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Turn 107:
Spanked Toronto's units hard with my knights who take little damage in process and Toronto shall finally fall next turn.
Upon fall of Toronto, I shall move my knights to Zanzibar already to raze it asap. I upgraded another knight (northeast on screenshot disguised as battering ram ).
Woden is also about to take Nan Madol, likely also turn 108 same turn when I shall take Toronto.
Meanwhile settler is completed in St. Petersburg and he is going to the land bridge between Vilnius and Helice. St. Petersburg starts building theater now and then also build amphitheater afterwards to store books from Great Writers, I shall get another Great Writer in 7 turns (thus I shall have 3 charges left in total for books, amphitheater can store just two books) and Great Artist in 18 turns or bit earlier (getting Great Artist shall also give inspiration for humanism civic which unlocks art museum to store paintings). So I don't worry about culture long term, science is a bit problem (it is also where Russia shall get most trouble from it when playing with Russia). I need to get more population (by either settling or conquering cities), start campus or send possibly more traders to Woden. Speaking about traders: I finished watermill in Rostov and started commercial district there.
It seems that war between oledavy and TheArchduke is a bloody one, both domination scores did decrease a quite. I rate oledavy better player, but TheArchduke got 2 Great Generals which compensates much and their power are about equal. It is possible that this results in status quo unless someone else intervene. My aim for now is Toronto and Zanzibar, after that I shall choose: Woden or TheArchduke.
June 11th, 2017, 07:19
(This post was last modified: June 11th, 2017, 07:21 by Alhambram.)
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Oh, oh, it is difficult for me to decide what to do now, since there are so many variables, I think that turn 110 is make it more clear for me.
At turn 108 I capture Toronto and starts moving my units to Zanizbar, at turn 109 depending whether I am satisfied with how situation looks around Zanzibar, then I shall declare war or do this at turn 110.
It can be problematic if Woden indeed do surround Zanzibar to prevent me razing it and did increase his envoy in Zanzibar to 7 or more (now still at 6 envoys, one less than me). In worst case scenario I have to call off attack on Zanzibar and I need to declare Woden war then on turn 115 to get rid of Zanzibar. Or alternatively I can ignore Zanzibar if I can't conquer it, instead I just also build commercial districts (already started one in Rostov) and then definitely go for TheArchduke.
At turn 110 I shall choose to upgrade another knight or a crossbowman this time and then swap policy card professional army with raid to get extra income from pillaging, so I won't pillage before turn 110. Zanibar do have 4 tiles worth to pillage: deer, commercial hub and sheep, all of them are at south which should be easy for my army to occupy that tiles, one tile with tobacco is slightly northeast and I need to send one knight there. After pillaging all worthwhile tiles, I shall raze Zanzibar.
After "Zanzibar" shall I go for Woden or TheArchduke, still undecided and it also depends upon Woden's response against my planned razing of Zanzibar.
I did make a list of all pros and cons for declaring war on one of either players.
WODEN:
PROS:
-With declaring war on him, I stop him from running away too much since he need to invest in military instead economy/wonders.
-If I manage raze Jungle Cruise (which is my main goal if war between me and Woden is happening), Desertgrad and Toronto shall get more tiles for themselves.
-When Zanzibar is gone, Woden do have much less income which mean more difficulty for him to upgrade units.
CONS:
-With this I shall make enemy of life of Woden, I don't think that it is going be peaceful anymore, so less chance for potential religion spread in future.
-War is also dragging me down in economic terms, Woden is already in better shape than me and more suited for long term war and he can add more cities at north.
-Since I am attacker here, all Woden needs to do is defend, he already got walls in most of his cities (however they costs maintenance, I only have one in Desertgrad and I can quickly finish walls in other cities if I think that is needed, so less maintenance costs for me!)
-Woden can build Chinese unique unit Crouching Tiger which got 50 ranged attack, just put it in walled city and it becomes a nightmare for my attacking units. Medevial era is best suited for Chinese defense, my best military period have yet to come with Cossack in industrial age. So another 30 turns of declaration of friendship do look better option for me again.
-Woden can counter attack my cities and pillage my tiles since I am his close neighbor, that problem I don't have when I am dealing with TheArchduke.
-Woden is more advanced than me already, so he might come with musketman soon. I don't want same shenanigans as when Toronto suddenly went from warrior-swordsman and archer-crossbowman and I face Woden going from swordsman-musketman this time.
THEARCHDUKE:
PROS:
-He is currently busy with oledavy so all of his army is likely dealing with him now, leaving his backline cities exposed for me which can be reached by over sea.
-No walls in his backline cities and I don't see them starting building, so just fast knights is enough, closest city Helice do have walls in process, so battering ram along with army meant for Helice.
-Unlike Woden, I do see chance to mass capture cities from TheArchduke here, especially his backline.
-Maybe both oledavy and me can flank TheArchduke's army and crush them so we can take all cities freely and eliminate TheArchduke.
-My galley scouted a unsettled lands east of TheArchduke's cities and south of Singaboy's cities which mean more room to expand for me (tundra, so low priority for Sinagboy likely).
-With so many new cities, I can ramp up my science and culture rate and keep up Woden once more (my galley did note that Woden still have a lot room to expand north of his empire, so he shall only grow more).
-With TheArchduke gone oledavy should have free hands to help me against Woden.
CONS:
-I likely need to deal with units boosted by TWO Great Generals, currently they are likely busy with oledavy, but how shall battlefield looks when I invade, is it still stalemate or did either oledavy or TheArchduke already made a decisive blow?
-How shall Woden respond when I attack TheArchduke, this is one of reason I shall attempt to send Woden declaration of friendship so I don't need worry from attack of Woden on my cities.
-When I conquer most of TheArchduke's lands, I do have three close neighbors instead currently Woden alone now, so I need be doing more tactfully diplomacy. TheArchduke actually was never really been my "close neighbor" thanks Vilnius city state first and now that sea between us secondly.
As you can see, I have more PROS with TheArchduke and more CONS at Woden's list. Well, it seems that TheArcduke is most likely target now. But I have to see how Woden shall response towards my actions around Zanzibar.
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Turn 108:
Finally captured Toronto, it is quite a prize: free industrial district which triggered eureka for mathematics (I have larva, aqueduct and industrial district now). Also I got my own horse resource! Which mean that I can mass produce horseman in cities with encampment and then upgrade in Cossack if I wanted.
Then I sent my healthy units to borders of Zanzibar, what I saw is at same time disappointing news and what I feared: Woden blocked access to Zanzibar city center itself.
Well, next turn if Woden don't put envoy into Zanzibar (he still is at 6 envoy's and me 5), he shall get a nasty surprise when I put my envoy in Zanzibar. His units shall be kicked out, then I declare war and my units takes position next Zanzibar's city center and my knights might attack city already if possible with ram support . Then turn 110 put raid policy card and then a pillage fest, although I doubt now that I can pillage tobacco tile. After pillage I shall raze Zanibar.
Woden can still save city by putting envoy next turn, but I wonder whether he does know that? In that case I call off attack on Zanzibar and vent my rage upon TheArchduke which our friendship did wear off this turn. I didn't send new request for friendship. oledavy's friendship with me shall expire next turn, maybe not already renewing friendship to make TheArchduke too suspicious of me.
Also note Woden power is 367 compared with my 751 now, more than doubled Also I am seeing warriors and archers at Zanzibar and I know that he got swordsman, crossbowman and ram over there at Nan Madol. If such difference in power between us continues, I have to attack Woden while he is still this weak. His science and culture output is very huge now 47.1 science against 37.4 mine and 36.9 culture against 30.5 mine now. Turn 114 our friendship shall wear off, so Woden have 5 turns more to improve his army quickly, otherwise I won't hesitate anymore. If Zanzibar is gone, then it means that his bunch of income is gone too which mean I don't worry about his possible mass upgrade anymore. He got 139 gold in treasury now and I noticed a barb camp north of his cities, so free 50 gold for him. At turn 114, he shall have between 250 and 300 gold I think, enough for 3 crossbowman or 3 knights or 1 musket maybe I think (If I am not mistaken, with professional army policy 235 gold is needed to upgrade one swordsman to musketman).
Woden did also conquer Nan Madol and I lost 2 culture, a little price since I shall soon have monument repaired in Toronto and also I am having a little culture explosion soon when theater and amphitheater are complete with two Great Writers waiting in line. I did use last charge of missionary hanging around Vilnius and Toronto past turns to convert Toronto and thus 2 extra gold per turn (converted 10 cities now totaling 20 gold per turn extra thanks Church Property).
I completed tech shipbuilding and starts construction 3 turns to complete and then military engineering 5 or 6 turns. Next turn won't be boring one I think in a good or bad way.
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Turn 109:
First thing what I did when opening my save was checking Zanzibar's envoy status:
Woden didn't put another envoy, so difference between us is still 1 envoy!
I could decide to move more units and declare war next turn, but Woden might catch suspicions that my army didn't turn away once I saw his units surrounding Zanzibar. So I didn't take chances and decided to take action now.
I positioned all my units so that Woden's units shall be kicked further away and my knights should take tiles adjacent city quickly.
I sent envoy to Zanzibar and knocked Woden off of his Suzerainty and all of his units got kicked out:
Then I starts laugh maniacally due evilness of my plan and declare war at Zanzibar.
And moved all my units into right positions, one of my knight found a wandering builder of Zanzibar although he still got one charge left, I captured it.
There are two problems, firstly Zanzibar has high defense and I need ram to crack this tough nut, it is incoming though. Secondly I don't know how long it shall take to raze Zanzibar, maybe I won't manage to take it before turn 114 when Woden can declare me war to protect Zanzibar. So I need to deal with Zanzibar swiftly.
Internationally it seems that oledavy again got some beating by other player, firstly Singaboy and now TheArchduke. Both domination score decreased a quite (oledavy more than TheArchduke) and oledavy's encampment got pillaged. TheArchduke surely seems to play much better than PBEM 1, at beginning of this thread I already said that I rather not be his neighbor since TheArchduke certainly want prove himself after being steamrolled in PBEM 1.
The domination ranking at turn 109:
1: Alhambram 751 points
2: Woden and TheArchduke both 367 points
4: oledavy 297 points
5: Singaboy 282 points (he do have 282 points since turn 98, clearly investing in rebuilding of empire, but such low score and not improving it might provoke another attack from oledavy or TheArchduke if they think that Singaboy is a easy prey.)
But I know that Woden got a lot injured units from conquering Nan Madol, at turn 97 he was on his peak with 531 domination points. I at other hand also have handful number of injured units, so at my max I might exceed 800 points.
But as I can see in wars at eastern continent, defender mostly won (only attacking success came from TheArchduke after he switched allegiance and attacked Singaboy while he was busy with oledavy).
So I am still nervous about thought of possibility to attack Woden, but Woden is starting running away seriously now. Maybe now it is the moment of "Now or Never" to attack Woden. I am in much better state now than turn 82 when I called off firstly planned attack on Woden.
June 12th, 2017, 08:38
(This post was last modified: June 12th, 2017, 08:45 by Alhambram.)
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Turn 110:
Well, after some thought and also an incident in this turn caused me to make decision who to attack: I shall attack Woden! And I won't back off at same moment as previous time, it is now really NOW OR NEVER!
His city of Jungle Cruise was irritating me from start and halfway playing turn 110 I saw something that turned out be the final nail in the coffin:
I am sure that tile was 2 food always and suddenly when it was grabbed by Woden it became 3 food/1 production tile, moreover Woden bought that tile, it isn't definitely normal culture expansion.
Since Woden is several tech ahead and I knew that he could see niter, I can't think else than a niter resource on that tile and at civilization guide it indeed states that niter gives 1 food and 1 production extra on a tile.
And this tile is much closer my capital than his, I was supposed to pick up that niter, not Woden!
Woden also made other move this turn: he claimed Great Engineer (likely grabbed with faith/oracle combo, if I recall correctly he already generated quite amount GE points although he was behind Singaboy at that category. So he managed to steal it, but I know that he won't do another Great Person steal quickly since he needs to accumulate faith for a while. About Great Engineer that Woden got: he can build medieval wall in any city, I wonder in which city he shall put it. It seems that Woden want play defensive and keep riding away with his high science and cultural output. Also Woden started to mass build districts and buildings into districts including shrine in his holy site which he did complete. So he is likely planning to build normal temple next and Temple of Mahabodhi afterwards to combat my religion. I am going to complete temple in Astrakhan next turn and I can complete Temple of Mahabodhi in 20 turns, maybe faster if I sent some builders to improve plain hill tiles more. So I can declare Woden war to force him building military units or defensive buildings instead builders, economic buildings, districts or wonders. At this moment I think that it is really now or never situation for me. If I sign another declaration of friendship with Woden now, it is basically game over for me and three in eastern continent over there.
Well it seems that I need to do it alone, all others over there in Eastern Continent are busy with each other. I did mention that it is a classical problem if you put three opponents together, two of the shall always be warring against local leader. When it is peaceful, there might be new leader or old leader stayed big, that leader is going be target again. Woden and me were too far and separated by sea and hilly/mountainous center, so we couldn't play a military role there until borders of players from west and east are touching each other and it is almost happening now with my new settler who shall found city bordering with TheArchduke. Speaking of TheArchduke, he seemingly have the patent to join 2 vs 1 war at side of 2 players. So I am sending him declaration of friendship next turn since I am bordering with him soon. So I can concentrate on Woden for 30 turns and don't need worry about double Great General boosted units attacking me from flank. I did send oledavy declaration of friendship offer this turn, I don't want him having a bad idea if I already sent declaration of friendship to TheArchduke now, since TheArchduke can accept it already this turn since he plays next me. I noticed this because I did sent them previous declaration of friendship at same turn and TheArchduke's declaration of friendship did end one turn earlier then oledavy. oledavy proved be good ally again, he offered 4 gold per turn in exchange of my silver resource which I do accept.
Maybe oledavy has amenities trouble by warring many times, he just have two amenities of his own. Lucky for oledavy then if he was indeed suffering a amenities problem since I did offer silver to Singaboy earlier and he rejected. In total oledavy is currently supplying me 10 gold per turn if you also counts his loan several turns ago. Maybe I can somehow convince oledavy to sign peace with TheArchduke and has his sights upon new Woden's city of Chen which is unwalled, oledavy can do what he want with horses there (capturing or razing, I don't care), since all units of Woden are likely going busy with mine.
I shall post my plan against Woden in next posts, now just wrap up what happened in this turn.
I almost forgot it, but I am in war with Zanzibar. I swapped my policies:
I really need to keep conscription in play with so many advanced units in my army and same time keeping my gold per turn high. I swapped away trade confederation which do hurt me in science and culture, but I need more builders again. I can chop each one from St. Petersburg and Vilnius, since Toronto and new settled cities still have some rain forests to chop and I need to chop walls in Toronto and my newly settled city for safety when war breaks out, not sure whether I can put limes in slot after 4 turns when, civil service is finished (perfect timing turn 114!). I really need 6 slot policy card which I shall get with monarchy when divine right civic is finished, I shall research that civic after civil service and it shall be roughly 4/5 turns too thanks my two built temples. I need more gold now too, so raid to pillage Zanzibar tiles, this turn I didn't do it yet because I still needed to deal with some pesky crossbowman and other units from Zanzibar. I already attacked Zanzibar city itself with one knight with support of ram, its wall power is halved already. So I am confident that I can finish Zanzibar off before turn 114 and I shall try save pillage farm tiles as last action around Zanzibar so my knights get healed and can participate into war against Woden.
And here my usual empire overview.
Lurkers, fasten your seat belt, since it is going be rough ride, VERY ROUGH. It shall result in me steering to victory or crash against Woden's Chinese Great Wall.
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Really appreciate these updates, Alhambram.
June 12th, 2017, 10:02
(This post was last modified: June 12th, 2017, 10:08 by Alhambram.)
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Still not many details, but this is a sketch of my plan to attack Woden. Not 100% sure that this happens, I might change plan slightly or greatly depending what happens next 4 turns.
I am realistic: I won't steamroll Woden, defender is stronger in civilization 6 then attacker and on top of that Woden is several tech and civic further than me.
So I pick one important goal for myself: raze Jungle Cruise, that is my biggest desire. After that I can resettle that spot, there are two reasons for me to raze and resettle:
I am having hard time imagining Woden cede Jungle Cruise since it is his second city, and another reason is that I dislike spot where encampment is located. In my new city I shall toss it down at northern site in direction of Main Street.
I shall if possible defend my cities to death, it is possible that Woden want grab initiative by attacking Desertgrad or Toronto (more likely Toronto since it still lacks wall) while my main army is still around Zanzibar. I am leaving behind few strong units or upgrade ancient/classical units already at cities as Desertgrad or yet to founded city into medieval units. Currently I left out professional army in favor of raid, so I need to get professional army back after 4 turns when I again can make civic swap. At next swap I don't have choice but leave conscription out in favor of both professional army and raid. I shall try get divine right as fast as possible so that I can have 6 policy cards with monarchy.
Having my main army located at Zanzibar also offers me a rare advantage, I can choose out 5 cities of Woden to attack with. But more deeper in Woden's territory likely mean death of my main army, knights or not. So I am moving my main army to west firstly to make attack on his capital main street likely, but then I shall turn it southwest. By moving my main army in that direction, I am also protecting Toronto at same time for a while. Then I shall raze Jungle Cruise, even if it costs many units, I really want that city be gone. I did invest into religion in that city and my religion is majority there and they shall be gone when I raze Jungle Cruise. But oh well they have to become martyr's then for greater good of my empire and I shall lose 2 gold per turn of current 20. After Jungle Cruise razing if my army is still in good condition, then I can optionally capture Nan Madol, but I won't think about it too much now.
While my main army is busy I am sending 3 knights for a mission: If Woden's city small world don't get walls yet (maybe Woden shall put Great Engineer here?), then I shall raze it. Then one knight goes to splash mountain to pillage holy site to slow down his likely planned wonder Mahabodhi Temple, other two knights are crossing over inland sea to avoid getting in range of city walls which can shoot my knights. Once embarked at other side, I need to see which city at northern side of Woden has yet to build wall, if one or both not then razing time otherwise pillaging time. Optional nab barb camp if it is still there (I expect Woden do it before my knights arrive).
Well as you can see I am planning many pillaging and razing. I have followed Woden's development since turn 13 and it almost breaks my heart to destroy fine work what he did with China civilization. It is really impressive to see all of wonders together, but unfortunately I want to win this PBEM and I shall have Woden's cities become a footnote of PBEM 2 history book if all goes right for me.
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(June 12th, 2017, 08:51)Commodore Wrote: Really appreciate these updates, Alhambram.
+1!
EitB 25 - Perpentach
Occasional mapmaker
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Turn 111:
Let's start with bad news:
Woden advanced to Renaissance era! Without doubt it is gunpowder, I have clear view on his encampment from Desertgrad and he already completed armory for a while.
Does that mean that Woden is going mass produce muskets and I am facing doom? Not yet, because:
Woden still lacks niter resource and I know where it is since Woden purchased it. If he want improve niter before I declare him war, he needs have his builder at forest north of niter tile before turn 114. Otherwise I shall occupy it with double promoted swordsman. Currently I don't see builder from Woden yet, but I shall keep it in eye.
I don't know about possible other niter locations at north of his core, but Woden did have military engineering for a while and yet didn't hook up niter which oledavy did. But if I recalled oledavy's encampment was pillaged at turn 109 and it turned out be his only encampment, ouch! So he is delayed in getting gunpowder. Just this turn I checked and saw that TheArchduke also got his encampment pillaged, so oledavy got his little revenge, but TheArchduke still have more encampments left. The war in east is a bloody one with both players ripping each other apart as referenced in domination score. My domination score did decrease this turn quite too due many knights in yellow health zone, but with raid policy card my knights can pillage farms for full health again and thankfully Zanzibar tossed down quite amount of them. I had to pillage one of farms already, one of knights got roughly 1/3 of life left.
Situation around Zanzibar:
Now I am facing a dilemma: I can raze Zanzibar next turn already, but then not all tiles got pillaged and not all of my knights shall have full health before war against Woden. So I shall raze Zanzibar at turn 113, but that means that Woden got one extra turn of increased gold from Zanzibar and he currently have 44 gold per turn thanks his commercial districts and he have 51 gold in treasury. To upgrade swordsman to musketman you need 235 gold I think, so Woden is going be very close it and there is barb camp north of Main Street which mean 50 gold free for Woden. This is going be very tight one, shall I manage prevent Woden getting musketman or shall I face one or more musketman and increased defenses in all of Woden's cities? If I prevent him getting enough gold and niter to upgrade, but maybe Woden manages to get one turn niter and that is all what he needs to start building musketman in Jungle Cruise and that is his only encampment which means only place to build musketman with one niter. So it is race against clock for me to raze Jungle Cruise to prevent Woden getting musketman.
I am sweating and shivering, not only from slight fear but mainly from excitement to play against such opponent under such conditions with all odds against me, it is really more fun to play against human players than against AI.
One of reasons that I am bit optimistic, I am fairly sure that Woden don't get inspirations from civil service, divine right and reformed church through normal way, which I do got all inspirations. So we might get both civics at same time. I just got inspiration for divine right this turn by completing temple in Astrakhan. I started to build Mahabodhi Temple now, 22 turns because I had to sacrifice 1f/3p tile to able build it. I did chop for builder in St. Petersburg and in both St. Petersburg and Vilnius builders shall be completed with 5 charges next turn. I found out that you can purchase mosque with faith which I couldn't do with shrine or temple, so at turn 113 I am able to purchase mosque for 340 faith. Quite expensive but soon when I got theocracy government from reformed church, my faith output shall explode insanely if I use scripture and simultaneum policy cards.
So while warring with Woden, I shall keep purchasing apostles and send them all to eastern players. oledavy agreed with declaration of friendship, so 30 turns NAP. I just sent offer of friendship to TheArchduke this turn and I shall see whether he shall accept. Maybe my high domination score might persuade him to do that. Second step is producing trader in Rostov after completion of commercial district. I shall send trader from Vilnius to Helice and if possible deeper in TheArchduke's lands to create routes for apostles. However I likely need to protect trade route from Woden's aggression, that is yet another challenge I need to overcome.
Next turn pillage fest around Zanzibar and turn 113 raze Zanzibar and put all units in positions for the inevitable.
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Why wouldn't you keep Zanzibar?
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