[SPOILERS] Woden and ljubljana like boats

[ljubljana]

Turn 25 - Phoenicia



Finish the settler, and start the monument. There doesn't seem to be much of a hurry to grow to size 4 at the moment, since the second city's growth is the limiting factor in hitting the EE inspiration, so I work the sheep instead to get the monument in 6 instead of 8. That should shave 4 turns off the marble time, and at size 4 I'll work marble + fish instead of the sheep. Meanwhile, I'll save gold for the horse and GP tile buys and the first trader.

No sign of the barb scout yet, which makes me nervous. I do think I'll have the warrior escort the settler though, because we can't stop the scout if it shows up outside the city within the next 3 turns anyways, and we can cut off its retreat to the camp with the other warrior if it shows up any later than that. I'm open to arguments that I should just reroute both warriors to the camp ASAP though, especially since I think the camp's close enough to spawn horses if activated .

As long as the scout doesn't show up on the forested hill east of the city on this next interturn, which would be the fastest possible time, I think we should be safe, since the warrior will move onto the other wheat next turn, then attack the camp the next turn, then move onto the mercury and attack again after that, which should be able to cut off the scout if it shows up any later than that. But if it really did beeline for my capital by the most direct possible route, we could have a big problem on our hands soon.

[ljubljana]

Turn 26 - Phoenicia



Well, that figures . By my count, it had to have both spawned on the mercury (no other tile next to the camp would have worked) and beelined directly for the capital by the fastest possible route for this to happen. And it's a horse camp. What a disaster.

Well, how do we minimize the damage? I would sacrifice the warrior to take out the camp now if that would work, but I don't think it will - I don't think three hits will be enough to get past the spear, and we won't get more time than that before the infernal horses start spawning. The warrior's on 4/15 experience, so we can't get in two hits and a promotion either. We can put the promoted warrior on the forested hill where the scout is now to at least limit the damage they can do by that approach. For the second warrior, I see a few options - the sheep hill will keep it close to the camp and let it sally forth to attack HAs, maybe in conjunction with the promoted warrior stepping out onto the tile 1E of where the scout is now. Or, we can leave it on the hill 3W of its current position to cut off access to the second city, which could be a serious vulnerability if they decide to go for it.

I really, really, really don't want to have to switch the capital off of actually useful builds and onto warriors just shut down this camp. But...if things go badly up here, that could be in our future .

[Woden]

Turn 26-Vikings
Units move and I switch off the pearls to shave a turn off the longboat. I have enough for a pantheon and unless someone else also has enough to get the pantheon, I will get it next turn....
   

Too bad about the barb scout but I don't see a reason for worry. Have your warrior move to the mercury tile by the camp in hopes of blocking the scouts path. Not sure if you can get there in time but worth a shot. Two warriors should be enough to handle the barbs. The best pay is to find a forested hill and just fortify and let them kill themselves attacking into you. Barbs won't take a capital since it can't be razed, so you are in no threat to lose a city. At worst, they can pillage your horses, which may allow them to spawn horsemen but I don't think they will spawn with when it is pastured.

[ljubljana]

Turn 27 - Phoenicia



Not much to report, just some warrior repositioning in anticipation of the first barb wave. We can't get to the mercury this turn due to ZoC, which means we won't be fast enough, since the scout will definitely reach the camp next turn. I think the play is therefore to wait out the first wave with defensive positioning, then move on to the camp itself. Hopefully no other camp spawns in the meantime, which would cause some serious problems.

Archduke gets 2 empire score from somewhere? I think it's just double city growths, though, since they don't have an early half-cost district or anything. That said, we're probably going to see some of those start showing up from Japan and Russia soon, since everyone knows where Astrology is.

Next turn, I'll found the second city and buy the horse tile, at which point both cities will be on track for growth in 8 into the EE inspiration. I might also buy the GP tile soon while it's still cheap, depending on how ridiculous you think that placement is? I'm pretty convinced that the GP should go at the capital at this point, since no other city has the food supply or growth head start to set up strong TRs as quickly as we need to get the other cities off the ground. Of the eligible capital spots, I don't see another one that will ever boost anything useful, really, other than 1NE of the capital which will only boost the one Cothon. The pinned placement does nothing until Apprenticeship, which is a significant drawback, but I'm just not sure I see any better options if we're not going for campuses at these cities.

[Woden]

Turn 26-Vikings
No one else selected a pantheon this turn, so I get to choose one...
   

I decided on that gives culture to plantations since I will more of those than pastured resources. By the looks of the available pantheons, I am 2nd with only Earth Goddess taken. Mysticism will finish in 5 turns, then I will go for Early Empire so I can get a few more settlers out. 3 more turn until I settle my second city. Plan is to buy a builder at second city while building a monument and have my capital build a builder after the longboat, then build another longboat before doing double settlers while running the 50% card.

[ljubljana]

Congrats on getting your first-choice pantheon - to me that suggests that there's at most one religious city-state out there giving someone the free envoy boost, which should give me okay odds of grabbing the pasture pantheon by virtue of winning some horrible 4-way tie through the turn order tiebreaker. Russia and Japan will probably get holy sites out too quickly for that, but maybe I'll manage to be first among the rest of the lowlifes .

Your builds sound like a plan to me! I think I'm still hoping to do SW next to boost it for you and to accelerate Cothons, hopefully enough so that I won't need to build any settlers without them in place. Then, the plan will be to hit EE and FT while the first two cities actually build the Cothons, followed by a wave of settlers. As far as production goes, the second city will spend eternity making its builder, while the capital moves on to probably two biremes in a row after the monument. Hopefully we'll have SW in place by the time those finish, and can then go GP-Cothon-settlers after that. Does that seem viable to you, or do you think we need an unboosted settler in there somewhere to avoid falling too far behind on expansion? Having never played Phoenicia before, I'm not really sure about how feasible it is to go all the way to Cothons on just two cities... My best guess is that CelNav will probably come in at around t50 with this setup, maybe a little sooner if we take the beaker promotion with Pingala. A third city at t60ish seems very slow, but maybe following that up with 4 or 5 settlers in a row at +100% production will make up for that...

[Woden]

Turn 27-Vikings
Start off with...
   

Look at the tech tree and masonry is next. I start working on that so I can harvest the stone at my second city location. Plan is to quarry the stone to get the boost and the production while I get out a monument but then will harvest it into a Holy Site.

I think I found my 3rd city location...
   

It has some better production potential and at least 2 plantations for some extra culture. Two turns from settling my second city.

[Woden]

Congrats on getting your first-choice pantheon - to me that suggests that there's at most one religious city-state out there giving someone the free envoy boost, which should give me okay odds of grabbing the pasture pantheon by virtue of winning some horrible 4-way tie through the turn order tiebreaker. Russia and Japan will probably get holy sites out too quickly for that, but maybe I'll manage to be first among the rest of the lowlifes .

Most likely Indonesia settling on the coast. Remember, there are no free envoys in this game and too early for anybody to have earned one.

Your builds sound like a plan to me! I think I'm still hoping to do SW next to boost it for you and to accelerate Cothons, hopefully enough so that I won't need to build any settlers without them in place. Then, the plan will be to hit EE and FT while the first two cities actually build the Cothons, followed by a wave of settlers. As far as production goes, the second city will spend eternity making its builder, while the capital moves on to probably two biremes in a row after the monument. Hopefully we'll have SW in place by the time those finish, and can then go GP-Cothon-settlers after that. Does that seem viable to you, or do you think we need an unboosted settler in there somewhere to avoid falling too far behind on expansion? Having never played Phoenicia before, I'm not really sure about how feasible it is to go all the way to Cothons on just two cities... My best guess is that CelNav will probably come in at around t50 with this setup, maybe a little sooner if we take the beaker promotion with Pingala. A third city at t60ish seems very slow, but maybe following that up with 4 or 5 settlers in a row at +100% production will make up for that...

If you have time, you should read the start of my PBEM18 game. You will be behind in expansion but if done right, you will be able to slingshot past everybody, both in science and expansion.

[ljubljana]

Turn 28 - Phoenicia



Linear A founded, taking us to 6 bpt. In 8 turns, we'll shoot up to 10 bpt, which is plenty for ensuring fast Cothons. Meanwhile, the warriors scurry around in the east and hold their breath...

It'll probably be a close call on whether it's worth it to finish SW unboosted or wait for the first Cothon. Let's say Mysticism comes in 3 turns from now - it'll then take 15, by my count, to get SW, with it finishing on t46. In the next 8 turns, we'll finish Astrology and about a third of Writing (which currently displays a 9t cost) - after the science boost, we'll then finish the rest of writing in 6t * 3/5 = 4t, and CelNav in 15t (its current cost) * 3/5 = 9t, giving us the tech on t49 and the first Cothon maybe 4t after that. So doing SW unboosted will speed the GP and Pingala's culture promotion by roughly 7t, which just about breaks even on the cost of the boost. The reason it's probably worth doing, therefore, is production - with the unboosted research, we can go boat - boat - GP - Cothon next and start settlers immediately after the Cothon finishes (which should be around when EE comes in as well), while we'll have to wait for the GP itself after CN finishes otherwise.

If you don't have any objections to this GP placement, I think I'm going to buy the tile next turn while it's still just 55 gold. I'm hoping that the monument and marble will let us pick up one of the two tiles between it and Cuneiform so we won't have to spend any more, but, even if not, we should still be on track to have plenty of cash for the first trader when FT comes in.

[Woden]

What if you build another builder at your capital. Go for Foreign Trade next, then SW to boost, then switch to EE once you reach the boost level. Builder chops the forested grassland hill into a Cothon when you can build them, maybe finishing it on that turn or the next. You can have your capital build a trader instead of a second ship and get Linear A going a little quicker. You could also get the shipbuilding card going to get your first ship out once you finish Foreign Trade. Go for builder next or a slinger to help with the camp.

I am not sure the best route here. It is just that the time you can get a Cothon out and the time you finish an unboosted are close enough to consider alternatives. Yes, you maybe able to recouple your lost culture but there are other considerations. An earlier trader, more civics completed. An additional builder and less production put into a boat, etc. The additional builder could also hook up the crabs for more gold or sheep for more production.

I think your placement of the GP is good. An alternative spot would be 2 tile south of the horses to boost Campuses/Holy Sites, but you also lose hill tiles for production. Your initial spot is probably good.