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[Spoiler] Kaiser has a plan

Let us have a look at what we could reasonably get with a reroll:

Norway (4) 3/7
- water focussed CIV with nearly no relevant land boni, I think worse than Spain and Egypt in a Pangea setting
Phoenicia (4) 7/8
- water focussed CIV with Harbour special district, settler production bonus and very quick settlers on sea. Anti-Synergy with Pangea but would be an acceptable/good pick when starting on coast
Eleanore (France) (4) 2/8
- Forget Eleanores bonus, it is based the worst implemented feaure of the game. Besides that she has a tendency to a culture victory, France supports this in the Renaissance era with Wonder building bonus and a good defensive unit. I believe it is very hard to successfully execute a cultural victory against other players, especially one only starting that late. if she is picked we should start early creating tourism to make this harder for her
Eleanore (England) (4) 8/8
- same stupid bonus but England is better for late game dominance due to production bonus. Also has a unique harbour district for easier access to trade routes (the movement bonus will probably be irrelevant on a Pangea, but the Dockyard can be placed in lakes). Due to quicker stockpiling of resources early wars are easier to execute
Sweden (4) 1/8
- boni come online in the renaissance era so ~turn 130 if we have a good development, no thanks
Kongo (4) 6/8
- no religuous game at all (nice counter for Spain) but a better Swordman (if there is forest and/or jungle around) and better GP generation. Not a bad pick but not beeing able to build Holy sites for a decent Icon_Faith income feels bad.
Spain (4) reroll
Georgia (4) 4/8
- bonus to building renaissance and Medieval walls, they also create tourism. This is in my opinion to late to become relevant and culture victories are difficult. She also has a Medieval unit which fights better in hills and gets increased Icon_Faith generation when declaring a protectiorate war. No thanks
Canada (4) 5/8
- Tundra can basically be used similar to plains, camp resources in Tundra become quite good. Other boni come in late and he cannot declaore surprise wars nor can he be declared on. The later gives a 5 turn information puffer but it is not enough to make this relevant, especially on a handedited map where a Tundra start is unlikely
Brazil (3) Ichabod
Egypt (3) reroll


Basically the only other interesting picks for me are Eleanore of England, Phoenicia and Kongo. Considering that the other 3 players have to pick likely among these and that there are 5 CIVs I would not like to play I think sticking with Egypt is the right move.
I think its actually realistic to expect some of the other to pick up Spain instead of their choices as it is certainly a valid option with a strong finishing move.

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I finalized this independantly of me or Ioan playing the game, my decision would be EGYPT as a pick.

If Ioan plays instead of me, I suggest that you take over this thread to report and also post your final pick decision here to avoid confusion.

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(May 23rd, 2020, 04:19)Kaiser Wrote: Questions to clarify (Lurker help welcome):

- Does the diplomatic visibilty from a trade route drop when declaring war (Egypt and Spain)
- Does Spain only get the +4 strength bonus when:
   - Spain has a religion and the other player has a religion
   - Spain has a religion and the other player has a pantheon
- Does anybody have investigated the average number of continental divides on Pangea (Small) and can derive the likelyhood of starting on or near one?

The trade route diplomacy is dependent upon a trade post, ie, completing a trade route to a foreign civ. That will stay. I'm not sure if there's another level for the trade route itself, but that vanishes, if it exists. 

I believe the +4 bonus only applies if the other player has a religion, although I need to test this to confirm. I'm going from memory of distant Spanish games. 

As for continental divides, usually 2 or 3 on a small Pangaea. You might be smack dab in the center, but odds are you'll have one within 15 tiles at the furthest. 

sorry, that was mostly useless, I just wanted you to know you're not shouting into the void.
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Thank you for your feedback CMF, it is actually helpful as I did not think about the trading post remaining. Due to the inaccurate and inconsistent documentation we probably need to test this out. I will try to have s go at that later today or tomorrow.

15 tiles on average is better than I expected but still would probably mean that it would be a stretched 3rd or a beelined 4th city to settle.

Do you have an opinion on my above argumentation between Egypt and Spain?

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Confirming Kaiser's selection as EGYPT (depending on whether Ioan gets his butt in gear.)
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I think Egypt is the stronger choice, rereading TBS's thread on PBEM17. The more ancient era stuff you can stack into the snowball, the better. He basically used the trade route bonus to jump start his cities - you can use Sphinxes to dominate culture and faith generation early, skip God-King, and get the ball rolling that way.

I don't think Spain is a -bad- choice - Conquistadors actually can be a game winner - but their stuff all comes online so late.
I Think I'm Gwangju Like It Here

A blog about my adventures in Korea, and whatever else I feel like writing about.
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I agree, I have done a couple of test starts today with balanced randomly generated maps and there are some traps along the way where I need to make sure to stay clear off.

I have figured out my problem with the Appeal from Sphinx, I want to place it on a floodplain if possible, these reduce the appeal of neighboring tiles and placing a Sphinx increases it again resulting in a +1 increase.
I have basically also ruled out the Earth Godess Pantheon due to this as this makes it a lot harder to achieve Breathtaking for the Icon_Faith bonus. Strong contenders are River Goddess and Fertility Rites. The former as it synergizes with Iteru, however it can be a trap to place/build the HS to early while this bonus is actually more long term oriented.
The latter is a nice bonus and might help with getting Sphinxes down, however we typically need the Sphinx to get our Icon_Faith generation running so the timing is off here.
Certainly there are other very signifiant pantheons but these will depend strongly on the map and resources available.

I am currently testing different openings, againg this will be map dependant but right now I tend for a quick settler (after Builder > Warrior for example) into a 2nd Builder for Sphinxes. I am undecided if I should try to push out a 3rd Settler or start building up at least 1 district before.
Hopefully we will have a nice area for our Government Plaza available.

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(May 23rd, 2020, 05:09)Kaiser Wrote: I finalized this independantly of me or Ioan playing the game, my decision would be EGYPT as a pick.

If Ioan plays instead of me, I suggest that you take over this thread to report and also post your final pick decision here to avoid confusion.

I also picked Egypt against Spain for, more or less, the same reasons that you listed here. smile
Even not so elaborated analysis...

From my point of view I have nothing against not playing or playing together as I'm  beginner in Civ6 anyway. As you prefer and/or is allowed.

Best regards!
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I have played 2 PBEMs here but I am as green as you, I will help you play if you want but for that you need to report here regularily so I understand the current situation and can give you advice.

Do you know how to post pictures/screenshots here?

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Hey Ioan,

There is a question for your playing window in the organization thread.

Did you use PYDT before? I recommend housing the app.

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