[SPOILERS] Woden and ljubljana like boats

[Woden]

After CS, my plan is to finish Exploration for Press Gangs, which I will need soon as I won't have the gold to upgrade caravels quickly enough to keep up with TAD's production and will probably need to have my cities actually build some from scratch. If you'd prefer, though, I can finish Games and Recreation first to inspire it for you if you need the policy swap sooner.

I already have G&R, so just go for Exploration and am not in a rush for the policy swap. It will work even if it is on T125 or T126. I just need to upgrade at least 1 Frigate so my cities can attack with their strength.

[ljubljana]

Wait, I'm dumb, I meant Medieval Faires, not G&R. I'm not sure I will actually finish Exploration by t125 (looks like I have around 4t to go just on CS), but I will check on the ETA on my turn. I do have a few turns put into it already, but not as many as I would like. I assume you already have the boost for Exploration anyways, though, so I guess you're not waiting on me at all if that's the choice.

93 gpt is great, by the way. We might actually have a GPT approaching TAD's between the two of us...we'll have fewer ships at the outset, but maybe we'll have a chance to out-economy them once they have to reallocate all their TRs. I'm going to keep sneaking in traders between ship builds where I can to try to keep from falling further behind there too, since I still have two unused TRs and am about to have a third from the IA. I am also probably going to ask you for a large amount of gold in 6t for Embolon caravel upgrades - I hope that's okay. I assume the play is to funnel gold towards those for the time being since I'm unfortunately the only one with GA access.

How would you feel about sending a few of your ships to keep an eye on TAD's southern ports (eg the ones south and west of WotW)? I could do so myself, but I'd have to commit one or more Embolon biremes to scouting in order to do so, which seems likely to lead to TAD sniping them before I can turn them into caravels.

[Woden]

I do not have the boost to Exploration, since it is 2 caravels. Go for Exploration, as we will need it more than the other. I will look at my turn. I might be able to straight research something to get us the boost. Maybe work towards Reformed Church.

You can have all my gold except for enough to upgrade a Frigate and I need to buy a couple of tiles for encampments. I should be able to activate the district discount by T125 and can chop out 2 cheap encampments at Thor and Loki. I should be able to send you at least 600, maybe more.

[ljubljana]

Oh, right, once again I am dumb and confused the Exploration boost for the Cartography one. That's what happens when you're as sleep-deprived as I am right now, I guess. But yeah, 600 gold would go a long way towards fixing this military disparity we find ourselves facing. I am hopeful that I will be able to have almost all of my Embolon biremes upgraded plus 4-5 frigates once Cartography comes in, enough for a credible attempt at a first strike.

Not 100% sure encampments are worth the cost of tile buying, since I doubt they'd slow down TAD much if they win naval supremacy and TAD is pretty unlikely to engage our ships within range of them, but I'll defer to your judgement on that.

[Woden]

I think if we can survive the initial attack from TAD, we will win the war. Kaiser looks to be not building his military up, since he has been at <400 MP for a while now. TAD will lose a big chuck of his income when war is declared and I am not sure if he will have a suitable replacement to get as much gold as he is now. I am currently working on getting 4 more trade routes over the next 20 turns and will get Cartography done around T130. If you can hold off, we should be able to crush him when I hit Caravels and can upgrade a bunch of my longboats.

[ljubljana]

I sure hope you're right. Kaiser seems to be focusing on settlers at the moment, my GA spotted several of them embarked towards various islands in Australia's direction. This makes sense in the abstract, since Kaiser's a bit behind on city count, but it does seem like a strange choice if your ally is about to start a total war...

I think after this wave of quads comes in and all my core cities get their walls, I should probably try to get Press Gangs up and start hand-building caravels and frigates rather than more quads to upgrade. That way, we can allocate our gold towards upgrading our large numbers of existing ships while still having our actual production centers contribute useful reinforcements. With Press Gangs and a Cothon, Cuneiform will get around 70 hammers per turn towards frigates, which is a 4-turn build - that's not too bad IMO.

[ljubljana]

Open the save to this:



What do you think - should I take him? If I do, there's a 2/3 chance TAD would then immediately get either Yi Sun-Sin or Santa Cruz, and since TAD has 2 Medieval admirals already, they could immediately retire whichever one they get to create a unit that will be extremely difficult for us to deal with. I'm not sure why the game's even giving us the choice to pass here - presumably TAD has also passed, but I thought passing on a GA forces the next player to take them? That's what happened to us with Leif Erickson...



Here's the GP screen. I'm making 24/turn and should be able to recover from passing fairly easily, but TAD has a huge backlog and honestly may be able to get and retire at least one of Yi and SC regardless of what I do... If TAD manages to get both and create an 87 base strength ironclad armada (99 with GA+OL+RC), that will probably be the death knell for our chances of resisting them... I think I probably have to pass to make that less likely, even if it means only having one Medieval GA in position when war breaks out. Kaiser's making 10/turn, so if I pass and TAD doesn't immediately take Magellan, Kaiser will get to him in 4t, which is too slow to reach us by the time the war breaks out.

Any thoughts?

[Woden]

I think passing is the better play. Then at least you can get 1 of the next 2, unless you think TAD will lap you once he gets the next one.

[ljubljana]

TAD is definitely going to lap me, they are already almost there and are making way more GA points from their Dockyards. If I pass, I think Japan will get Magellan and then TAD will get 2 Renaissance GAs and I will get 1, and hopefully the 1 will be either Yi or SC so I can retire him to counter whichever one TAD gets. It is the case that all 4 Renaissance GAs will be available, right? Even though it's the only era with 4 instead of 3? If I end up getting stuck with an Industrial GA instead it would be a major setback. That shouldn't be particularly likely, though, since I think the fact that I'm between Kaiser and TAD in turn order will let me get a crack at the next GA even if TAD is outproducing me by a million GA points.

[Woden]

I say pass and take the one after TAD gets his next one. I think it will go Kaiser->TAD-You if you pass. That way you will get either the ironclad or the armada GA.