The Backstabbers' Table - PBEM 4 Diplomacy Thread

[Singaboy]

@Archduke
Our NAP lasts until T120. I have noticed the Queen's ambitious navy. Let me reiterate that Germany doesn't have any plans to invade England (notice that I have a NAP with Woden that wouldn't last if I attack England).

I appeal to the mighty English power to not turn their eyes away from the rising sun in the east (or west depending where you prefer to look to). Germany will be more than prepared for a naval invasion from any power and I think, it would be ill advised to start a skirmish in our waters.

Hence, Germany offers an extension to our NAP for yet another 20-30 turns. To put it bluntly, I would be open to an alliance against the power that is fighting me now for a good 20 turns and showing high research and culture. I am sure, an alliance would benefit us both far more than a battle that would wear both of us down while the other powers could rise in our shadows.

[oledavy]

I appeal to the mighty English power to not turn their eyes away from the rising sun in the east 

Don't you think this is getting a little threadbare at this point? Especially considering your SPT has nearly doubled in the last 20 turns (and that's with occupation penalties). 

As an aside though, player to player, kudos on pulling off your invasion. I'm looking forward to seeing how it was planned after the game 

[Japper007]

As an aside though, player to player, kudos on pulling off your invasion. I'm looking forward to seeing how it was planned after the game  

(I asume I'll be able to read up on how you did it it a lot earlier than Oledavy though )

On the subject of my upcoming elimination... I wanted to ask something rule-related, didn't know if it fitted better in the diplo or organizing thread: 

I want to donate the rest of my treasury to Oledavy before I get offed, in return for the gold, units, and resources he has provided me earlier. I wonder if this would fall under "kingmaking"? (which was a pretty, shall we say, divisive issue in earlier pitboss/pbem games...)

[Woden]

IMO, if he sent you gold, units, and/or resources, then you are free to send him your gold as payback. I personally won't consider this "kingmaking", but I am fairly new to PBEMs, so I will refer to others if I am wrong.

[Singaboy]

I would think that whatever oledavy has sent you in gold or gpt (gold per turn) is fair game. If he sent you a resource, it gets a little dicey but say, 4 gpt would be a reasonable amount.
All the other stuff that oledavy invested in this war should not be a reason to pay. I say that because the only reason you are now paying him is due to a potential exit from the game and not some sort of agreement you had (e.g. You send x units for support and I pay y amount of money).

[CFCJesterFool]

I would think that whatever oledavy has sent you in gold or gpt (gold per turn) is fair game. If he sent you a resource, it gets a little dicey but say, 4 gpt would be a reasonable amount.
All the other stuff that oledavy invested in this war should not be a reason to pay. I say that because the only reason you are now paying him is due to a potential exit from the game and not some sort of agreement you had (e.g. You send x units for support and I pay y amount of money).

I agree returning what was given is fair. More than what was given is problematic.

[Singaboy]

If more than what was given in terms of gold and gpt is paid back, it could open a Pandora's box. Imagine, someone amasses 1000gold and then 'donates' it to someone else with a better chance to win the game, it could create a real imbalance.

I am already having trouble with the diplo thread as it is used to give specific instructions about troops etc. I think I imagined something else instead and would say, I prefer the in game diplomacy or a 'hidden' diplomacy via emails. This current version is neither here nor there.

Going forward, I have to say, I really enjoy the Island map setting. Personally I would prefer more space for the Oceans so that Ocean travel etc would be more prominent. And...more importantly, I think I would love the idea of an Always War diplomacy game where there is no diplomacy as everyone is at war with each other (Apologies to get a little off topic here)

[oledavy]

If more than what was given in terms of gold and gpt is paid back, it could open a Pandora's box. Imagine, someone amasses 1000gold and then 'donates' it to someone else with a better chance to win the game, it could create a real imbalance.

I am already having trouble with the diplo thread as it is used to give specific instructions about troops etc. I think I imagined something else instead and would say, I prefer the in game diplomacy or a 'hidden' diplomacy via emails. This current version is neither here nor there.

Going forward, I have to say, I really enjoy the Island map setting. Personally I would prefer more space for the Oceans so that Ocean travel etc would be more prominent. And...more importantly, I think I would love the idea of an Always War diplomacy game where there is no diplomacy as everyone is at war with each other (Apologies to get a little off topic here)

For what its worth, I agree with you. This has been an interesting experiment, but for future games, I think I don't want to play anything but CTON/AI Diplomacy. 

Also agreed on the map. I have loved it thus far. Good job Cornflakes, I really appreciate it 

Regarding Jpper007 giving me his treasury, I think the hypothetical case you highlight is too much of an edge case to really matter. I don't think we need any legislation to prevent it anyway. For what its worth, Japper007's 190 gold approximately equals the sum of the gold I gave him and the resources I sent him at 4gpt. I would argue ex post facto compensation for troop contributions is fine, but it actually doesn't matter in this case (since everything he has is only equal to the gold/resources I sent him), so we can all walk away happy here.

[oledavy]

Hey Archduke, can I borrow your iron for a few turns? I think my deal with Jpper007 comes up in about 6-8 turns (if he doesn't die before then), at which point I'll gift you my source in return. 

Understand if you can't, I'd just love to do a bit of upgrading while I am still in Professional Army.

[TheArchduke]

@ Singaboy

Your military might is tremendous, I am not sure anybody else stands a chance soon anyway.
I do not think I can do a renewed NAP if it means you gonna swallow Oledavy as well.

@ Oledavy

Sure, sent you an offer. Feel free to offer that luxury in return.
Also I would like to offer a Defensive Pact to you as well, against further attacks by other players and if Singaboy moves onto a city of yours, starting at turn 120 when the NAP with Singaboy runs out.

@ Woden

You need more military, if that DP will be off any use to me.

@ Diplomacy thread

I actually enjoy being able to talk a lot more then the sandbox AI style.

That one feels like Bridge to me, if someone explains how the 5 gold for 5 gold or other stuff works (which is diplomacy in code...)