[Spoilers] The games they are a changin' - Ichabod Civ 6 PBEM 3 as England

[Ichabod]

I think we might want 1 or 2 encampments built at strategic points. Walls are probably sufficient for barbarians, but if you see any points that would do well with an encampment then we might want to lock in the cost now. I think locking in a campus at Hard Rain between the bananas is also a good idea. Geneva is going to give all our campus districts +2 science and that spot would get an additional +2 from the jungle tiles it borders.

I agree about that Campus and the Encampments. The problem is gold, since we'd need to buy that tile for Hard Rain and buy a tile for the Encampment (as all our second ring tiles are either on the Capital, that can't build a second district, or have a resource in it). Oh, now I realize that you may be referring to the tile already within our borders for the Campus. We could very well do that, yeah. Let me think.

I'm considering chopping those jungles in Hard Rain to get that city to size 10 for the Eureka it gives. So, building the Campus on that tile, between the 2 bananas, won't lose us that much science on the long run, since we would chop everything anyway. Also, considering this, I don't want to build Settlers on Hard Rain and getting housing there would help. It might be a pipe dream, though, considering our amenity situation and the timing of that Civic. One of the builders currently in production will build 2 plantations there, anyway.

Speaking of builders, I was thinking of doing the following with them:

*Improve copper in Capital, improve both wheats in Capital.
*Improve a plains mine in Capital (for the Eureka for Apprenticeship), improve both bananas in Hard Rain.

By doing this, we wouldn't be able to chop the jungle in Hard Rain, which I think is a big waste. Ideally, I'd also prefer to build the third mine anywhere but the Capital, as the Capital has enough tiles improved to work.

What could we do, considering all this?

Perhaps forgoing one of the wheat farms and using the extra charge to chop the jungle? The Capital can't grow that much, anyway, due to luxury reasons. perhaps one farm is enough for now?

Perhaps we forgo one banana plantation and one wheat farm. This way, we could use the builders to chop the forest 2W of Hard Rain and build a mine there (it's the next tile we'll get on our borders, according to the tile picker -> I need to check how long it's supposed to take). This will speed up the Campus significantly, and we'll have the third needed mine in a way better place than the Capital. I quite like this idea, since that Campus would generate quite a bit of science, considering we are set to ally with Geneva (we get a new envoy next turn, due to the TR quest + another one when finishing Mysticism, which will be soon, when we change policies for the horse card - so, in about 5 turns).

Another option is to go for a third builder in the Capital, so that we can have our cake and eat it too (to quote Bob Dylan). I think we could do without it, but it's an option, nonetheless.

[pindicator]

Yeah, I was referring to the tile beside the city and between the two bananas. I figured we would eventually chop all the non-banana jungle tiles but even after that location would still give +1 for jungle adjacency and only need a single bordering district after to get it back up to +2

I'm considering chopping those jungles in Hard Rain to get that city to size 10 for the Eureka it gives. So, building the Campus on that tile, between the 2 bananas, won't lose us that much science on the long run, since we would chop everything anyway. Also, considering this, I don't want to build Settlers on Hard Rain and getting housing there would help. It might be a pipe dream, though, considering our amenity situation and the timing of that Civic. One of the builders currently in production will build 2 plantations there, anyway.

Now that is an interesting idea; I've never thought to boost food at the very end by chopping jungle. My thought before was that any city reaching that 10 pop in time would need a lot of farmland to get the housing and food needed. But do you know if the food you get from jungle chops circumvents the good penalty due to lack of housing? If the chopped food isn't constrained by housing modifiers that could be a good way to boost the city right before the end.

Another thing we could consider is a late run at building Hanging Gardens. But I don't know if we have a great spot for attempting that wonder at.

Speaking of builders, I was thinking of doing the following with them:

*Improve copper in Capital, improve both wheats in Capital.
*Improve a plains mine in Capital (for the Eureka for Apprenticeship), improve both bananas in Hard Rain.

By doing this, we wouldn't be able to chop the jungle in Hard Rain, which I think is a big waste.

I like the builder plan.

I'm not sure that the chop is that clear of a waste, however. If I have our tech situation correct, we're currently at 10 techs and 7 civics. So forest chops right now are 45 cogs, and jungle are 22 food and cogs. Districts should also cost 76 to build. Both chops and districts increase with the same formula, but districts have a base value of 60 and chops have a base gain of 20, so the cost increases 3x the speed (or 6x if you don't count the food).

To put that a different way, the amount we gain by chopping now (22), is less than the increased cost of districts after 3 techs (103 - 76 = 27), and the same amount of cogs you get from chopping jungle in 3 techs (27). Then also take into account that the act of chopping also costs 1/3 of a builder, which the next builder to finish costs 58 / 1.3 = 45 cogs, so 15 cogs per charge. Of course that evaluation changes is you also value the food, but we're already working every 3+ yield tile in that city, so until we can lay down some farms or gain more tiles food doesn't really do much there. (And I suppose we should also consider how far into the future we plan on finishing the campus!)

It may be worth delaying 1 of the banana plantations to chop the jungle out. If you think the hammers are worth the delay in gold.

Perhaps we forgo one banana plantation and one wheat farm. This way, we could use the builders to chop the forest 2W of Hard Rain and build a mine there (it's the next tile we'll get on our borders, according to the tile picker -> I need to check how long it's supposed to take). This will speed up the Campus significantly, and we'll have the third needed mine in a way better place than the Capital. I quite like this idea, since that Campus would generate quite a bit of science, considering we are set to ally with Geneva (we get a new envoy next turn, due to the TR quest + another one when finishing Mysticism, which will be soon, when we change policies for the horse card - so, in about 5 turns).

Another option is to go for a third builder in the Capital, so that we can have our cake and eat it too (to quote Bob Dylan). I think we could do without it, but it's an option, nonetheless.

I like that plan of chopping and mining at Hard Rain. That city does need more improved tiles and more production. I don't think there's any reason to rush that forest chop until we actually are building the campus, so a 3rd builder at the capital does make sense. Besides, if we can't grow onto new tiles then improving the ones we do have makes some sense.

[Ichabod]

We got two Eurekas on turn 58, Engineering (building walls) and Currency (TR to Geneva, for 3G 2Sci per turn, which awarded an envoy). We are likely going to get all Eurekas from Classical and Medieval techs, between doing actual stuff and the first GSci avaiable. The Eurekas we are likely to get with the GSci are Military Engineering, Castles and Shipbuilding (as we'll have the other ones). Pretty meh, I'd say, as we'd likely get all those before we need to finish those techs. Here's a question, what happens if we decide not to take the avaiable GS? Probably not worth it.

Inspirations are a different problem, where we are probably going to lose a lot of them. Right now, I'm teching Games and Recreations, while not planning to get the Inspiration of building a Wonder. It'd take too long. Better to have the option to change civics sooner, rather than later.



Kaiser is moving to the "planned spot", near Preslav. If he just wanted to be annoying, he could settle on top of the iron, for an unpillageable source and a city we wouldn't want to keep. But I get the feeling he'll settle the good city. Well, I won't complain, certainly.



Seven turn until DotF, which is quite a bit. I don't remember if Great People are born with full movement or if they need to wait a turn. If they need to wait a turn before moving, we get yet more time to occupy the HS and block the religion from spawning.



Meanwhile, we have our first source of Horses. As you can see, we only need 3 more turns to get the second one and I don't see how anyone can block us from it. How much will forest chops give us with 12 techs researched (we currently have 11 after finishing currency + The Wheel from the copper mine)? If I'm right, we'll get 50 production. 50 * 1,75 = more than 80, which means we can chop a horseman instantly! Is that right? Am I dreaming that chops get the production bonuses? Having a horseman ready, with full movement, 3 turns from now is really all we need! It's so great that we won't even delay the warrior (though he'll be a bit late for the actual attack).

Anyway, hopefully I'm not making any mistakes in this calculations.

I have some more plans brewing, which involve attacking Yerevan as soon as possible. That city alone will give us 3 Eurekas (sailing, Celestial Navigation - as it has 2 crabs improved - and Feudalism - this one coupled with some other farms) and I think we can't delay capturing it. Now that I know we can 1t chop a horseman, I think we need to use the builder to get one of those beauties on Changing of the Guards. We have to act quick, while the city still hasn't got walls up. Getting a size 6 city is just so much more powerful to our snowball than anything else. Districts and buildings pale in comparision.

Considering this, I think starting the third builder in Capital is right. Might as well use the Civic card we have in place, as we'll certainly switch it out when we switch to the Cavalry card. This way, we can get farms, plantations, mines and chops. The only thing left to decide is if we use the chop in Hard Rain for the District or another horseman. It depends on how things are looking in Yerevan, I guess. I just don't see how we can pass the opportunity of another free city, while we have so much boosts for military production.

[pindicator]

Those calculations are correct!  The only small detail is that I believe we lose any overflow hammers when you chop a unit to completion, but you also get to use the unit the same turn.

Very much agree with an extra builder for the purposes of chopping out horsemen now. These guys will help us not only against Yerevan and Kaiser, but will quickly be able to diploy against Suboptimal in the east. I'd use the builder to chop as many as possible out.

Maybe we should consider an encampment just to get Great General points going. After the horsemen chopping, of course.

Also, Great People can move the turn they're recruited.

[pindicator]

And just to be safe, DO NOT CHOP AT MASTER OF WAR. While the city is under occupation it gets a production malus of 50%

[pindicator]

And just to be safe, DO NOT CHOP AT MASTER OF WAR. While the city is under occupation it gets a production malus of 50%

This actually got me thinking. We should probably be building a warrior or archer at Master of War while we're running the policy card that boosts their production. If the occupation malus is an additive -50% (and I'd bet it is) then our production of melee and ranged is effectively double at the city.

But it's probably too late for that as I know we'll be swapping to mounted unit policy soon and the city has a low production anyway.

[Ichabod]

And just to be safe, DO NOT CHOP AT MASTER OF WAR. While the city is under occupation it gets a production malus of 50%

That's nice to know. I wonder if chopped food gets the penalties. My guess is that it doesn't, since I've seen cities growing to housing cap with a chop, which would likely need a whole lot of food.

And just to be safe, DO NOT CHOP AT MASTER OF WAR. While the city is under occupation it gets a production malus of 50%

This actually got me thinking.  We should probably be building a warrior or archer at Master of War while we're running the policy card that boosts their production. If the occupation malus is an additive -50% (and I'd bet it is) then our production of melee and ranged is effectively double at the city.

But it's probably too late for that as I know we'll be swapping to mounted unit policy soon and the city has a low production anyway.

I changed Masters of War to a Commercial Hub this past turn. It's going slowly, but I think it's more useful than the Walls. A warrior would take 16 turns, with the card, so it's hardly very helpful. 

Anyway, some interesting stuff this past turn, regarding Kaiser and Suboptimal.



That's two upgrades from past turn, another archer and a sword. This means something, without a doubt. I wonder if Suboptimal just wants to show us that he's not a soft target or if he's planning something. If he is planning, why upgrade the units on the vision of our scout? He loses the surprise factor. I think his reasons are defensive, but he seems to be a smart guy and I'm certain he'll use his army to attack us, if he sees the opportunity.



That warrior from Suboptimal is very intelligently placed, blocking one of the few spots where we can move and attack Kikyo with a ranged unit. That's deliberate, i'm sure, so we see some cold war moves by him. This makes me think the Sword upgrade from Suboptimal means he'll try to gift the Iron to Kaiser as of next turn, to allow for a Sword upgrade (so, Suboptimal, not wanting to get caught pants down, did a preventive sword upgrade).

Notice the warrior and builder from Kaiser. The builder chopped the forest that was in that tile, so I'm guessing Kaiser chopped that warrior to completion. It's likely that the warrior moved to that tile this turn, because he doesn't have the fortify symbol (which he would have, if the unit moved on the previous turn, coupled with the builder). Also, Kaiser finished a settler, started a shrine and finished a builder, he didn't have that much production to also finish a warrior. Now, here's the question: did he finish that warrior as a last stand unit or does he have a plan to upgrade it to a sword?

Kaiser currently has 6 techs. Yes, just 6! We know for sure what 5 of those are:



Kaiser has Astrology (Holy Site), AH and Archery (archers) and mining and BW (encampment). I believe he also has Pottery, as I don't think he would wait that much for it. That's a very low number of techs, I have to say. He probably left a whole bunch of techs at 50%, waiting for Eurekas. So, it begs the question: did he go for IW without the Eureka or is he waiting for it? I don't know how to answer that. A sword upgrade would be very damaging, and I'm sure Suboptimal is trying to help on that department, with the potentially gifted iron.

Considering Kaiser went for a settler while I was in a hot war against him leads me to believe he was thinking about long term survival. In that case, he might have wanted to save his science, waiting for the Eureka. Apparently, Kaiser was going for that spot that Suboptimal took, and that spot had a readily avaiable Iron he could mine. Now, he's going for that other spot, near Preslav, that also has Iron. Is he thinking about sending the builder there for the mine? Perhaps... Again, this builder makes no sense when considering a short term desperate defense. His chops are terrible, getting only 25 hammers from his 6 techs (nevermind, just realized he has better chops from his better cultural position, I think he has 7 civics). Even then, the builder doesn't make much sense, when you could be building units with 50% bonus.

Well, if he's going to upgrade or not on the next few turns, we won't change our plans. If we see the upgrade, we wait for more units to heal and the second horseman to arrive. If he does not upgrade, we go forward with the horseman and archers. It's simple, and we'll know for sure when it happens (we also will know when exactly he got the next tech, so we have another warning).

Suboptimal warrior makes an attack a bit more difficult to execute. My current plan is to move 3 archers and a warrior in position, the turn before the horse can hit the city. That means moving an archer to each of the marsh tiles (meaning no attacks allowed that turn), one archer to the hill 1W of the wheat, and the warrior to the wheat farm (the horse will be at 1W of the city, EDIT: of Suboptiml's warrior). The only unit able to hit us in those positions is the promoted archer inside the city (the warrior can't move to the marsh unless he's adjacent to it, and in that case, we could attack him before) and, unfortunately, marsh tiles give a defense penalty, so it's a certain >50 hit. Worth noticing that both archers that will do this will have a promotion avaiable to heal and the warrior will have the farm to pillage, if needed.

These movements means we won't hit the city on the first turn of war, but as the only possible hit would have been an archer, that would be healed by the city anyway (as I don't think we'll be able to siege the city, even considering the scout). The following turn, we get 3 archer hits, the warrior hit and the horseman hit. It's very likely that one of the archers will have to retreat/promote, but hopefully it'll be enough to capture the city, in the span of 3 turns or so, once it starts getting damaged and we get some flanking bonuses.

The main thing that can go wrong is if Kaiser finishes an archer from another forest chop on the turn we move in. The archer would have its movement avaiable and could finish one of our units, by double-teaming it. That scenario is pretty worrisome, and we'd likely have to retreat and wait for the second horseman (which will be chopped from Watchtower, by the new builder, and needs 3 turns to reach the stage). That second horseman needs to go that way anyway, considering what Suboptimal is fielding. Let the horses from Changing take Yerevan.

What I'm hoping to see is Kaiser moving the builder in the direction of his new city. That would mean he intends to mine the iron and he's not thinking about chopping around the Capital. Our scout will keep an eye on the situation.



In the end, I decided to move the scout, rather than heal him. I don't mind sacrificing the scout for a turn of siege (or just to soak up an archer attack), so better to get the most info we can from him. Lets see what Kaiser does. He needs to escort the settler all the way, or we can take it next turn. The scout will also reveal where the builder will go next turn.

Hopefully our horseman surprise will catch Kaiser off guard. I don't think we shown enough power to take his Capital this previous turns, so hopefully he will go for a longer term defense. Everything will happen very fast two turns from now -> we get the second horse, we get the horseman and we move him in, all on the same turn. If Kaiser's builder crosses the river, I'm pretty sure is good game for him. Lets hope he goes for it.

[Ichabod]

Our other target is Yerevan. The city has a higher strength than the other CSs due to building galleys already. Right now, I can see 2 archers, that can be taken in the first turn of the war, and that warrior, which is wandering in the jungle and, hopefully, can be left alone until the city is already down. No walls in sight (nor a HS district), no other buildings in sight, so I'm guessing they are building more galleys? One can hope.

It seems to be an easy target, but lets see what happens.

By the way, I think I'll plop down a Commercial Hub 1W of Hard Rain. The city is already size 4, so we can also plop the Campus (hopefully after the chop), and I think there's no better district to be built there.

[Ichabod]

By the way, I wanted to send a warning to Suboptimal saying his units are too close to my borders, meaning he should move that warrior away. But I just couldn't find the option to do it. No idea how Kaiser sent us that warning before... I wonder if he gets more options, considering he's first in turn order? Or am I missing something behind the quirky UI?

[pindicator]

I'm excited to see what our horsemen can do!

There's a good coastal spot northeast of Hard Rain too, but probably can't be settled until our amenity situation gets better