WW 46: Wolves Return to Realms Beyond

[Serdoa]

I just read up on that bomb role and to me it doesn't make sense or I misunderstand it. If I understand it correctly then there needs to be a killing action against Cyneheard, which kills Cyneheard; activates the bomb and kills the person killing Cyneheard. But El Grillo was a hider and Gaspar a standard villager. How should this work with a bomb?

Oh, I thought a bomb was an additional night kill where Cyneheard would be able to blow himself up to do an additional kill.

But is that not kind of stupid? I mean keeping Cyneheard around for another day would have been the better option. Either the village would have lynched him the next day, which comes down to the same result as using the bomb thingy or there could have been a chance that Cyneheard survived day 2.

It is. Trading 1 to 1 with a villager is bad for a wolf. There are times when this can come in handy, but surely not on N1, not with a JOAT. I think pindicator would know that. 

Also, lets look at the facts that we know

a) N1 - Cyneheard gets killed, no one claims it
b) N2 - Two villagers get killed, no one claims it (pindicator brings in a possible Redirector)
c) N3 - Comm saved me, but we still had a kill

N3 imo is telling. If we have no SK and only wolves left, do we believe that they would kill GKC - who was nearly pushed to be lynched - but not Comm or me? That would be such a bad wolfplay, they absolutely have to go for us right now, nothing else makes sense. But even then, it would not explain N1. And a redirector can't explain N1 nor N3 (N3 in case of wolf-redirector)

I think everyone that has played these games so often as we did, should at least consider a high chance for an SK in this game. But what happens? pindicator tries to push the idea of a bomb or "something" else, like a redirector but does only the slightest hint at an SK, more like an afterthought. But then, in the next post, he comes around to ask Rowain if he thinks Comm is an SK. And also starts pushing CMF. I believe what is going on here is the following:

1) pindicator is SK
2) pindicator killed Cyneheard N1 (thanks for that) 
3) pindicator killed one of the villagers N2, never shot scooter
4) pindicator killed GKC N3 while the wolves tried to kill me, because he did not want to double up with the wolves
5) pindicator agrees with us that Rowain is likely the last scum, but he would like to keep him alive, because more night kills are better than less for him

pindicator

I'd rather get the SK out of the game, definitely getting rid of one nightkill each night than lynch Rowain who might be a wolf, but maybe not the last of them. Which would leave us at 2 nightkills. And that would mean we would be at 4 players tomorrow, with 1 wolf, 1 SK and 2 villagers. I'd rather not play that game, thank you very much.

[pindicator]

Yeah, I'm grasping at straws for the night 1 explanation Charriu. I'm not saying it's what happened, I'm putting out information.

I just read up on that bomb role and to me it doesn't make sense or I misunderstand it. If I understand it correctly then there needs to be a killing action against Cyneheard, which kills Cyneheard; activates the bomb and kills the person killing Cyneheard. But El Grillo was a hider and Gaspar a standard villager. How should this work with a bomb?

Oh, I thought a bomb was an additional night kill where Cyneheard would be able to blow himself up to do an additional kill.

But is that not kind of stupid? I mean keeping Cyneheard around for another day would have been the better option. Either the village would have lynched him the next day, which comes down to the same result as using the bomb thingy or there could have been a chance that Cyneheard survived day 2.

It is. Trading 1 to 1 with a villager is bad for a wolf. There are times when this can come in handy, but surely not on N1, not with a JOAT. I think pindicator would know that. 

Also, lets look at the facts that we know

a) N1 - Cyneheard gets killed, no one claims it
b) N2 - Two villagers get killed, no one claims it (pindicator brings in a possible Redirector)
c) N3 - Comm saved me, but we still had a kill

N3 imo is telling. If we have no SK and only wolves left, do we believe that they would kill GKC - who was nearly pushed to be lynched - but not Comm or me? That would be such a bad wolfplay, they absolutely have to go for us right now, nothing else makes sense. But even then, it would not explain N1. And a redirector can't explain N1 nor N3 (N3 in case of wolf-redirector)

I think everyone that has played these games so often as we did, should at least consider a high chance for an SK in this game. But what happens? pindicator tries to push the idea of a bomb or "something" else, like a redirector but does only the slightest hint at an SK, more like an afterthought. But then, in the next post, he comes around to ask Rowain if he thinks Comm is an SK. And also starts pushing CMF. I believe what is going on here is the following:

1) pindicator is SK
2) pindicator killed Cyneheard N1 (thanks for that) 
3) pindicator killed one of the villagers N2, never shot scooter
4) pindicator killed GKC N3 while the wolves tried to kill me, because he did not want to double up with the wolves
5) pindicator agrees with us that Rowain is likely the last scum, but he would like to keep him alive, because more night kills are better than less for him

pindicator

I'd rather get the SK out of the game, definitely getting rid of one nightkill each night than lynch Rowain who might be a wolf, but maybe not the last of them. Which would leave us at 2 nightkills. And that would mean we would be at 4 players tomorrow, with 1 wolf, 1 SK and 2 villagers. I'd rather not play that game, thank you very much.

Okay, WTF Serdoa!? You get to lay traps yesterday but as soon as I try to draw out any support for Rowain I get hammered like this? And I do not think that Rowain is the last scum, I think there is at least 1 more out there. Why would Rowain be acting like this if this is all that remains? So why would you want to shut down any discussion today about what is going on after Rowain like this?

Your bullet point theory is patently untrue and doesn't even fit the facts. I shot scooter. I haven't done a damn thing else this game and I can't do anything more. Killing me won't reduce your kills because I'm not the SK. Try to at least fit facts here. If You think I'm lying here then you must also believe that Commodore is lying because how could he doctor Meiz and have Meiz die unless something else was at play?

And seriously, i'm so pissed at you for that last point that if I didn't have such a town lean on you I'd be thinking you were a serial killer. You can do something the previous day to keep discussion going and go on other targets but as soon as I do it suddenly it's scummy???

[pindicator]

Also, this:

Rowain, what do you make of Commodore and scooter going at each other day 2 if they were scum buddies?  And certainly you would have to have other people you've seen interact with Commodore that would be suspicious to you, much as I was getting my suspicions on you based on your voting around scooter and Cyneheard?  Or are you suggesting Commodore as a SK?

This is not an accusation of Commodore being the SK. This is pointing out how bad faith Rowain is arguing today. I have no reason to suspect Commodore is anything other than exactly what he says he is.

[naufragar]

Please don't be demoralized, it's an easy game to get wrong but all of you have functioning brains and I'm listening to everyone here for their takes, you all have valuable and valid input.

Well, feeling pretty demoralized by being so wrong and needing to reread so much, and currently feeling a little gun-shy. In the spirit of pitching in, here are very tentative micro-reads. Here are the remaining players:

Serdoa
naufragar
superdeath
Commodore
Chevalier Mal Fet alias CMF
Charriu
Rowain
pindicator

The people who have been making lots of noise are Serdoa, me, Comm, Rowain, Pind. Comm I lean town; Rowain scum. I've laid these two out before. Pind I still don't know how to read the multiclaim. I'll have to think about it more. I made a post saying that Occam's razor tells me to lean scum (of some flavor) on both. I'll need to reread. Serdoa I'm very weird on. A cornerstone of my suspicions of him were that he was protecting GKC. That was obviously a flawed argument. Another necessary reread. Nobody else has thought Serdoa's wolfy and my main reason has disappeared, so lean town.

The quiet folk (although this isn't really fair in some cases) are Superdeath, CMF, Charriu. I have no idea what to think of these three. Superdeath was attacked by Cyneheard. This makes me think he's town. He hasn't been helpful and I believe he was the first to mention the possibility of a serial killer. I can't really reread because there's not much to read. CMF and Charriu don't have a high quantity of posts but they come in and give good coverage of the game state. I haven't found any of their reasoning twisting or unreasonable. I wondered if Scooter surrendered once he knew he was dead, so CMF could hop off and not stay on him for the flip.

[Serdoa]

Okay, WTF Serdoa!? You get to lay traps yesterday but as soon as I try to draw out any support for Rowain I get hammered like this?  And I do not think that Rowain is the last scum, I think there is at least 1 more out there.  Why would Rowain be acting like this if this is all that remains?  So why would you want to shut down any discussion today about what is going on after Rowain like this?

I vote you because your whole play reeks of SK. I've laid out my points in the last post. As for Rowain: Why would he act like this in any case? For scum that makes no sense, for village that makes no sense. His play makes no sense. It is anti-town, but it wouldn't be good scum play either. So what is he doing? I think he threw a fit. Though if that is so, that doesn't tell me if he is a wolf or not.

Also: I don't even parse your last sentence here. I shut down any discussion today? Why? Because after having tried to get others to speak up, after having voiced my concerns, I present my case? If that is shutting down discussion, I'd like everyone in this town to start shutting down discussions.

Your bullet point theory is patently untrue and doesn't even fit the facts.  I shot scooter.  I haven't done a damn thing else this game and I can't do anything more.  Killing me won't reduce your kills because I'm not the SK.  Try to at least fit facts here.

You have not yet given any reason that my theory is wrong, but wrote several times something about facts. You want facts in a game that for the village is played for the most part without ever having facts.

If You think I'm lying here then you must also believe that Commodore is lying because how could he doctor Meiz and have Meiz die unless something else was at play?

Maybe a roleblocker? That is a standard role for wolves. We had two villagers with roles die N1, so it stands to reason that a roleblocker would be around for wolves. But maybe you can kill through the doctor-protection. That is also not unheard of with SKs.

I hope that is not the one point for which you call my theory "patently untrue" and "doesn't fit the facts" because that point has not had any effect on my theory.

And seriously, i'm so pissed at you for that last point that if I didn't have such a town lean on you I'd be thinking you were a serial killer.  You can do something the previous day to keep discussion going and go on other targets but as soon as I do it suddenly it's scummy???

I guess that is the point you would like to push? But the answer is: Yes, it is scummy. My push yesterday was scummy as well. It nearly saved scooter, of course that is scummy. People just decided that they believe that I've played in a way that showed that I am a villager. Comm thought I tried to lay a trap and I corrected him, because I am a villager and while I would love the praise for being oh so smart, the truth is I wasn't.

So, yes, your vote is scummy. And mine was too. Only that my play as a whole is not, while yours is.

[Rowain]

A small little theorie:
There are 2 groups of wolves Red and purple.
Having 2 members each.
N1 Red kill gaspar and purple kill CH.
N2 purple block pindi believing he might be red2 and kill mein while scooter Killed lewwyn.
D3 scooter get lynched. So purple knows there will only be 1 kill allowing Comm to post his volume getting good cover. Who would be Purple2? Serdoa who has not voted with Commodore on any end of day not even on d3.
Of course you cant trust me. To see that i'm honest you have to lynch me. That is ok. But once you see my name in blue please wake up and lynch Commodore & co

[Serdoa]

Rowain, your theory

There are 2 groups of wolves Red and purple.
Having 2 members each.
N1 Red kill gaspar and purple kill CH.
N2 purple block pindi believing he might be red2 and kill mein while scooter Killed lewwyn.
D3 scooter get lynched. So purple knows there will only be 1 kill allowing Comm to post his volume getting good cover. Who would be Purple2? Serdoa who has not voted with Commodore on any end of day not even on d3.

means that you believe that Comm and I are together purple. Because we have not voted together? Is there anything else besides that? Because I am sorry, but I can't defend against that. I can just mention that I didn't vote with superdeath either on any day.

[pindicator]

Okay, WTF Serdoa!? You get to lay traps yesterday but as soon as I try to draw out any support for Rowain I get hammered like this?  And I do not think that Rowain is the last scum, I think there is at least 1 more out there.  Why would Rowain be acting like this if this is all that remains?  So why would you want to shut down any discussion today about what is going on after Rowain like this?

I vote you because your whole play reeks of SK. I've laid out my points in the last post. As for Rowain: Why would he act like this in any case? For scum that makes no sense, for village that makes no sense. His play makes no sense. It is anti-town, but it wouldn't be good scum play either. So what is he doing? I think he threw a fit. Though if that is so, that doesn't tell me if he is a wolf or not.

Also: I don't even parse your last sentence here. I shut down any discussion today? Why? Because after having tried to get others to speak up, after having voiced my concerns, I present my case? If that is shutting down discussion, I'd like everyone in this town to start shutting down discussions.

No, because as soon as I bring up CMF and want to get more out of him, suspecting he may be someone Rowain is screening for you (unsaid before, but that's my suspicion) suddenly are on me faster than anything.  I was a town lean to you if I recall your last-minute post last night.  So my whole play "reeks of SK" is a new revelation or something from today that you see as scummy.  Do you think CMF is so obviously town?  Are you really satisfied with how he explains in his older voting posts that he doesn't want to vote for someone but doesn't want to vote for someone else, but so-and-so is scummy but he's going to vote for someone he just called honest and genuine anyway?  Because I am not.  If he had never played a game of mafia/werewolf in his life I'd accept that as someone who didn't know what they were getting into.  But he has played, he said as much.

Your bullet point theory is patently untrue and doesn't even fit the facts.  I shot scooter.  I haven't done a damn thing else this game and I can't do anything more.  Killing me won't reduce your kills because I'm not the SK.  Try to at least fit facts here.

You have not yet given any reason that my theory is wrong, but wrote several times something about facts. You want facts in a game that for the village is played for the most part without ever having facts.

If You think I'm lying here then you must also believe that Commodore is lying because how could he doctor Meiz and have Meiz die unless something else was at play?

Maybe a roleblocker? That is a standard role for wolves. We had two villagers with roles die N1, so it stands to reason that a roleblocker would be around for wolves. But maybe you can kill through the doctor-protection. That is also not unheard of with SKs.

I hope that is not the one point for which you call my theory "patently untrue" and "doesn't fit the facts" because that point has not had any effect on my theory.

Fine, believe your own theory in face of any counter evidence.  But of our two explanations for night 2, mine is far simpler than yours. I have only and will only do anything Night 2.

Why would I claim vig yesterday if I was SK?  It wasn't like my back was to the wall and I was staring down the vote.  Scooter absolutely was suspicious without me jumping in.  All it has done is bring more attention to me than what I had before.  I claimed because what I said was the truth and I knew something happened to mess with my shot and that a town scooter would in no way have been redirected or saved or whatever-ed with.\

And seriously, i'm so pissed at you for that last point that if I didn't have such a town lean on you I'd be thinking you were a serial killer.  You can do something the previous day to keep discussion going and go on other targets but as soon as I do it suddenly it's scummy???

I guess that is the point you would like to push? But the answer is: Yes, it is scummy. My push yesterday was scummy as well. It nearly saved scooter, of course that is scummy. People just decided that they believe that I've played in a way that showed that I am a villager. Comm thought I tried to lay a trap and I corrected him, because I am a villager and while I would love the praise for being oh so smart, the truth is I wasn't.

So, yes, your vote is scummy. And mine was too. Only that my play as a whole is not, while yours is.

No, i find this entirely disingenuous.  You were not scummy for keeping dialog going yesterday and exploring other topics, even if you ended up wrong on GKC.  You don't argue results, you argue methods here.  You of all people I expect to know this.  If you would have actually let scooter go and never reigned the town in then I would have some real suspicions about you.  But you didn't let it go that far.  Same with my vote here for CMF.  I want him to talk.  I want him to give real opinions and not this "I don't want to upset anyway" facade that I suspect he's hiding behind.  Because we both know that even if we're right on Rowain today - and don't tell me there isn't a little bit of a voice in the back of your head going "what if?" because it's in there for me too - there are in no way just 3 scum in this village.  If there ever got to be a run on CMF like there was on GKC yesterday, you bet I would make sure to rein people in and focus them back on the real scummy person today.

That's why I'm pissed at you.  Because you're either being disingenuous in this to prop up your theory, or if you really think it's scum behavior then that what you are really doing.

[Chevalier Mal Fet]

CMF, I think you are overdoing the "I'm clearly not made for this, I have no confindence"-bit. As a villager, you will be wrong on your assessments. Am I certain about Rowain? No, actually I am not. But the truth is: As a villager, you can only evaluate what others state and do and vote accordingly. And that evaluation will sometimes be wrong. I've been on villagers for half a game because I stubbornly believed them to be a wolf. I was lynched because I played badly and lynched because I played too well - and was both times a villager. I think I even lost one game for village because at the end I voted to lynch the fellow villager over the wolf. It happens.

As for Rowain, the issue is that his play - the play right now - is anti-town. It is similar to what Bob did: "How dare you suspect me, your meta is dumb, you are dumb, just lynch me". At the start of these games here, we did let get players off the hook with that play. And sure, some were villagers. But it makes it too easy for a wolf/SK to hide behind these plays.

The only good play for a villager if he gets mistakenly targeted is to help the town gather information, be it by reminding of points in their favor, be it by helping gathering information on others. That way, even if you get mislynched, you do help your fellow town-members. It's basically boils down to: Understand that you don't win by being alive at the end, but by us as a team lynching all wolves.

And if someone does not do that, if someone is throwing a fit and is abrasive , you just have to assume they are a wolf. And if they are not, hopefully they act differently the next game.

This, and Commodore's post below, are again, entirely fair. People keep pushing me to scumhunt, and post more, but here's the thing: I don't really know how it seems. I figure, okay, use your knowledge. You've got night kills, voting patterns, and posts. When I tried to do that last weekend, when I had a bit of time, well, I was wrong.

Reading back, though, with a few days to sort of process and digest, I've only been horribly wrong on two reads - just happening to be two consecutive lynches: Adrien and scooter, mixing up which was town and which was scum. I did at least get Bob and Lewwyn right (eventually, in Lewwyn's case, and if he'd survived I would have swung back to scum in anotehr couple of posts). 

I agree, I'm also having that sinking feeling.  Rowain's not being helpful in his arguments and he's just tossing out names.  We are going to need to go back and parse the first few days.  I'm sure anything he said today is not reliable, but stuff before he was turning up on people's radars could have some information.

As for a traitor role, do traitors know the wolves ahead of time?  I know when I played the Doctor Saul game I did not know at the start, but i was given a seer ability to help me find them.  I don't have enough experience with these games to know what is customary, however.

Everything i said in the past days is as true as a Villager can be.
I dont think SD would be a policy lynch. On d3 He needed to be reminded to vote scooter because he forgot he had done so on d2. D2 voting scooter was no risk d1 voting Bob as to not kill CH.
Anyway Comm is set to lynch me and He has prepared it with lies about my play and snarky comments the past days. How much hunting he did i leave up for you to decide.

Rowain, what do you make of Commodore and scooter going at each other day 2 if they were scum buddies?  And certainly you would have to have other people you've seen interact with Commodore that would be suspicious to you, much as I was getting my suspicions on you based on your voting around scooter and Cyneheard?  Or are you suggesting Commodore as a SK?

I really, really do not like how quiet half of the field has gotten here today.  That is just adding to it all.  Or maybe it's the ambiance I have out my window with the orange smoke.  It just seems like Commodore, Rowain, Serdoa, and I talking to each other.

Chevalier Mal Fet, I want to hear from you.  I don't like this "do no harm" game you've playing, so do us all a favor and ruffle some feathers.  Town doesn't win by being nice and never being wrong.  You didn't say that you've never played before, just that you never played here.  

crosspost @Commodore- are you saying we need to ask for claims from everyone?

Whose feathers shall I ruffle?

To the new people, I'll echo Serdoa:

Werewolf is a frustrating game for a villager. You operate in a fog, knowing only your own alignment and the alignment of the dead. You're going to be wrong, a lot. Sometimes very wrong. Furthermore, that fellow villager who was right about a couple of people? (Hi.) There is absolutely no guarantee that he'll be right the next time, because he's operating in the same fog as you are. Please don't be demoralized, it's an easy game to get wrong but all of you have functioning brains and I'm listening to everyone here for their takes, you all have valuable and valid input. Silence is deadly; that's why Rowain with his sullen/hostile/self-voting act is pushing so hard to demoralize and quiet the village. That attitude is why I'm pretty sure we have a scum there, but he's still fighting a toxic, hostile fight for his remaining scumbuddy(s).

I don't know for sure if a mass-claim is good yet. It's a cure for boredom, but I don't know if giving the remaining scum factions targets is worth the added information.

Thanks for recognizing that I am, indeed, very demoralized at this point. It's tiring to put in a lot of work only to get, well, nothing from it. I don't mind getting accused of being scum, y'know, nothing personal, I just hate that I'm bad at this game. Gotta stick with it, though. 

Please don't be demoralized, it's an easy game to get wrong but all of you have functioning brains and I'm listening to everyone here for their takes, you all have valuable and valid input.

Well, feeling pretty demoralized by being so wrong and needing to reread so much, and currently feeling a little gun-shy. In the spirit of pitching in, here are very tentative micro-reads. Here are the remaining players:

Serdoa
naufragar
superdeath
Commodore
Chevalier Mal Fet alias CMF
Charriu
Rowain
pindicator

The people who have been making lots of noise are Serdoa, me, Comm, Rowain, Pind. Comm I lean town; Rowain scum. I've laid these two out before. Pind I still don't know how to read the multiclaim. I'll have to think about it more. I made a post saying that Occam's razor tells me to lean scum (of some flavor) on both. I'll need to reread. Serdoa I'm very weird on. A cornerstone of my suspicions of him were that he was protecting GKC. That was obviously a flawed argument. Another necessary reread. Nobody else has thought Serdoa's wolfy and my main reason has disappeared, so lean town.

The quiet folk (although this isn't really fair in some cases) are Superdeath, CMF, Charriu. I have no idea what to think of these three. Superdeath was attacked by Cyneheard. This makes me think he's town. He hasn't been helpful and I believe he was the first to mention the possibility of a serial killer. I can't really reread because there's not much to read. CMF and Charriu don't have a high quantity of posts but they come in and give good coverage of the game state. I haven't found any of their reasoning twisting or unreasonable. I wondered if Scooter surrendered once he knew he was dead, so CMF could hop off and not stay on him for the flip.

Echoing Nauf's first line. I feel a bit gunshy. 

Anyway, let me briefly state that I honestly thought scooter was town, for the reasons I laid out in my big dive on him on Day 2. I could understand his logic, I liked how wordy he was, and I thought his anger at Lewwyn was unfeigned. In retrospect, the wordiness was a terrible way to read, it also misled me on Adrien and Commodore (I've accepted that Commodore is either town or a good enough wolf that I don't mind if he beats us). Given that assumption, on Day 3 the scooter lynch train I didn't see why scooter was obviously the one lying on the competing claims. I was also busy doubting my self though and everyone else seemed so convinced, which is why I was torn about who to vote for. 

If I were a wolf good enough to go under the radar thus far, I'd also be smart enough not to stick by an obviously sinking ship like scooter. My Day 2 and 3 actions make no sense if you assume I'm confident, but attributing them to a naive villager explains all, I think. 

Okay, WTF Serdoa!? You get to lay traps yesterday but as soon as I try to draw out any support for Rowain I get hammered like this?  And I do not think that Rowain is the last scum, I think there is at least 1 more out there.  Why would Rowain be acting like this if this is all that remains?  So why would you want to shut down any discussion today about what is going on after Rowain like this?

I vote you because your whole play reeks of SK. I've laid out my points in the last post. As for Rowain: Why would he act like this in any case? For scum that makes no sense, for village that makes no sense. His play makes no sense. It is anti-town, but it wouldn't be good scum play either. So what is he doing? I think he threw a fit. Though if that is so, that doesn't tell me if he is a wolf or not.

Also: I don't even parse your last sentence here. I shut down any discussion today? Why? Because after having tried to get others to speak up, after having voiced my concerns, I present my case? If that is shutting down discussion, I'd like everyone in this town to start shutting down discussions.

 Are you really satisfied with how he explains in his older voting posts that he doesn't want to vote for someone but doesn't want to vote for someone else, but so-and-so is scummy but he's going to vote for someone he just called honest and genuine anyway?  Because I am not.  If he had never played a game of mafia/werewolf in his life I'd accept that as someone who didn't know what they were getting into.  But he has played, he said as much.

TO BE FAIR the last time I played online mafia it's entirely possible that some of hte younger members of this forum weren't even born yet. Like, those games pre-date YouTube. So I know the rules and the basic roles, but this RB meta is entirely unfamiliar territory to me. It's made worse that all of the vets know each other, so Lewwyn and Commodore and scooter were all reading each other well and leaving me in the dust.

Anyway, right now, I guess the best I can do is lay out my theory of the game state:

8 players left. 2 dead scum, at least 1 living scum. Plus 2 more villagers lynched, 4 murdered. 

If I go with Occam's Razor, the simplest theory of roles that fits the available evidence is that we had a Serial Killer and a wolf faction, not a vigilante, plus Commodore's doctor. 

The SK takes down Cyneheard on N1 while the wolves kill Gaspar. 
N2 the SK goes for Lewwyn/Meiz while the wolves claim the other. 
N3 GKC is murdered (maybe by SK, maybe the wolves as no longer useful?), while Commodore blocks the attempt on Serdoa. 

That eliminates the weirdness with role blockers and switchers, it eliminates the weird vigilante stuff. None of our survivors has taken credit for Cyneheard, not even our claimed vigilante. That makes it a pretty obvious SK to me. That also explains all of our nightkills.

3 wolves or 4? I don't know. 3 would kind of fit my problems suspecting anyone, I read everyone as "eh COULD be scum" to "village." 

So, players:

1)Right now I could see pindicator being the SK. He started the Adrien train on Day 1, which kind of had Adrien on my radar. I also think he's laying his suspicion of my posts on rather thick, but that's my own personal bias here - I felt the same about Lewwyn. Don't trust that. There's also the stuff Serdoa lays out. However, his pressuring me for more info is good townplay, UNLESS he's trying to start a train on me to save Rowain. I don't think that's what he's doing, though, he's said that there doesn't seem to be much chance of lynching me today. So right now, pindi is my best read for SK, but I'm not confident of that one and would hate to vote for it today. 

2)Rowain does seem anti-town. His wolf theory seems far-fetched and overly complicated for a game with so many newbies (I can't help but try meta reads, it's hwo I think), and he still hasn't bothered much to defend himself. I am super nervous that there's not a lot of movement, but if our last wolves are Rowain/pindicator, that could explain it, OR the final wolf could be riding the Rowain train and hoping that earns him enough town points to coast to the kill. 

3)Commodore, like I said, is either town or a good enough wolf that I am going to treat him as town anyway.

4)Serdoa & Charriu I both would be very surprised to learn are wolves. I think it's not impossible but I think they're town.

5)naufragar and SD - nauf started out with all the cloud of suspicion on him, but Serdoa seems to have laid off that the last few days in search of bigger game. I read nauf as a newbie a lot like me - clumsy, making mistakes, but ultimately not a wolf. SD just is too absent from the game, but his vote for scooter, albeit with no explanation, was a good one. I think he's the villager we could most afford to lose (apart from myself   ) but I do think he's a villager, unless there's a 4th wolf.

[BRickAstley]

Tally as of post 922:

Lynch votes
5 votes: Rowain (Commodore, Chevalier Mal Fet, Rowain, Charriu, naufragar)
1 votes: Chevalier Mal Fet (pindicator)
1 votes: pindicator (Serdoa)

Voting history:

Rowain

Rowain

Rowain

Rowain

Rowain

Rowain

Rowain

Chevalier Mal Fet

pindicator

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