Suboptimal IV: Indonesian Insanity

[suboptimal]

Wacky thought - use the governor promotion from State Workforce to take Amani then suzerain & levy Carthage as it'd still be cheap (80-120 gold depending on their unit count). Six or seven warriors should be enough to really create some havoc wherever our opponent(s) to the north are. We could use the promotion from the Govt Plaza to then get Liang (though that wouldn't happen until Turn 65 or so, which is when the plaza completes). Magnus would still be the first governor as I want him in Punky's for the chops starting on T46.

Another thought - I think the harbor at Punky's should move to the NW of the city center. It takes away a Kampung but is a +5 location (+2 for City Center, +1 for Govt Plaza, +1 for adjacency to 2 districts [I think] and +1 for the fish).

[Cornflakes]

Wacky thought - use the governor promotion from State Workforce to take Amani then suzerain & levy Carthage as it'd still be cheap (80-120 gold depending on their unit count).  Six or seven warriors should be enough to really create some havoc wherever our opponent(s) to the north are.  We could use the promotion from the Govt Plaza to then get Liang.  Magnus would still be the first governor as I want him in Punky's for the chops starting on T46.

That is certainly thinking outside the box    What would the timing on this be? Does Amani take 5 turns to establish before her envoys become effective? If so the timing probably would only work out if you took her as 1st governor. Otherwise your first levy will almost be expired by that point. With first governor you'd get the envoys T46 giving you 20 turns with both levees active. A 10 turn delay gives you only a short window with both levies active, as well as another 10 turns of Agoge production for your victim to build defenders ... surely the will build defenders when they see your power spiking, right? Delaying Magnus and the chops isn't all bad because the chops will continue to scale up during the delay.

[suboptimal]

Amani's envoys don't kick in until she's established, which takes 5 turns. We get our first governor promotion at Turn 40 (Early Empire) and the second (State Workforce) somewhere around Turn 46 or Turn 47 depending on when Shipbuilding completes (EoT41 or EoT42), if the civics discounts kick in and if we're willing to sacrifice a few culture overflow to the State Workforce inspiration (ie have the Holy Site in Sound complete the civic for us). That means having established governors during Turn 46 and Turn 51/52.

In either scenario if I kept Punky's build order the same (Settler -> Holy Site -> Govt Plaza) we'd get Liang established in the late 60's . That's not too far into Monumentality and lets us rebuild the faith count a little after purchasing a settler and a trader. The downside is that there's a builder sitting idle for 12 turns and if it's Amani first then Punky's settler is out 5-6 turns later (the Holy site is done around T57/58 in both cases).

If I go Settler -> Govt Plaza -> Holy Site at Punky's and do one jungle chop before Magnus and one after (builder idles for ~10 turns while waiting) we can get the settler out on Turn 51, Govt Plaza on Turn 56 and Holy Site on Turn 66 assuming no further chops - we'd have to buy the Holy Site tile. After that the city can go to naval builds. That has Liang ready to go for the start on Monumentality.

EDIT: yeah, it's unorthodox, but what's the downside? We get two groups of three warriors going straight north. If we find an opponent soon enough there's enough time to inflict deep hurting, especially if we upgraded the Carthaginian warriors to swords in the process since they'd be around longer. I'm starting to like this idea, if only because it is unorthodox. Having Amani also makes it earier to suzerain another city-state later on as well.

[suboptimal]

Turn 39

Builder at Punky’s completes, start settler. Builders move to the copper and the jungle NE of Punky’s. Sound switches from the GFH to the lake. If I’ve got the math right it’s 2 turns to Shipbuilding instead of 3, just. Of course, the GUI doesn’t update so we’ll find out next turn. I can always switch back if it’s not done in one turn. It does delay the warrior by a turn, but that’s OK.

Northern galley starts to return, southern galley moves south two hexes and finds a sugar and a river on the island and the barbarian quadrireme.




That is quickly becoming somewhere to put a city (or two) at. My southern galley is most likely getting attacked on the interturn but the quadrireme will be in a position to be attacked by both galleys. The question will be whether or not it can survive. Of course, I could slot Discipline the turn after next as I don’t need Maritime Industries right now….

In the central area the barbarian scout has disappeared. I leave the warrior there to continue healing.

In the east my advance is stalled by the Nan Madol builder being right in the pass. Despite being suzerain and using levied units the levied warrior cannot move into the builder’s hex without me declaring war on Nan Madol. I have to leave the two warriors in their current positions so the builder can get out of the way. The third one moves onto the hill and we’ve met an opponent:




It’s Woden/Macedonia. Let’s see what he’s got…




The borders we can see belong to Methone. He just founded Alexandria last turn as his empire score jumped by 6, so his capital is currently population 2. His numbers are 7.8 (4th), 4.2 (2nd), 52 milpower (3rd), and 1 (4th). I see no other civ icons on the diplo screens so I’m guessing he hasn’t found anyone else yet. The 52 milpower is going to be a scout, a warrior and maybe two slingers or a second warrior. Our milpower is 150 and climbing.

Given the new find I start moving the other levied warriors between the mountains and Nan Madol, leaving the builder a path around them to the west. They’ll be at the horses in six turns.

Hit end turn, the cash register rings as Woden has now met Nan Madol.

Cornflakes, I’m taking Amani first, levying Carthage when she establishes and killing Macedonia with the rental units. Carthage is close enough where the levied troops could be there in 5-6 turns depending on where they are (one warrior is west of the city, so he’s the rear guard). The northern warrior will defog across the north of Carthage, stop to heal for a turn or two and then the attack is on. The lead warrior is going to probe deeper into Woden’s territory to get the lay of the land. He doesn’t have the cash or much of a military to be that responsive if we attack in 6-8 turns. I’ll try to take the closest city first with the Nan Madol troops and proceed from there. I'm going to move next to Carthage's borders so the AI does me the favor of bringing that western warrior home. If we levy on Turn 46 I could be attacking Methone on Turn 50 and threatening his other flank with the Carthaginians simultaneously.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

If of all things Macedon gets taken out in the Ancient era because of a /rented army/ I will quit. Just quit.

[suboptimal]

If of all things Macedon gets taken out in the Ancient era because of a /rented army/ I will quit. Just quit.

You shouldn't quit because of that. However, if the rentals expire and the city-state keeps attacking and razes the last Macedonian city, I'd understand if you did.  

[suboptimal]

Cornflakes, I went back through Archduke's PBEM 6 to try to get some insight as to Macedonia's development. After recovering from the flashbacks and hiding in the closet for five minutes due to the current similarities between the two games (open a large economic lead and find Macedonia right next door *shudder*) I was able to get the following out of it that might give us some guidance as to Woden's development.

At turn 40 in that game Archduke was at 6.6 science and working singlemindedly towards two Encampments and a GG and had a milpower in the 150 range. His Encampments came online on Turns 46 and 49, he finished Horseback Riding on Turn 55 and landed a Great General in the late 50's/early 60's. Obviously we don't know how much of a beeline Woden is making towards HBR but his current military development is "way behind schedule". I expect that number will ramp up now that he knows he's got a military power close by and we've got levied troops in the area. His science is a little ahead so he could get to HBR a little faster if he beelined, maybe the late 40's/50s and then possibly chop out a Hetaroi as we start the attack. I think that still favors us, especially if we can take Methone within a couple turns of declaring war. Holding the city could be tricky depending on loyalty pressure but Magnus would be available to move in for loyalty as we won't have any builders around. I would also think that the capital would be relatively close to Methone given "typical" Civ 6 settling tendencies in PBEMs.

If a pack of warriors meets one of his military units in the field early, should we declare and kill it off immediately? It would be one less unit to worry about.

If State Property completes EoT46 and we find a 3rd city state in a reasonable time frame we could be in Oligarchy around T55. If we find any quarries to pillage in Macedonia then that could be sped up 2 or 3 turns.

[Cornflakes]

I think declare war as soon as that gives you any advantage. First strike on a warrior where you can hit it with 2 attacks, first strike on a slinger even if just 1 can get a hit,chasing a builder off a forest, maybe even just pillaging tiles to hurt his yields. (Do any of the rented warriors have promotions or XP?)

You noted the biggest danger which is probably Woden chopping. He could get gold through clearing a barb camp so beware of an upgrade or two as well. How soon can you get to Iron Working?

[suboptimal]

Iron working would be 10 turns after Bronze Working. 6 if we mine iron. I'll reserve a builder chop in case iron shows up somewhere reachable.

[Cornflakes]

No point continuing to Iron Working if we can’t hook Iron. Without the resource to upgrade units the tech is worthless.