TheArchuke.
No a big battles yet, first turn of war is mostly a moving around units, my scout do notice a horseman from oledavy roaming south of TheArchuke's capital far behind enemy's lines, seeking a pillage opportunity?
Also when checking his diplomacy screen I noticed that oledavy burned all of his treasury and he has zero or negative gold per turn now since I can't ask him for gold per turn now. But biggest shock is that oledavy has a niter resource. Which means that he completed a military engineering and is close for gunpowder, or maybe he does have it already and is upgrading his swordsman into musketman. I shall check domination score next turn.
Since oledavy has 21 tech now and Woden 22, it is safe to assume that Woden also have capacity to produce musketman, only I don't see niter yet in his diplomacy screen. Maybe he don't have it in his lands, I don't know until I get military engineer myself. Woden did complete another wonder, Colosseum which is one of better wonders and it did boost Woden's culture output greatly and Woden don't need to worry about amenities anymore. Also Woden settled another city again (in center of choke point between western and eastern parts of Pangaea map) bringing his total cities upon 9 and soon with Nan Madol 10. Sigh, Woden is becoming a monster civilization, I wonder now what I should do, go for TheArchduke or for Woden anyways to drag him down, time is approaching that I need to make that difficult decision.
Singaboy again rejected my offer, well it is his own decision. But I did send Singaboy 100 gold when he was facing 2 vs 1 war and I sorta feel that Singaboy owe me. Well, next time Singaboy asks me for help, I shall take "extra long time" to think about it. I won't bother Singaboy for a while now again with offers.
Completed stirrups and upgraded my 4 heavy chariots into knights (90 gold for each upgrade, cheaper then crossbowman which is 100 gold), first thing that they are going do is punish Toronto.
Toronto did shot one of my heavy chariot, I moved it away from crossbowman range. My crossbowman in return shot at swordsman, next turn it shall be bloodbath.
My power is already exceeding 600 and it shall be more than 700 next turn, maybe close 800. The second place at domination is currently oledavy with 419, but he did do one more round of mass upgrade, next turn I shall see how strong he has become after his mass upgrade. Woden do have domination score of 384 now, if he don't improve it at turn 115, then I likely declare him war. But Woden still have 10 turns left before it, he still have time to build a army to match mine.
I did chop forests around Desertgrad and aqueduct is completed which triggered eureka for military engineering, overflow goes to monument (1 turn) in Desertgrad to increase my culture further. Also I shall get 2 more population next turn (St. Petersburg size 10 which triggers a inspiration for civil service), then at turn 107 St.Petersburg completes settler which mean one pop less. After that I want a theater in St. Petersburg. Rostov shall build commercial district after watermill, I need more trade routes (towards Woden for more leeching off his science and culture, or between my cities to have roads for my military units). Astrakhan shall build temple after shrine for inspiration of divine right, I think that I also place mosque in Astrakhan, it is closer to other players than St. Petersburg which mean less turns for my apostle to move around. I don't know yet what to build in Vilnius, I shall decide that next turn.
Last thing to mention, I saw that oledavy didn't have gold per turn, so I was interested what everyone do earn gold per turn and checked:
oledavy: 0 or less
Woden: 25 (18 of 25 is currently from Zanzibar, so if I raze it, it shall cripple Woden's economy for upgrades. I just have 2 gold per turn from Zanzibar now)
Singaboy: 16
Me: 39.5 (already upgraded knights, so my monk economy in combination with several silver and truffle tiles is good news for my gold per turn)
TheArchduke: 12 (he still have yet to upgrade, so he might go in red same as oledavy soon)
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Turn 100 standings:
With a weekend, I finally have some time to lay out my state of empire at turn 100 as oledavy reuqested, let start with oledavy's suggested sum up with some added things:
Cities: 5 (6 if Toronto wasn't that annoying)
Population: 27
Districts: 4 (all of them lavra's)
Buildings: 13 (1 palace, 4 monuments, 4 granaries, 1 watermill, 1 shrine, 1 temple and 1 wall)(one monument and granary built by Vilnius itself)
Wonders: 0
Tile Improvements: 31 (St. Petersburg 11, Rostov 7, Desertgrad 1, Astrakhan 4, Vilnius 8)(although none was improved by me in Vilnius)
Great People: 2 (Great Prophet and Great Writer)
Civics: 14
Techs: 17
Science: 27.4
Culture: 26.5
Faith: 31.9
Gold per turn: 39.5
Score: 150
Military strength: 390
Religion: 3 beliefs
Converted cities: 9
Here are my cities at turn 100, beginning with my capital St. Petersburg:
It is by far my strongest city, both food wise and production wise. Only regret is that I did improve cow pasture as very first improvement and ended up never using it!
Then my second city Astrakhan:
When I saw all hills, I initially thought that I found a strong production spot, however it has yet to show up mainly because I was slacking off with builders for too long. Food is a problem here, although I shall build shrine and temple there soon for total of 6 extra food. Also I need to put watermill here too.
My port city Rostov:
This city also suffers from lack of food, it mainly relied on wheat tile that gives it 5 food tile (I have yet build watermill here too). But I did make better choices regarding tile improvements here and the result is that Rostov became my second city production wise despite founded more later than Astrakhan.
And middle in desert: Desertgrad:
I founded this city in order to stop Woden's expansion in my direction. The downside is that this city suffers from lack of food and production both. It wasn't helped by fact that I did neglect builders too long, same problem as Astrakhan. This city is also notably as only city with walls in my empire.
Finally me latest conquest, Vilnius:
This city suffers same problem as Astrakhan: good production but lack of food. Currently it is borrowing wheat tile from Astrakhan since Vilnius is currently only city with watermill and thus farms with improvements adds one extra food. In future Vilnius shall rely more on sea food so that wheat tile can be returned to Astrakhan. Also notably as only city without completed district, all other four cities got lavra.
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Turn 100 Civic:
Got all ancient civics,
Got almost all classical civics, only recorded history yet not. Got important political philosophy at turn 55.
Only got feudalism of medieval civics, mercenaries 4 turns left.
Already got inspiration for reformed church from renaissance period.
This is my available policy cards at turn 100.
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Your reporting has consistently been excellent in this game, thanks so much for keeping us readers informed of what's going on. I think you're also opening up a lot of eyes on what religion can accomplish in a Multiplayer game, especially in terms of gold generation. With all of the crazy diplomacy swirling about in the game right now, what do you see as your next move?
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Turn 100 Technology:
Got all ancient technologies.
I ignored upper part of tech tree for now in favor of more militaristic technology in medieval era.
Currently researching stirrups, military engineering next goal, which mean back to classical era tech for construction.
Only got eureka of mass production here.
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Turn 100 religion:
My religions, I did evangelize once already at turn 100 and I can do one more. I am really with Feed the World since it is going solve my food lacking cities problem soon. Holy Order is always useful and I plans to combine it with mosque for cost effective missionaries and apostles. Finally Church Property is very useful for extra coin, it is one of better choices from a pool of beliefs.
Come to think about it, I didn't show which beliefs are more useful than others. So I shall try explain it for readers. I did say before that evangelizing can make religion more powerful and it needs 3 charges from apostle to do it. But which beliefs and why, that I didn't explained very much yet. Beliefs isn't one huge pool where you can choose at your leisure, it is split up in four groups: followers belief, worship belief (extra building in holy site/lavra), founder belief group 1 (bonuses that you gain from amount population/cities that follows your religion) or and group 2 (methods to spread your religion better).
There are some rules: you are allowed to only choose ONE belief from every different belief groups. Also when founding religion, you get two beliefs and you MUST choose something from followers belief, the remaining belief can be chosen from any belief groups. Then you can evangelize twice (maximum) and pick beliefs from remaining groups.
Followers belief:
Belief Effect
Divine Inspiration All world wonders provide +4 Faith.
Feed the World Shrines and Temples provide Food equal to their intrinsic Faith output.
Jesuit Education May purchase Campus and Theater Square district buildings with Faith.
Reliquaries Relics have triple yield of both Faith and Tourism.
Religious Community Shrines and Temples each provide +1 Housing.
Work Ethic +1% Production for each follower.
Zen Meditation +1 Amenity in cities with 2 specialty districts.
From this group which you must choose when founding religion, overall most powerful belief is work ethic since production is important in civilization 6. In a city with 5 followers, 20 base production mean one production extra and every extra production counts.
Other choices are strongly situational based upon your game play or surroundings. I did pick Feed the World to improve my cities that are low on food, Woden picked Divine Inspiration which is great synergy with his wonder rushing game play.
One thing to keep in mind, this belief can also be used by other players, for example if Woden builds shrine and temple in Splash Mountain's holy site, he shall gain extra food there since my religion is majority there! So it can be double edged sword.
Worship belief:
Belief Effect
Cathedral +3 Faith; 1 slot for religious art
Gurdwara +3 Faith; +2 Food
Meeting House +3 Faith; +2 Production
Mosque +3 Faith; Missionaries and Apostles +1 Spread Religion charge
Pagoda +3 Faith; +1 Housing
Synagogue +5 Faith
Wat +3 Faith; +2 Science
This is belief which allows player to build 3rd building after shrine and temple in holy site/lavra. One thing to keep it in mind, they are more expensive than temple, so building them takes some turns. In that situation Mosque shines, because you actually needs just one and afterwards I just only purchase missionaries/apostles in city with mosque. All other buildings are situational. This belief is also shared by other players, so Woden can also build mosque in Splash Mountain, although as long my religion is majority there, he shall actually purchase missionaries and apostles which spreads Weedy Movement. One final thing to mention, since building 3rd building requires a temple which is unlocked by theology civic thus bit late, it is better to pick belief from this group as last of all groups.
Now two founder belief groups, bonuses from founder belief only apply to the owner himself, so Woden won't get bonuses from this group unlike first two groups.
Founder belief group 1:
Belief Effect
Church Property +2 Gold for each city following this Religion.
Lay Ministry Each Holy Site or Theater Square district in a city following this Religion provides +1 Faith or +1 Culture respectively.
Papal Primacy Type bonuses from City-States following your Religion 50% more powerful.
Pilgrimage +2 Faith for every city following this Religion in other civilizations.
Stewardship Each Campus or Commercial Hub district in a city following this Religion provides +1 Science or +1 Gold respectively.
Tithe +1 Gold for every 4 followers of this Religion.
World Church +1 Culture for every 5 followers of this Religion in other civilizations.
From this list Church Property is in my opinion by far best pick, it is simple and safer option than Tithe. Just imagine 4 cities with size 2, each of them 1 follower. Church Property gives 8 gold in that regard, Tithe just one gold! Pilgrimage do have same effect as Church Property, but I have nothing to gain from it since I am generating much faith already. Other bonuses are too weak or relies too much upon districts. Papal Primacy relies too much upon survival of city states, thus unreliable unless you can defend city states from aggression of other players. So I scored a jackpot with Church Property and it is simply only good pick of this list, so a race for it is possible in future PBEM's.
Belief Effect
Defender of the Faith Combat units gain +10 Combat Strength near friendly cities that follow this Religion.
Holy Order Missionaries and Apostles are 30% cheaper to Purchase.
Itinerant Preachers Religion spreads to cities 30% further away.
Crusade Combat units gain +10 Combat Strength near foreign cities that follow this Religion.
Missionary Zeal Religious units ignore movement costs of terrain and features.
Monastic Isolation Your Religion's pressure never drops due to losses in Theological Combat.
Scripture Religious spread from adjacent city pressure is 25% stronger. Boosted to 50% once Printing Press is researched.
This list is most interesting list of all lists, because there isn't really a bad pick here except Monastic Isolation maybe. Every possible choice likely depends upon game play or surroundings.
I did choose Holy Order because I planned to get mosque for a cost effective combo and I needed many missionaries to combat Woden's pressure. Woden did make good choice with Scripture, this way he didn't need to invest too much into religion in beginning and he could ignore building holy site for a while and spend time upon economic buildings and wonders. Also another good reason is that there is a quite cluster of cities around his capital Main Street which was chosen as holy city, as result his religion spreads quite fast thanks pressure. It caused quite a problem for me, I just got it under control for a while and that is why I can afford to invest in apostles now instead more missionaries.
Currently Woden just have two beliefs, so he can only select from founder belief group 1 and worship belief. I am interested whether which choice he shall make.
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Turn 100 Great Persons:
Total of 7 Great Persons was picked up before turn 100, I did pick up 2, both thanks useful lavra which generates points for 4 different Great Persons. Most notable is lack of Great Person for Singaboy, as I can see he didn't really made a pursue for Great Person, although I know that he lost two cities which hurt him greatly.
I have just one Great Work, I need to build theater for one more charge from my Great Writer who is waiting aimlessly in St. Petersburg now.
Speaking about culture, this screenshot don't please me:
Woden might aim for cultural victory, he is collecting foreign tourists already with his many wonders. I need to counter with more theaters and a possibly wonders of my own if Woden don't go for it.
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(June 10th, 2017, 07:43)Sullla Wrote: Your reporting has consistently been excellent in this game, thanks so much for keeping us readers informed of what's going on. I think you're also opening up a lot of eyes on what religion can accomplish in a Multiplayer game, especially in terms of gold generation. With all of the crazy diplomacy swirling about in the game right now, what do you see as your next move?
Thanks for your kind comment!
Religion is surely interesting and it can add more to game as others also need to pay attention, otherwise I might walk away with religious victory. And besides a victory possibility it is giving me extra food and coin now, so I don't complain. In PBEM 1 there happened to be civilization picks without religious flavors, that might be reason why there wasn't any religion in that PBEM besides your steamroll.
In this PBEM, you have Russia with cheap lavra's which also generates Great Writer/Artist/Musician points, China with ability to rush Stonehenge and Greek civilizations who theoretically use extra wild card to generate Great Prophet points, but I understand that people playing Greece rather go for Great General. PBEM 3 might become more interesting regarding religion with India, Arabia and Japan (last one with halved holy site building time) in play.
What of my move after oledavy declared war at TheArchduke and with all diplomatic intrigues ongoing.
Well I do know short term: take Toronto! (in case that Woden manage to take it before me, it is war against Woden on turn 115, no discussion about it anymore). Also settle the land bridge between Vilnius and Helice.
What after Toronto? I did make list of gold per turn at previous turn report, how more I think about it, how more convinced I am that I should raze Zanzibar. Woden already got 2 completed commercial hubs and he shall get one soon. Thanks Zanzibar each of his commercial hubs are generating 10 gold per turn which is a lot, on top of that Woden also gets free amenities from Zanzibar. Although razing Zanzibar do hurt Woden a bit less now in terms of amenities thanks his Colosseum. I shall rush Zanzibar with knights after Toronto is taken, before razing Zanzibar I shall pillage as many tiles as possible to fill my treasury even more (after all Zanzibar is commercial city state). Woden can only block me until turn 115, then he can declare me war to protect Zanzibar.
So what if Woden manages to surround his units around Zanzibar before turn 115 so that my units can't attack Zanzibar. I do have a devil's scenario in my head, it depends whether Woden is willing to put more envoys into Zanzibar now. Previous turn I didn't mention it, but when I upgraded my heavy chariot into knight, I suddenly got envoy from Zanzibar, oh yeah I did forget that having a knight was a request from Zanzibar (quite evil if you know that I am attacking Zanzibar with knights soon ). The result is now 5 envoys from me and 6 from Woden in Zanzibar, maybe Woden thinks that I just wasted another free envoy. So when my knights are in positions to attack Zanzibar (two tiles away from city itself), I shall put envoy into Zanzibar which kicks Woden from Zanzibar's suzerainty and thus also Woden's units got kicked out Zanzibar's borders since open borders are cancelled when you aren't suzerain anymore as I did experience with Toronto. That was where I did got inspiration from. But if Woden manages to put more envoy's in Zanzibar before my attack, well than I can't do anything about it and I just have make use of my future commercial districts then (I am building one soon in Rostov).
What of my plan to attack TheArchduke, well it is postponed till after turn 115, because I might need all of my units to deal with Woden and Zanzibar for now. With loss of Zanzibar Woden would have difficulty upgrading his units and he need to rely on his production instead. However his only encampment at this moment is at Jungle Cruise which I can pillage quite quickly if I got timing right. Biggest problem is question whether Woden can grab niter, because I rather don't want deal with his musketman. There is still 10 turns before declaration of friendship expires, I shall keep eye on Woden's development. If Woden don't seemingly improve state of his army, I shall attack him. If I know that I can't win again (I want to raze Jungle Cruise, that is my main goal if war between us breaks out), then I shall offer declaration of friendship to Woden again and deal with TheArchduke then. I need to have TheArchduke eliminated by turn 145, so that both oledavy and me can do joint attack against Woden at turn 145. Woden did plant some cities in hilly center of map, so he is starting to get in range of oledavy's cities and oledavy's army.
If Woden reject proposed declaration of friendship, then I still attacks TheArchduke and keep building military units and defense for if Woden want do a surprise attack.
I shall keep oledavy as my ally, but I need to get right timing when I want do push for religious victory, because I need to have declaration of friendship or alliance with oledavy to prevent him killing my apostles.
What about Singaboy, I don't want him attacking oledavy or me if we are dealing with Woden, but Singaboy isn't neighbor with Woden. So I need try to get on good terms with him, past turns it wasn't great with rejected offers. I think that Singaboy is only interested in TheArchduke for now, but what after TheArchduke is gone, it is hard for me to guess what he is going do.
I shall keep getting apostles, when it have proselytizer promotion, he goes to Woden's lands. Otherwise to Singaboy and oledavy's lands (Singaboy's first he is farther away and I uncovered a sea route to his capital with my galley). Although it needs to pass TheArchduke's coastal cities, but I see some sea routes that can keep my units from TheArchduke's line of sight.
I shall have make important decision when Zanzibar is possibly gone or turn 115 if Zanzibar is still in game.
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Turn 106:
No big changes of domination screen with oledavy and TheArchduke, both went from 419 to 483 and 389 to 458 respectively while my domination score shamelessly went to 777!
Toronto is toast now, I killed its crossbowman and swordsman with ease (got eureka for industrial tech Military Science which unlocks Cossack for Russia, I shall make it next tech goal after gunpowder) and I might take Toronto next turn already or one turn more due terrain with 4 tile moving hard hitters, Toronto have yet repair its walls.
Vilnius completed battering ram and I already start move it in direction of Zanzibar under cover of heavy chariot which I shall upgrade into another knight next turn. I also start building knight in Vilnius which is completed at turn 115, precisely in time for potential conflict with Woden or push into TheArchduke's lands.
St. Petersburg grew to size 10 and I got my desired inspiration for civil service, I think that neither oledavy and Woden got inspiration for civil service since I yet have to see size 10 cities in world aside St. Petersburg now. (Woden maybe did got it if he got lucky with Vilnius suzerain power earlier). Next turn settler is completed, I saw at score tracking that Woden did complete a settler, but I already moved my units upon free tiles around Vilnius-Helice land bridge, so Woden won't be able to settle there.
The fact that I have limited access into Woden's doing, might give me interesting information. My trader Nikolai overhears many things for example that Woden is trading with TheArchduke which isn't surprise. But the worrying message is that Woden also traded with Singaboy, I think that Woden is trying to reel in Singaboy into his alliance against me and oledavy. I don't know contents of trade but it is clear that Woden is trying to build up a diplomatic relationship with Singaboy:
For the war news: Woden put Nan Madol in formal siege, with other words, he completely surrounded the city with units so that Nan Madol don't heal every turn anymore, smart of him to do what I neglected at Toronto at first place. Other news from eastern comes from my scout: oledavy's horseman that I saw earlier, did indeed go on pillage fest and that already gave oledavy some hard needed coin as I can see on his diplomatic page.
My state of empire at turn 106:
Desertgrad completed monument and got one of tiles farmed which mean it can finally grow again, building shrine there now. Astrakhan finished shrine and starts temple as planned. Rostov shall start commercial district next turn after water mill is finished.
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Thank you for your detailed reporting and especially for your thought-process and your assessment what went well and what went wrong
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