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WW48: Melllvar's Grand Competition!

To clarify my stand on the Commodore-issue:

His jumping from pindi to Q endangering himself close to the Deadline is very strange. If we lynch C and he turns out as scum it would warrant a very close look on pindicator. If C turns out as town we can look at others as that would be a null-tell on pindi and we can look and see how pindi plays today.
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I'm going to bed shortly, but I wanted to make one more observation on this before I start looking deeper at people.

(October 4th, 2020, 01:59)Rowain Wrote:
(October 3rd, 2020, 18:03)Jabbz Wrote:
(October 3rd, 2020, 13:03)Rowain Wrote:
(October 3rd, 2020, 11:35)Meiz Wrote: Rowain, on which of my eod reads would you agree or disagree with?

novice + gaspar townish

Commodore,pindi good lynches for day 1.

What makes them good lynches old timer? As an old man my eyes aren't what they used to be, so if you could paraphrase your argument that would be most appreciated.
Look I posted that during the night
(October 3rd, 2020, 10:01)Rowain Wrote: The lynch should have helped us clear some suspicions /alignements Q rolling as traitor makes that a lot harder especially as we don't know if the wolves knew about him or not.

1) Case pindi is scum:
1.a the wolves didn't know about Q: That makes those voting and pushing for Q look bad at first glance but there were enough votes and enough anti-towntells that he had a lot of villagers on him.
1.b the wolves did know about Q: that makes those that pushed for Commodore look scummy if Comm is town.

2) Case pindi is town:
2.a. The wolves didn't know about Q: The wolves had a very relaxing day and could easy move their votes around especially if Comm is villager. If Comm is scum those pushing him up to 4 votes are rather towny
2.b. The wolves did know about Q: Those pushing for a not-Q-lynch especially those pushing the pindi-waggon hard do look scummy.

Course of action: Lynch pindicator, lynch Commodore.

During the end of the day we had 3 main-pushers: Lewwyn for the Q-lynch, Meiz for the pindi-lynch and Gaspar for the Commodore-lynch to keep in mind if one of those die tonight

I really don't like the feel here. It seems odd to be setting up two days worth of lynching, including a specific justification for the second if the first turns out wrong. 

(October 4th, 2020, 02:29)Rowain Wrote: To clarify my stand on the Commodore-issue:

His jumping from pindi to Q endangering himself close to the Deadline is very strange. If we lynch C and he turns out as scum it would warrant a very close look on pindicator. If C turns out as town we can look at others as that would be a null-tell on pindi and we can look and see how pindi plays today.

All based on this. It just seems very weak to me. Maybe something will pop out when I go back and read through the EOD stuff again. Still two lynches, plus two killings, all spent focusing on the fish and the bee could put town in a very dangerous place.
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How so? If Commodore is scum, that's great. If town, we can look at Pine in a different light just like Rowain suggests above.
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Directly above your post is a clarification. Besides this are my ideas to go forward. You are free to provide your own ideas instead of parroting things other have already posted about.

I wonder how many lazy people will still come  with "Hey lynching C and pindi is not good and I don't like Rowain for suggesting it. "

Why are you sure they are both mislynches? Why didn't you provide better targets yesterday. You voted for commodore then and today he is suddenly a bad lynch for you.

So any reads whom we should lynch instead Jabbz?BTW Commodore has currently 4 votes on him not one of them is mine so what about those others that are voting C at the moment do you not like them and their arguiments too?
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Hmmhmm, Jabbz seems suspect on the point he makes above. How are the posts Rowain made turned into potentially wasting two lynches on Com & Pind, when in fact he has just said how Pind's play will get a strong review if Commodore is town. I don't get a feeling he's looked into the scenarios with town mindset at all. A notch up for Jabbz.
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On the subject of lining up lynches, I've actually written a note on my wall to mistrust Lewwyn if Commodore & Pind end up scum, and I suggest all of you to do the same. White paint is not that expensive, whenever this game is over!
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(October 3rd, 2020, 14:25)Kaiser Wrote:
(October 3rd, 2020, 13:11)Rowain Wrote: Why Gazglum? well if he is town then perhaps because the wolves needed to find a target with little chance for protection or watchers.

But ther eis no garanty he is town. Maybe he had a sacrifice but power through any defense ability with delay like poison. In WW26 scum had and used a sacrifice but kill the other surely skill

Maybe that was the reason for the pick, but it is an awfully easy explanation to point away from any of Gazlum's research.
I am not sure I follow your argument here Rowain:
- there is no warranty (am I misreading this word because it is close to the German word for warranty (Garantie)?) that he is town?
- He might have had a sacrifice power as wolf killing himself to ensure a later kill on somebody else

This does not seem to be very well thought through, as part of your above description was a subset of thrawns abilities and that would not fit with having only one night kill.


And that is worth a vote? and how does it not fit with 1 nightkill?
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And another question for Kaiser
You vote me for pointing away from Gazglums research:

But you don't mention Gazglum's research at all. Just in case you have missed it: He was on GES most on day 1and thought GES scummy so why are you not pursuing Gazglums research if you hold it in that high regard?
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Good morning everyone! Apologies for not being around yesterday (and it's very concerning for me that no one noticed - how many other people are lurking and getting away with it?).

I think trying to untangle Day 1 when there's a pretty good chance of hitting scum is the productive way to go, though, so that means Comm and Pind deserve the most scrutiny. Commodore gets my vote - there's just SO LITTLE content there; the lurking concerns also apply. We talk ABOUT Commodore an awful lot but he's hardly saying anything. Untangling Day 1 + hitting a lurker seems like the smart strategy by far.

Commodore's one-line posting style is making it way too easy for him to do things without good explanations. A Commodore re-read just jumps out with how much of our Commodore discussion doesn't involve him at all.

Other people need some pressure/involvement too (note to Jabbz - Commodore is trying really hard to not be useful, that's the biggest reason why there's been a case on him), but Commodore seems like the most useful and most obvious choice today.



And for anyone (mostly Rowain) wondering about the Gazglum-is-almost-certainly-town argument, think through how Night 1 makes sense if he's a) a wolf or b) a non-wolf scum (Traitor, SK, etc):

There was only 1 nightkill, so in order for Gazglum to not be the wolves' kill, two things would have to happen:
1) The wolves' kill would have to be blocked/delayed - sure, that's possible, BUT:
2) then there needs to be an SK kill - also possible, but then that kill needs to hit a wolf who had very little suspicion on him whatsoever? AND the alignment was hidden by either the killer or by Gazglum's ability (a third party's involvement in this scenario is way too absurd for me to contemplate at this point)?

3) The other possibility, that Gazglum was a vigilante target, that's just pure  smoke . If the only dead person had been, say, Pind or Comm - who could have been a viable vigilante target (and notably a very poor wolf target, as they're either wolves or likely mislynches), then I'd agree with the skepticism. But a vigilante shooting Gazglum is absurdly unlikely. Yes, I know we have had unlikely vigilante targets before, but still, this would be a worse kill than any of superdeath's in WW46, including the one where he shot the same villager the wolves did!

If Gazglum isn't town, and it's really hard for him to be a wolf, then he'd either be:
Traitor #2 - that sounds like an awful setup to me. And again you're saying we hanged a traitor and then the wolves ate the other one? As the first two kills???
Serial Killer - well that would be funny and good for us overall, but makes very little difference on how sincere Gazglum's reads may have been - he would probably want to be a good villager or at least good enough to avoid suspicion. Also less likely as SKs often have some sort of defense.

Gazglum was town. Not knowing his role hurts because it would give us some more setup information, but his arguments should be treated as confirmed-dead-townie arguments. If we lose because we treated a 99.5% read as a 100% read, then so be it.

I reserve the right to take back this logic sequence if Rowain turns up as a dead Vigilante or Serial Killer.
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(October 3rd, 2020, 18:20)Commodore Wrote:
(October 3rd, 2020, 15:48)novice Wrote: Commodore and Pindicator, instead of high fiving each other, why don’t you help us expand our horizons?
Were, ticker*chirp*
< I'm happy swimming in this tunnel, thanks. >

Waldorf: *groan*

Statler: What's wrong with you?

Waldorf: It's either this post or indigestion, I hope it's indigestion.

Statler: Why?

Waldorf: It'll get better in a little while.

Both: Do-ho-ho-ho-hoh!



Yup, I'm keeping my Commodore vote right where it is. There is no good explanation for declining to contribute for no apparent reason.
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