Gaspar & Noble make their triumphant? return; mostly just get asked about "The List"

[scooter]

TOP 5 THINGS THAT MAKE GASPAR ANGRY PRE-GAME

1. The fact that we have not reached a second page yet
   

WTF, how many posts per page do you have as your current setting? 20 posts/page gang checking in here, and I thought most people did 10 or 20, not higher.

[Gaspar]

TOP 5 THINGS THAT MAKE GASPAR ANGRY PRE-GAME

1. The fact that we have not reached a second page yet
   

WTF, how many posts per page do you have as your current setting? 20 posts/page gang checking in here, and I thought most people did 10 or 20, not higher.

Always 50. Bigger, better, faster, more!

[Old Harry]

Top five top fives:
1. Opposition research, obvs
2. The List, also obvs (may not be a five, this is acceptable)
3. Who has slighted you and deserves a smack (this game - not due until t150ish)
4. Methods of attracting lurker interaction
5. Favourite authors (I'm running low on reading material)

[Gaspar]

Top five top fives:
1. Opposition research, obvs

I may do this... if there's more clamor

2. The List, also obvs (may not be a five, this is acceptable)

This isn't going to happen.

3. Who has slighted you and deserves a smack (this game - not due until t150ish)

I suspect I will do this many times over the course of the game.

4. Methods of attracting lurker interaction

I've tried several to varying degrees of success so far. If you have any suggestions, keep them coming.

5. Favourite authors (I'm running low on reading material)

I really don't read as much as I used to as I'm out of the book business, so a list I'd put together wouldn't be very modern. I also tend to read nonfiction when I do read now, so... I'll give you a list but I doubt it will be very helpful.



As requested by the Sp*rs fan, TOP 5 FAVORITE AUTHORS

1. Nick Hornby. Haven't read the two newest ones but I love all of his others with the exception of How to be Good, which was some weird famous person navel gazing, IMO.
2. Salman Rushdie. Another Sp*rs fan. But Ground Beneath Her Feet is probably my favorite book of all time.
3. Jonathan Wilson. Non-fiction writer, but he's the only football writer whose books I always make sure I read. Inverting the Pyramid is the best tactics history out there and Nobody Ever Says Thank You was a great bio on an over-covered subject.
4. Pagan Kennedy. This is one of those that really dates me as a 90s boy, but the Exes was one of my first forays into "chick lit" and I loved it. The Spinsters was also fantastic and I enjoyed Black Livingstone as well.
5. Ta-Nehisi Coates. One of the few I've read recently, We Were 8 Years in Power was really good.

[Gaspar]

So NobleHelium and I had a fairly lengthy discussion about Civs and Leaders. I won't paste the chat log because it wasn't especially funny and/or exasperating and pasting chat logs is a surprising amount of work. So let's just go for a generic summation. We'll start with Civs because that's where Noble and I started. Here are all the Civs we found at least a little interesting:

• America (Fishing, Agriculture, Minute Man, Immigration Station)
  
• Arabia (Mysticism, The Wheel, Camel Archer, Madrassa)
  
• Byzantium (Mysticism, The Wheel, Cataphract, Hippodrome)
  
• HRE (Hunting, Mysticism, Landsknecht, Rathaus)
  
• Khmer (Hunting, Mining, Ballista Elephant, Baray)
  
• Mongolia (Hunting, The Wheel, Keshik, Ger)
  
• Portugal (Fishing, Mining, Carrack, Feitoira)
  
• Egypt (Agriculture, The Wheel, War Chariot, Obelisk)
  
• France (Agriculture, The Wheel, Musketeer, Salon)
  

OK, so I'll just go through in order. America has some potential because there's probably a play with Immigration Stations to get better odds on Great Engineers. But its probably only a viable choice if there's a fair amount of water. Arabia and Byzantium are both interesting because of tech cost changes which make Myst/Wheel the highest beaker total for start techs and they both have Knight replacements. Cataphracts are obviously stupid good, but Byz has always been held back by shitty start techs. Camel Archers got March which at least makes them interesting. HRE is another Civ which benefits from the Mysticism change and Rathauses are good. Khmer is mostly for Ballistaphants, though the Baray has its uses. Mongolia has a decent UU, a decent UB and now mediocre start techs. Portugal is in the same boat as America - solid now, but you want to be sure there's enough water to take advantage. Egypt is well, Egypt. The classic start tech synergy you want and War Chariots which mean you get left alone in the Ancient Era. France is in the same boat, except that Musketeers are so good to go out with your Knight stacks.

Leader-wise, we have a vaguer list:

• Isabella (SPI/EXP)
  
• Bismarck (EXP/IND)
  
• Ramsses (SPI/IND)
  
• Cyrus (IMP/CHM)
  
• Nebuchadnezzar (IND/PHI)
  
• Pacal (EXP/FIN)
  
• Mansa Musa (SPI/FIN)
  

You can sort of see there that we think EXP, FIN, SPI and IND, in no particular order are the traits we find to be strongest in the current CtH. Cyrus is obviously the outlier there, but if one were to take one of the strong mounted leaders, IMP/CHM is the super aggressive mounted unit guy. While its unlikely we'll go that route, its certainly something worth discussing. IMP is still not great, but its better. I guess this leads to a more direct conversation about how we value the traits. This was my ranking:

FIN > IND=EXP > SPI > ORG > PHI > PRO > IMP > CRE > CHM >>> AGG

So, working backwards, Agg is just terrible. Its a terrible trait because in MP mounted is king so its bonus helps more defensively than offensively and it doesn't get a bonus strong enough to help offset that the main purpose isn't effective. This is why both Krill and Seven changed the trait so drastically in their mods. I dunno what the right answer is but I don't think we've found it yet. I think maybe it needs to do something for mounted. Chm is better than Agg because it does have economic benefit and its boosts to warring do help mounted. Cre got dumpstered pretty hard I think - the library bonus was always the best part. I always felt is was the most overrated trait so that bias is in here. Imp is a Krill overrated trait but its still nice to get settlers out faster and the Stable boost is a nice addition. Protective was probably top 5 in 1.3 but now its more of a middling trait. I think its good enough to consider taking, though. Phi probably still sucks. If I were doing GasparMOD I'd probably give it the cheap Libraries and find something else to give Cre, like maybe they get an extra bonus on Artist specialists or something. Or maybe all CRE specialists generate culture. I dunno. Org is really in the same place it always is. Spi is better than before because there are more good Civics. Exp losing the worker bonus and Ind getting indirectly buffed by the nerf to resource doublers makes them about equivalent in my mind - cheap granaries are still insanely good! Fin is still number one because its still money for nothing but its closer to the pack.

Anyway, that's what Noble and I discussed today. Would love to hear thoughts from anyone else.

[Commodore]

I feel like your ">>>" isn't near enough. I'd happily take *any* of the CtH traits randomly given to me (although San Martin's Cre/Chm is a little bit in conflict), except for Agg. At least I'd put the rest as "close enough for a minimalist mod".

[Thoth]

It's been awhile since I've played, but memory says unit costs are a very significant thing. 25% off a major expense seems like an ok buff to the trait. Not first rank, but an ok support trait.

[Gaspar]

I feel like your ">>>" isn't near enough. I'd happily take *any* of the CtH traits randomly given to me (although San Martin's Cre/Chm is a little bit in conflict), except for Agg. At least I'd put the rest as "close enough for a minimalist mod".

Yeah, Agg and Pro were pretty close in the uselessness rankings and Pro got a real boost and Agg did not. I think given the desire to not make Agg an economic benefit, I think maybe the answer is either Agg gives C1 to ALL units or something like "removes building requires for HE, NE, WP and Red Cross." Or move Stables there and add Airports and something else. Or Agg can doesn't have to have a religion to get Theo benefits. Something like that.

[scooter]

Interested in your distaste for Charismatic. That seems to be a pretty big divide to how I see CTH Charismatic valued elsewhere. Any more detailed thoughts on that?

[Gaspar]

Interested in your distaste for Charismatic. That seems to be a pretty big divide to how I see CTH Charismatic valued elsewhere. Any more detailed thoughts on that?

I dunno, am I missing something? It got cheap monuments and monuments work well with the trait in and of itself but they're still a building you mostly don't want to build. And it got cheaper Colosseums but nobody builds those? I think maybe its on par with CRE now?