[PB59] Ichabod realizes Civ 4 PB is for closers only

[Ichabod]

   

Probably meeting my first neighbor soon, as this jungled land bridge appears to be similar to the one to my NW, I bet there's a player blob at the other side of each one.

[darrelljs]

Do you still need iron working to clear jungle? That green dot spot feels like the best of the bunch due to food surplus. Are barbs off?

Darrell

[Ichabod]

Do you still need iron working to clear jungle?  That green dot spot feels like the best of the bunch due to food surplus.  Are barbs off?

Darrell

As far as I know, you still need IW. Barbs are on. The problem with green dot for a second city is that there's no way to get both resources in the inner ring. We currently have no Mysticism and we can't afford to tech it before BW and AH, at the least. Considering this, we'd only get both resources improved and worked 20 turns after settling the city (that's just a guess, but it wouldn't be pretty for sure), which is bad for the snowball. But we'll probably settle it right after the second city, as it's really awesome.

[Ichabod]

   
Welp, the marble basically confirms my map impression. Considering we are 24 players and the current known setup leads me to believe we'll have 4 players connected in a diamond shape, I think we have 6 of those diamonds on the map and the sea to the south of our Capital will lead to other people's Capitals.

[Ichabod]

Sorry for the lack of updates. Here's the news from the past few turns:

*Eastern (NE) neighbor is Cornflakes (CRE/PHI of Native America). Found his Capital. I didn't get to see his city center and didn't want to declare war. Terrain is basically mirrored, but he has spices where I have incense, I think.

*Norhtern (straight N) neighbor (not exactly sure, I've just seen the scout, but likely) is Jowy (AGG/CRE of Byzantium).

Cornflakes is probably better at the game than I am. I think I was slightly ahead of Jowy when I played my last game, but now he's likely better as well. The layout of the map, that I don't specially like (not complaining, I just prefer more natural maps), is good for me, considering I don't have early traits. The CRE civs can't really steal much land from me, when our blobs of land are separated by jungle strips. Everyone kind of have his own backyard and that favours me. Also, it's good that I am not a direct neighbor of Jowy (at least I think I'm not), since he has phracts. At the same time, CF has to worry about that and will perhaps not care about me that much.

I'm top food in this turn, with improved corn + deer. Take that, haters! 

BW in 2, revealing copper before I settle 2nd city. Warrior will be built when I grow to 4. The idea is to 2-pop whip the settler. After that, I'll improvise.

   
   
   

[darrelljs]

Sorry for the lack of updates.

I just assumed my lack of value added input was the culprit . Hopefully Sedora pokes his head in...

Darrell

[Serdoa]

<Poke>

[Serdoa]

1) I see nothing sexual in this thread - this is called false advertising!
2) I don't like white dot. Why not 1SE of the wheat, onto the incense? That allows to settle a turn early, can share some tiles (fish) and you can forego improving the ivory right after the deer, instead improve the PH, move onto wheat the turn you settle and improve it. 
3) AH will take some time, even if you start it right after BW. You will have your next settler ready at that point, so settling red dot than is better imo.
4) In general I think you are not sharing enough tiles with your dot-map. Getting more cities and therefore more production queues is imo better, especially early when you are far from working all the tiles a city has available in any case.
5) You need warriors / fog busting. By my first micro-plan you'll only have one when you settle city 2, so maybe think about bringing the scout back to fogbust? I think barbs spawn at T20? Animals maybe earlier? I can't remember.
6) Wonders are a trap imo, especially if all start with marble/stone. Also they do only give 50% bonus, so it still costs quite a bit. SH of course would like winning the lottery, but I'm not sure you can risk what would be necessary for that.
7) Dot map again: You could settle red dot 2W, white dot as I suggested and another city 1W of your white dot location. Food would be Fish / Wheat for my dot, Wheat / Crab / Pig for White and Pig / Cow (and Rice) for Red. 
8) Your yellow dot could also be settled even with my plan IF it is an actual island. 2 tile apart rule only counts for same landmass.

I think that is all I can see for now.

[Ichabod]

Sorry for the lack of updates.

I just assumed my lack of value added input was the culprit .  Hopefully Sedora pokes his head in...

Darrell

I'll keep you as my scape goat when I fail to update for 50 turns straight.

1) I see nothing sexual in this thread - this is called false advertising!
2) I don't like white dot. Why not 1SE of the wheat, onto the incense? That allows to settle a turn early, can share some tiles (fish) and you can forego improving the ivory right after the deer, instead improve the PH, move onto wheat the turn you settle and improve it. 
3) AH will take some time, even if you start it right after BW. You will have your next settler ready at that point, so settling red dot than is better imo.
4) In general I think you are not sharing enough tiles with your dot-map. Getting more cities and therefore more production queues is imo better, especially early when you are far from working all the tiles a city has available in any case.
5) You need warriors / fog busting. By my first micro-plan you'll only have one when you settle city 2, so maybe think about bringing the scout back to fogbust? I think barbs spawn at T20? Animals maybe earlier? I can't remember.
6) Wonders are a trap imo, especially if all start with marble/stone. Also they do only give 50% bonus, so it still costs quite a bit. SH of course would like winning the lottery, but I'm not sure you can risk what would be necessary for that.
7) Dot map again: You could settle red dot 2W, white dot as I suggested and another city 1W of your white dot location. Food would be Fish / Wheat for my dot, Wheat / Crab / Pig for White and Pig / Cow (and Rice) for Red. 
8) Your yellow dot could also be settled even with my plan IF it is an actual island. 2 tile apart rule only counts for same landmass.

I think that is all I can see for now.

1) Welcome to the internet in 2021. My click bait mastery is a key to victory, as opponents will concede the game just to see how a innocent civ game could turn NSFW.

2) My thinking was that I wanted 2 6 yield resources with the second city (I feel like I've repeated this same line in my past 10 posts ). My mental calculations were pointing to AH being available for that, but it seems you are right and it'll take a long time (long time means 5-10 turns after the wheat is improved). Your proposed white dot can work and I think you are right about getting space for some more cities. Unofrtunately, I already started improving the ivory this turn, but I'm not sure we lose a turn on the wheat, as the ivory will be improved one turn before a mine would (because we didn't lose a turn moving to it) and we can make up for the extra walking turn to the wheat.

In that case, do you suggest fishing after BW? And a WB after the settler? If we place the warrior on the plains hill, we can defend the 2 cities for a bit, I think.

Anyway, we'll be able to see copper next turn, so perhaps we can reassess after that. I just worry that white dot would be a bit too weak... Well, fish + wheat is good enough, I guess.

Do we get a TR between your new proposed city and the Capital straight away? Or do we need fishing?

3) Settling red dot as the 3rd city, you mean? Wouldn't the green city be better, for corn + pig? We'll have the 3rd ring Capital border by then. Or do you think we should settle green dot closer to the Cap, perhaps sharing the deer, getting only the pig?

4) Noted, trying to work on that. Your proposed white dot is a good start, I think.

5) Animals are already roaming the land. My scout is really far away, but I can try to circle him back. For now, we'll be going with a one warrior defense puzzle.

6) Wonders never crossed my mind. My wonders will be national wonders only for the foreseeable future. I rather not try to get wonders and just have a solid game than risk getting one for a good position, failing, and playing a handicapped game until someone ends my misery.

7) My problem with your suggested red city is that it doesn't have food before the borders expand (unless we settle the new white dot before it for the pigs). That city would have to be settled after the new white dot, and the new white dot won't be our third city (a city to the north of the Capital is better, I think). So, in that case, we are looking at red dot as 5th, 6th city. Would you delay the gold for so long? Or do you think we settle this new red dot and work just the gold at size 1 for a long time?

8) Yeah, no problem there.

Thanks for the input, Serdoa. Hopefully you won't get too frustrated with my lack of planning. I should probably be simming all this, but I don't enjoy doing it that much. I hope I can have a decent game without it, even if I can't really be a contender.

[Ichabod]

Some new screenshots to help discussion. I didn't finish the turn, so we can discuss what to tech next (and wether to revolt to slavery now, I think in this turn or the next, because otherwise we'll revolt on a turn with the ivory already improved). More info later.