American Politics Discussion Thread

[Jowy]

Is it wrong to wish someone die from COVID

Stop right there.  The answer is yes, with no qualifiers.  Speaking as a moderator, advocating violence or death is not appropriate here or anywhere.  (You didn't, but I'm issuing the caution now.)

I agree.

Especially if you are the sitting president in a presidential debate being broadcasted worlwide. Stand back and stand by!

Anyway my thoughts and prayers to Trump.

[Charriu]

Is it wrong to wish someone die from COVID if their direct intently malicious actions led to hundreds of thousands of deaths from COVID?

Something to wonder. I make no claims one way or another of course.

So Trump is guilty of all those deaths? Falowing your logic every single leader is guilty of deaths in his country. Trump has many sins but considering him guilty of covids death is just plain wrong, considering every state was free to take his own measures and the more vocals on acuzing Trump are the democrat side which didnt listen to a single thing what Trump said.

I didnt  hear for example in Spain or Belgium opozition saying that the  leader is guilty of all deaths, as Jowy said  "hundreds of thousands"

I wouldn't say that Trump is guilty of every single death. But did he do enough to safe more lives or did his actions put people's live in danger? To that I would say yes he's guilty.

Why do we not hear of those things from Spain, Belgium or other countries that handled the pandemic better? Well I would say because in those countries government and opposition recognized this as a serious crisis in which botj have to work together for the greater good.

[mackoti]

Is it wrong to wish someone die from COVID if their direct intently malicious actions led to hundreds of thousands of deaths from COVID?

Something to wonder. I make no claims one way or another of course.

So Trump is guilty of all those deaths? Falowing your logic every single leader is guilty of deaths in his country. Trump has many sins but considering him guilty of covids death is just plain wrong, considering every state was free to take his own measures and the more vocals on acuzing Trump are the democrat side which didnt listen to a single thing what Trump said.

I didnt  hear for example in Spain or Belgium opozition saying that the  leader is guilty of all deaths, as Jowy said  "hundreds of thousands"

I wouldn't say that Trump is guilty of every single death. But did he do enough to safe more lives or did his actions put people's live in danger? To that I would say yes he's guilty.

Why do we not hear of those things from Spain, Belgium or other countries that handled the pandemic better? Well I would say because in those countries government and opposition recognized this as a serious crisis in which botj have to work together for the greater good.

Remember when Trump banned China travel what opozition said about him? And more in USA every state is free to do his own thing so you cant say as Jowy said trump killed hundreds of thousands...And both examples I gave there handled the pandemy way worse the USA if you count the deaths / population and no the opozition didn said the prime ministers of those countries killed the people, which I think shows some serious civility from theyr part.

I could say even in Romania our prime minister killed the people but the truth is the people are responsible for what they do and even when you do everithing you think is good(many things in this pandemy were first good after proven bad and vicerversa) people still die. I heard democrats acusing Trump killed hundred of thousands and was like do the democrats believe people in USA are that stupid to believe something like that? Biden even said to people to look at facts but he dint show any..., and no one called him.

[Charriu]

And I didn't say he killed them. I said he wasn't helpful to the situation. Examples:

- He didn't promote wearing masks, on the contrary
- He continued doing rallies.
- He didn't help the states, when they requested help
- He promoted bullshit like bleach and disinfectant injection

[Gustaran]

 

[mackoti]

And I didn't say he killed them. I said he wasn't helpful to the situation. Examples:

- He didn't promote wearing masks, on the contrary
- He continued doing rallies.
- He didn't help the states, when they requested help
- He promoted bullshit like bleach and disinfectant injection

Thats totaly differnt sayng wasnt helpful and actualy saying like Bidden he killed those people, big big difference.
They wish so much Trump to be bad they blame on him things he never done.
Trump fascist is one of them... If Trump was fascist none of them would had not speak those about him because was dead or in jail and saying that in country were most of the mass media is against him and not a single reporter /media worker got to jail  for that, makes you wonder if those people realy understand what fascist means. I remember some journalist having a picture or Trump head is her hand and nothing happened to her, is that fascims might be some form of watered down , trump fascism were everyone laught at the mighty leader and him reacts by giving them names, I bet jews would loved that kind of fascism.

[Charriu]

And I didn't say he killed them. I said he wasn't helpful to the situation. Examples:

- He didn't promote wearing masks, on the contrary
- He continued doing rallies.
- He didn't help the states, when they requested help
- He promoted bullshit like bleach and disinfectant injection

Thats totaly differnt sayng wasnt helpful and actualy saying like Bidden he killed those people, big big difference.
They wish so much Trump to be bad they blame on him things he never done.
Trump fascist is one of them... If Trump was fascist none of them would had not speak those about him because was dead or in jail and saying that in country were most of the mass media is against him and not a single reporter /media worker got to jail  for that, makes you wonder if those people realy understand what fascist means. I remember some journalist having a picture or Trump head is her hand and nothing happened to her, is that fascims might be some form of watered down , trump fascism were everyone laught at the mighty leader and him reacts by giving them names, I bet jews would loved that kind of fascism.

You can be a fascist and journalist can still speak freely. It just means that you didn't take full control and power of the whole state yet and eliminated all checks and balances.

[mackoti]

And I didn't say he killed them. I said he wasn't helpful to the situation. Examples:

- He didn't promote wearing masks, on the contrary
- He continued doing rallies.
- He didn't help the states, when they requested help
- He promoted bullshit like bleach and disinfectant injection

Thats totaly differnt sayng wasnt helpful and actualy saying like Bidden he killed those people, big big difference.
They wish so much Trump to be bad they blame on him things he never done.
Trump fascist is one of them... If Trump was fascist none of them would had not speak those about him because was dead or in jail and saying that in country were most of the mass media is against him and not a single reporter /media worker got to jail  for that, makes you wonder if those people realy understand what fascist means. I remember some journalist having a picture or Trump head is her hand and nothing happened to her, is that fascims might be some form of watered down , trump fascism were everyone laught at the mighty leader and him reacts by giving them names, I bet jews would loved that kind of fascism.

You can be a fascist and journalist can still speak freely. It just means that you didn't take full control and power of the whole state yet and eliminated all checks and balances.

So did trump eliminate anithing till now? You know he is leading for 4 years now? Not one single of his political adversariers are in jail or something, not a single journalist not even a wistlebower(or how they call them)  were, if i read right Obama got like 8-9 of them convicted and the all administration before him managed to get just 3....Fascism is what Erdogan doing in turkey...

[Mjmd]

Empires and democracies rarely go from peak to ruins governed by dictators. Empires rise and fall over time. Systems slowly weaken to the point of collapse. The failure of an elected body to stand up to a leader when that leader only cares about their power has been the downfall of more than 1 democracy. Never take freedoms for granted and assume nothing can happen.

I'm not saying Trump will end up a dictator, but the pattern of a president pushing his power with impunity is not a good precedent. It may not be today, but blatant attempts at voter suppression and pure tribalism is not a good sign. Neither is using power to try to get other countries to help influence your rule.

I would say this forum has more history nerds than most political conversations. We all know things change.

[Charriu]

And I didn't say he killed them. I said he wasn't helpful to the situation. Examples:

- He didn't promote wearing masks, on the contrary
- He continued doing rallies.
- He didn't help the states, when they requested help
- He promoted bullshit like bleach and disinfectant injection

Thats totaly differnt sayng wasnt helpful and actualy saying like Bidden he killed those people, big big difference.
They wish so much Trump to be bad they blame on him things he never done.
Trump fascist is one of them... If Trump was fascist none of them would had not speak those about him because was dead or in jail and saying that in country were most of the mass media is against him and not a single reporter /media worker got to jail  for that, makes you wonder if those people realy understand what fascist means. I remember some journalist having a picture or Trump head is her hand and nothing happened to her, is that fascims might be some form of watered down , trump fascism were everyone laught at the mighty leader and him reacts by giving them names, I bet jews would loved that kind of fascism.

You can be a fascist and journalist can still speak freely. It just means that you didn't take full control and power of the whole state yet and eliminated all checks and balances.

So did trump eliminate anithing till now? You know he is leading for 4 years now? Not one single of his political adversariers are in jail or something, not a single journalist not even a wistlebower(or how they call them)  were, if i read right Obama got like 8-9 of them convicted and the all administration before him managed to get just 3....Fascism is what Erdogan doing in turkey...

No you are right that none of the checks and balances is eliminated, just undermined like Mjmd described. That's also why I specifically didn't say Trump is a fascist. I just wanted to point out that a fascist and freely speaking journalists are not contradictory. And I absolute agree about Erdogan.