Dave Fires Up The Epstein Drive [Japan]

[oledavy]

Turn 70

Okay, let's see if I can't right the ship and begin to address some of the problems that have cropped up in the last few turns. 

First off, 10 turns have passed, so I can offer CFCJesterfool peace. 



I don't see a compelling reason to keep the war going. I would rather remove one variable from the equation. 

As an aside, you definitely can make peace with a Civ's suzerain - as I was able to sign a peace treaty with Hong Kong well before this turn. I'm not sure what's up with that, and it feels really broken to me. 

This turn, I accumulated enough faith for my second library. 



This brings me to the lead in science, albeit only .5 science above Woden. Save Singaboy though, the others are really dragging. Now, my economic priority is getting monuments up to make my culture more competitive. Singaboy's culture continues to grow by leaps and bounds, and is about to hit 20. 

He's also running Strategos: 



I sense things may get very interesting in the west very soon. Singaboy may have an axe to grind and be looking to score a quick win through overruning the Vikings or the English. 

On another note, with CFCJesterfool running Inspiration, it looks like there could be quite a competition over the next GS. For my part, I'm content to wait for the next one to pop up, hopefully another medieval one. With any luck, I will get the Eureaka for Education in both my Civ6 PBEM games. I want to get education about the time I have enough faith for my first university. 

I continue to be fairly happy with my game situation, but there are a few issues and competing priorities I do need to work out. 



First up, I am really interested in continuing to pursue a 'tall' strategy this game. Given the lack of immediate competition over land, and the long-term benefits that accrue from having early monuments/granaries, I think throwing up infrastructure early is strong. I just have not figured out yet to what extent I want to prioritize this relative to settling the islands to my south and east. 

In the east, I thought I could land southwest of the archer and clear it out, using my promotion and Divine Wind to overpower it. However, this advantage was not enough to overcome the advantage of them having the first shot, and while I could have killed it in two more turns, there was a not insignificant possibility that the scout would kill my archer in turn. With that in mind, I've adopted a more round-about plan to settle the island. I'm going to work the settler all the way around the peninsula, continuing to cover it with the galley, then land it and the archer on the city tile. My archer can definitely survive another archer attack, so, unless there is another unit hiding to the northeast, I should be fine. 

Still, this is riskier than I wanted it to be, and in case I change my mind before tomorrow morning, I moved my settler in such a way that I can just take the easy city settle on my home island south of Ganymede in two turns. This is a less risky option, but the city just isn't as good. 

If I had the last bunch of turns to do over again, I would have pumped out another warrior and archer. I just really need more units at the moment to clear off these islands, and these barb archers are extremely annoying. 

My second settler, I've been slow-building in Ceres. I have been sitting the builder on the stone, ready to harvest, for the last four turns. However, since the settler is waiting on the warrior from the west to escort it, there was no point (btw, another example of how I could have settled these cities sooner if I cranked out a couple more units first). At the very least, however, this landing and city-settlement on the southern island should go off without a hitch. Saving the harvest will also allow me to get the maximum multiplied chop overflow - almost certainly into a monument. 

The general plan at the moment is to wrap up the current round of infrastructure, and when Drama and Poetry completes, swap into Agoge and Ilkum. This will allow me to get a couple builders out so I can get some mines for the Apprenticeship Eureka, and give me enough military to start clearing off these islands - also giving me a firm claim on the eastern island in case the vikings begin making moves. 

After that, I'll be torn between infrastructure and settlers. I will say, there is a slight temptation to not bother with putting land units onto these islands at all, but I really probably need to. The barb camps will give gold and killing a couple more barbs will give me the BW eureka, so it won't be without its economic benefits. I just need a Watermill in Ganymede ASAP for the Construction eureka, and a granary, etc....but I only have so many cogs. By trying to do everything I will not succeed at anything, but it is hard to know what the optimal prioritization of builds should be right now.

My other approaching debate is what Callisto's second district, on the current stone location, should be. I originally was planning on a Holy Site, but I've since started considering a Commercial Hub (discounted courtesy of Spain), or a Theatre District. The extra 8 faith per turn wouldn't help me much in the short term, while the other ones would. Then again, that faith will be helpful down the road, and will go a long way towards helping me save the nearly 1,500 faith I need to buy three universities. 

At any rate, a lot to mull over. I'll have more time to do so tomorrow, but if anyone ded-lurking me has thoughts, I welcome your input.

[oledavy]

Turn 71

Well, I had my mind made up for me on a couple of points between turns. 



The barbs moved their archer southwest, cutting me off from safely traversing the southern route to my desired city-site. 

Good thing I can settle the back-up location without having had wasted any time, but this still stings. My next priority is definitely going to be cramming out six more units, enough to get me the Mercenaries bonus and secure control of the arc of three islands to my south, southeast, and east. 

My fourth city will be settled next turn (72), my 5th will be settled about 5 turns after that. I harvested the second settler to completion this turn, and embarked it along with a warrior, a galley, and my missionary towards the island to my south. 

I spent awhile mulling over what to put the overflow in. After a bit of thought, though, I chose a builder. I'm going to skip using Corvee, as I actually don't really need many improvements at this point - just a couple mines for the Apprenticeship bonus. 

Finally, I've decided on a CH for my second district from Callisto. In addition to needing two CH's for Eureka's down the road, I really need the gold at this point. While I'm holding my head above water, my GPT is notably behind that of some of my peers. 

Interesting developments abroad. 



Archduke finally completed a couple Royal Navy Dockyards. Will we see a fight between his admiral-led navy and Singaboy's general-led army? Only time will tell. Singaboy settled his 6th city this turn, and Jpper007 his 5th. Woden gained another couple SPT, but I continue to compare very favorably against the rest of the field. I am starting to drag in culture though. Hopefully completing three monuments over the next few turns will set me right there. 

Woden made peace with La Venta. CFCJesterfool refused to make peace with me. I can't say I'm too surprised, but it means I do need to be wary of a counterstrike from the south. His military has been holding steady for awhile now though, so I'm not too worried. My military is weakest in the game, but I have a bunch of wounded units at the moment, and no immediate military threat. 

Singaboy, however, has a military nearly 300 power strong. 

I'm strongly considering beelining Navigation after Apprenticeship and cramming out as many caravels as fast as I can. It's worth noting they'll take my city defenses from 15 to 40, making me all but impregnable to any ancient/classical/medieval assault. I don't think, however, I will be able to get two harbors in time for Navigation's Eureka. I just can't do it all, and this is the point in the game where I need to start making choices. 

Still, not too long until Natural Philosophy pushes me up to nearly 40 SPT 

[BRickAstley]

Loving the reports davy.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

Bummer about the barbarians, but I think this reinforces your need to crank out a small army. Not only do you get the boost for mercenaries (worth a hefty amount of culture in itself), but you obviously need to clean out the barbarians on those islands for proper civilized people to live there (go full conquistador on those hapless natives!), plus you can use the units to reinforce your claims to the islands in case the Vikings or Spaniards try to sneak anything up there. To top it off, you'll be a less appealing target, which is not insignificant when you have one neighbor at war with you already and another with a civ built for early naval wars. I think a military build-up to send a few expeditionary forces to the islands is warranted.

Regarding your tech situation, I think I strongly approve of the caravel beeline. You have a science advantage, which at the moment is your only real edge over your rivals, so I like putting it to use. Galleys and quads don't stand up well to caravels, so a small fleet of those will make you both unassailable and open up any manner of opportunistic strikes to slow down your rivals until they get caravels of their own.

I'm a little concerned about hte international situation. Singaboy is apparently gearing up for an early war, which I wouldn't mind except that his civ's lead in other categories make me worry that he could win it. Another reason to have caravels, because they could give you the flexibility to intervene in foreign conflicts if Singa is overrunning the Vikings or Archduke or whoever his local rivals are (I'm still not clear where he and Archduke are located on the map). Just more reason to push expansion, I guess - clear out the barbarians, grab those islands, and you should have a really solid base to build upwards in peace, protected by the Divine Wind and Defender of the Faith (+15 defending your city's coasts! Basically unassailable for most of the game!).

[oledavy]

Turn 72

@Brick, thank you very much

@Chevalier

Excellent arguments, I don't have the time at the moment to respond to each one point by point, but rest assured, I think you offer excellent advice and I am taking it to heart. 



Brazil completed something between turns and adopted Inspiration, they are gunning hard for that second GS. Looks like I will definitely have to settle for the second one. 

CFCJesterfool made peace with me, accepting my deal, I guess he didn't see it last turn? 



Founded Galatea in my backup location this turn. Compared to my other cities, it it quite vulnerable to being boated, so it will bear keeping an eye on. While it's long-term growth potential isn't that great, it does at least have some pretty great tiles in the first two rings for a quick start up. 
All my cities are set to grow soon. The problem? I counted how much population Singaboy has in his non-capital cities this turn. 18. I have 7 

I think he captured Valletta at Size 5 or so, a far cry from the desert waste that is La Venta. If it weren't for that CS, his pop would be about on par with Woden. Still ahead of me, but easily explainable by his more expansion focused start. I'm starting to get really ancy about my chances in this game, as being both ahead on development and militarily ascendant makes it unlikely the Germans will be brought down anytime soon. I can only hope Archduke and Woden put that diplomacy thread to good use and....

Well.....

I suppose I could raise it. 

Here goes nothing.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

Something really has to be done about Germany sooner rather than later. Not only do they apparently lead in most major categories, but look at your core.

It's a beautiful, closely-packed soon-to-be urban sprawl.

Now imagine that same setup, but with Hansas everywhere.

Basically, I think Frederick is basically guaranteed to become a production monster once he hits the medieval era. So far he can't have been focusing on infrastructure (not with a military and expansion rate like that), but once he does he's going to become a monster. Japan is probably safe from conquest thanks to DW/DOTF, but that won't be much comfort if the Teutonic hordes overrun everyone else.

Sorry, I'm a natural pessimist. I see myself as mostly valuable in countering your optimism, so if you're not optimistic I don't bring much to the table here. :P

[oledavy]

Something really has to be done about Germany sooner rather than later. Not only do they apparently lead in most major categories, but look at your core.

It's a beautiful, closely-packed soon-to-be urban sprawl.

Now imagine that same setup, but with Hansas everywhere.

Basically, I think Frederick is basically guaranteed to become a production monster once he hits the medieval era. So far he can't have been focusing on infrastructure (not with a military and expansion rate like that), but once he does he's going to become a monster. Japan is probably safe from conquest thanks to DW/DOTF, but that won't be much comfort if the Teutonic hordes overrun everyone else.

Sorry, I'm a natural pessimist. I see myself as mostly valuable in countering your optimism, so if you're not optimistic I don't bring much to the table here. :P

To be honest, I think you're right. Singaboy will be hard pressed to lose from this position.

Still, nothing gained in being glum, and his neighbors are ostensibly rational actors who should see the threat he poses and work to stop him before he runs away with things. I might continue to prod in the diplo thread, my last attempt didn't seem to have the desired effect. 

At any rate, Jpper007 got a turn to me this morning before I left for work, so we got two in today. This last one was a frustrating one though, but more on that in a moment. 

Turns 73-74



Drama and Poetry in, time for a new government. 



About eight turns to Natural Philosophy. That's just enough time to crank out 4 warriors and 2 archers, getting me the Mercenaries and Machinery benefit. 

As an aside, it's worth noting just how great archers are on maps like this versus ancient naval units - provided the naval units can't first strike you out of the fog. I say this as a result of my experience with the barb archers on the islands around me. With narrow belts of navigable water, lots of cliffs blocking landing, combined with slow movement over water and the lack of a two-range naval ranged unit, a well positioned archer can wreak havoc on units attempting to pass by. Indeed, I would be having little difficulty settling these islands with my shoestring military were the barb units warriors, slingers, or heck, even horsemen. But....they had to spawn archers. Which brings us to the tragedy of this latest turn. 



This is after I moved so it is probably not immediately clear. Woden showed up with a galley, forcing me into an impossible situation. I had planned to continue moving my warrior (who took a shot from the archer), to the tile one east of my galley to cover the landing next turn. The galley was going to sit on him this turn to save him from being killed by the archer, and my settler was going to sit to the west. Ironically, this is a case where I need an additional galley instead of an additional land unit. However, I thought I would only need one, and so my nearest other galley was currently in dry dock in Ceres. With no other choice available to me, I moved the warrior back north, and moved the galley to cover the settler. Now Woden can't snipe it. 

This could all play out in a variety of ways. My missionary will defog one of the tiles south of the landing zone next turn, if its clear, I'll put the settler ashore. Provided the barb spear doesn't leave the camp, I can move him to the city site without any difficulty, no harm except to my blood pressure. If the spear moves....then things get a whole lot more interesting. 

I should have had a second galley here. And I should have built a couple more military units around t60 or so. But, c'est la vie. I have nothing I can do but try to ride out this awkwardness now. 

In better news, I threw down my commercial hub this turn! With Callisto's growing hammer potential, courtesy of new mines and apprenticeship, I should be able to build it in 6/7 turns.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

That is a bummer. :/ But if everything went your way all the time there'd be no need to play the game! 

It looks like the main problem is insufficient force to meet all requirements. Not a big surprise, since this is the first multiplayer Islands game, so players are feeling out how much navy they need still. 

If you ever find the time, could we get an overview of the other players? Where everyone stands in terms of empire score, military, science, culture, etc. would be very nice to evaluate the current state of the game!

[oledavy]

That is a bummer. :/ But if everything went your way all the time there'd be no need to play the game! 

It looks like the main problem is insufficient force to meet all requirements. Not a big surprise, since this is the first multiplayer Islands game, so players are feeling out how much navy they need still. 

If you ever find the time, could we get an overview of the other players? Where everyone stands in terms of empire score, military, science, culture, etc. would be very nice to evaluate the current state of the game!

I'll see what I can do. I doubt I'll have time before I go on vacation. But, next weekend, it's a firm possibility. 

In the interim: 

Turns 75-76

Sometimes, the barb spears decide not to move out and screw you. 





I actually think, btw, I'm going to name all the cities on a given landmass after moons of the same planet/asteroids in the belt. With that in mind, I think my home continent will be "Jupiter," and I'll rename the cities on it after Jovian moons. This island will be "The Belt" (because of its snakey shape), and this city will end up being the new Ceres. 

Abroad, the countdown to our doom has begun. 



I will definitely say, the increase in settler cost has definitely rebalanced the game to encourage more districts early, which most of the players here seem to have realized. Singaboy seems to be in infrastructure mode right now, finishing a CH last turn and his first Hansas this turn.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

my god, look at all those hills! And with a marsh rice to grow! What a beautiful city that is.

I actually think that comebacks might be more viable in this version of Civ. I'm still trying to figure out how Alhambram did it, but he was languishing in the bottom of the pack ~Turns 50-80, and then catapulted himself to dominance from there. He may have been helped by Woden's somewhat hapless military tactics (he clearly underestimated the importance of civil engineering, now Steel), but even so, it was an impressive change in his game from an obvious also-ran to stunning victor.

So we're not doomed yet...although Singaboy has shown himself to be a very sharp tactician, too. Too bad he couldn't be overrun with barbarians again to start this game, slow him down a little.