[Spoilers] Suboptimal - Welcome to the Tlachtli of Blunders!

[Cornflakes]

Starting save attached:

[suboptimal]

OK, I’ve removed the spoiler tags from the image to make it easier for discussion (at least, in my head)….there are three founding locations that immediately present themselves.  One note: timelines in this discussion are in a test game situation and do not survive contact with the enemy.

1) Settle in Place

Keeps the wheat first ring, gives the capital a 2/2 tile at a loss of a plains forested hill chop.  Two mountains and a desert hill in the 2nd ring.  Of the three starts it is the highest production one.  With the standard build the 2nd Eagle Warrior would be done around Turn 20 and the settler around Turn 34.  Building a 2nd slinger would push the settler back to Turn 38.  

2) Move NW, settle on Gypsum

Loses the wheat and moves both 2/2 stones to the 2nd ring and gets the 3/1 citrus to the 3nd ring.  Also makes the capital a 2/2/1 tile and gives all units +1 combat strength right off the bat, along with the extra amenity.  Builds get the Eagle Warriors out at one turn later but the Settler is sped up 2-3 turns in both build cases.  

3) Move NW-W, settle between Gypsum and Citrus

Moves the citrus 2nd ring, puts two 2/2 stone 2nd ring and a 2/2 forested hill first ring, along with the gypsum but results in settling on Turn 2.  This gets the warriors out slightly slower and the settler out at the same speed as the settle in place option.  With the info available this is the best food location of the three.  Part of the question of this location is what is north of the citrus.  Those two tiles could be good or they could be meh.

In all three starts I’m probably going 2x Encampment with a Campus to follow if Option #1 is chosen.  The nice thing about Options 2 & 3 is that it allows for a second city at the corner of the river down by the horses.  As of right now I’d be for doing the following:

- Move Eagle Warrior 1W then 1W to get a glimpse of what’s north of the citrus
- Move Settler to Gypsum and found unless something spectacular is north of the citrus.
- Eagle Warrior goes SW on Turn 2 to pick up the river.  Exploration will be to the south and west first as that’s clear and in the preferred direction of settling.

I have a feeling we are south of the equator, possibly in the west of the land mass, based upon river flow and the presence of desert north of the start position.  I'll know better once I get the save, look for a map border and check for coast on Settlervision.

[suboptimal]

Starting save attached:

Ooh, a present!  Thanks Emperor K and Cornflakes for getting the map and save put together! 

[suboptimal]

And So It Begins - Turn 1

First off, in my earlier start analysis I contradicted myself.  I indicated that I would scout west and south, then stated that I thought I was in the southwest portion of the map.  Scouting west and south in that case would not be towards my opponents.  Silly my.  

I do have one concern about that horse resource, though – if tundra is indeed south of my position then it’s possible I could see a horse camp spawn.  That will make things….interesting...

Now to the turn…

First off, Settlervision before moving anything – none of the tiles south and west of the Eagle Warrior are fresh water adjacent.  Eagle Warrior advances one tile west, sees some stuff, advances to the citrus, sees some more stuff including a river.   I see part of a good city site in the west along the revealed river (see shot below), but nothing that makes me want to move to the grassland and delay settling to next turn.  I take Option #2, move to the gypsum and found Begin the Begin (henceforth referred to as just “Begin”).  My naming theme is R.E.M. songs, even though they called it quits a number of years ago.

I put the first Eagle Warrior into the build queue and work the 2/1 forest SW of the city center.  I’ll work this until the pop grows, then work the forested plains hill for a few turns until one of the 2/2 tiles is acquired, then work that.  Research is Mining first.  

I check for a map edge and I’m at least 50% correct – I can scroll down to the southern edge of the map.  Given river flows I will work on the assumption that I’m in the SW quadrant.  Lands to date:



For those who are curious, the Great People to start the game:

[TheArchduke]

Good settling choice. I would have SIP, for the 2 production in the start tile and the river bonus (waterwheel) for the wheat.

But that is leisurely SP talk.

The +1 CS is invaluable for the rush strategy we discussed, so I approve.

So the major question is where are the CS hidden?

Given your SW edge of the map theory, either smackdab in the corner, or between you and other players.

[suboptimal]

Yeah, the +1 CS was a driving factor, and the capital still gets 2 production. The other benefit I left out of the initial thoughts is that this placement also allows for a city to be settled on the same side of the river, right in the bend. Defensively I think this is a good location - if there's a mountain pass to the east it's all hills & rivers that need to be crossed; I'm planning on putting the Encampment on the desert 2NE of the city center and no one's coming from the west.

With "intentionally placed" city-states I'd expect them to be close in distribution to what you're guessing. The question is whether or not to have the warrior dip southwest next to the mountain to get a quick look down there on Settlervision before heading north or if I should just head straight NW now. In an SP game with the edge this close I probably wouldn't even look this early. I also didn't really care where my opponents were - they'd reveal themselves soon enough. Here, though, knowing who is nearby (and about where they are) is more important. I think I'd also prefer to take a CS on the front rather than a tundra CS in the back lines. My concern with all of this desert is that in my test games with plains/desert starts at least one of the city-states wound up being partially in the desert and of limited use or on the coast (and could not be sieged).

I've got three options with the EW for my next move:

- W-SW to check the area west of the mountain, just in case
- W-W then cross the river on Turn 3 - knowing where the coast would tell me how much space I have in this direction
- NW-NW - fastest route towards a potential front line CS and my northern neighbor

[TheArchduke]

I would head NW, your reasoning is valid.

[suboptimal]

Turn 2

This turn report was going to be a short one, about how the Eagle Warrior moved NW-NW, saw nothing on Settlervision, hit end turn and give you all a screen shot showing maybe 3-4 additional tiles revealed and we all wait for Turn 3 to roll around.  Then I hit ‘4’ to bring up Settlervision:



I’ve recently said elsewhere that scouting is a crap shoot and here we are.  I’ve got a city-state 3 turns of movement away from my capital.  On the one hand, I suppose I should have seen that before I moved, but I didn’t.  I suppose if it was something other than the dark red of a military city-state it would have stuck out more.  If I had to guess, the city center is on the northern side of that river that goes down around the horses.  Hopefully it is not coastal or have more than a couple of tundra tiles.

My first priority now is to meet the city-state (if it doesn’t do that for me on the interturn) and see what its territory looks like.  That will determine if I go after it with two Eagle Warriors or three.  The question to ask is how long to take advantage of the bonus for units?  What I can say is that if the city is building a monument I will let that go to completion before attacking as a 3-turn repair gets faster than a 15-20 turn build.

This also has ramifications for where city-states will be found.  If I’ve got one in my nearby back lines I have to assume that the others are in a similar position.  How many will find them right off the bat, particularly if they make the same conclusions about their location on the map and head off towards the center?  That also means that there is probably a city-state between each pair of opponents.  This makes sense as it keeps the possibility of gaining the inspiration for the Political Philosophy inspiration in play for everyone.

[TheArchduke]

Well let´s hope that the CS is not on a river and you can siege it with 2 units.

[suboptimal]

If it's split evenly across the river it could be sieged with two units. The conquest would slow down a bit as I'd have to stop to heal for a turn or two in before finishing off the city, but it's doable.

I think my plan is going to be to get the first-built Eagle Warrior down there and use both Eagle Warriors to try to catch both of the CS's warriors outside the city. If it works that will give me two shots to capture builders early and the CS will be defending at a strength of 19, making it fall quicker. I'd also build a scout after the 2nd built Eagle Warrior to get that out and about -- with the CS so close the Eagle Warriors can act as settler protection. Revealing the tiles around the horse to the south and the area west of the floodplains wheat will determine where the settler goes. The great thing about this position is that conquering the CS results in a compact 3-city empire by Turn 35 or so.