[PB60] Lurking the Final Frontier

[Charriu]

I absolutely agree. I already wanted to reload when I saw that Amicalola was also in there.

[Tarkeel]

We might have a concession from every relevant player:

Superdeath isn't explicit, but still pretty clear:

Amica deserves this win, whether it takes the others 5t or 50t to realize it... is beyond me.

Mjmd isn't explicit either, but states he depends on Jowy.

Amica flashing a cannon to sow fear. I mean what do I have to fear? This game is probably over. I think we have less chance than PB56. Amica has all the econ combos going and a lot of cities. HOWEVER, I really regret not withdrawing my concession in BP56. I'm up for the fight as long as Jowy is.

Jowy is as explicit as it comes, and it even leaked out in the tech thread to the degree that Mjmd is hunting him down for PB62.

I'll throw in the towel officially and concede to Amica. I wanted to see a few more cities burn for fun, but the turn split will slow things down.

What says the lurkerati?

[El Grillo]

Yep, I’d say Jowy’s latest post seals the deal.

[Charriu]

Looks like it. Although I would like Amicalola to finish his turn and giving us another turn of data.

[Amicalola]

Charriu, will your stats for this game include science and gold from civics and buildings? E.g. Monk wonders, Representation.

[Charriu]

Yes they do.

[Mjmd]

Oh and don't ask me how Mjmd manages to make less science then gold. This is the first time I saw these numbers and I have no clue why.

With this map there were a lot of fishing villages and then a lot of actual good cities. Actual good cities got both libraries and markets, so for the most part I was producing = except of course for the shrine. T150 I think* I was also upgrading triremes into caravels.

[Charriu]

Oh and don't ask me how Mjmd manages to make less science then gold. This is the first time I saw these numbers and I have no clue why.

With this map there were a lot of fishing villages and then a lot of actual good cities. Actual good cities got both libraries and markets, so for the most part I was producing = except of course for the shrine. T150 I think* I was also upgrading triremes into caravels.

Ah yes the shrine is most likely the reason for this behaviour. Forgot about that.

[Charriu]

Another PB in the books. Here is the T191 report. As always all the data can be found here: PB60 Tracking

General state of the game

• We saw GKC decline against Jowy and Mjmd
  
• Jowy used the Vikings excellently in his war against GKC and later Amicalola
  
• Amicalola finished Lazteuq almost at the same time as GKC died.
  
• Lazteuq made himself comfortable on his island exile.
  
• Mjmd made some gains against GKC, but got backstabbed by Superdeath, which slowed his development.
  
• Not many wonders were built in the last 41 turns and all of them by Amicalola. Notre Dame (T171), Sankore (T177) and Spiral Minaret (T185)
  

First of all the city count

1. Amicalola = 38
   
2. Mjmd (IMP) = 24
   
3. Jowy = 19
   
4. Superdeath (IMP) = 8
   
5. Lazteuq (IMP) = 1
   
6. GKC = 0
   

And here are the current amount of pop across those empires at the T150 mark:

1. Amicalola = 270
   
2. Jowy = 238
   
3. Mjmd (IMP) = 212
   
4. Superdeath (IMP) = 48
   
5. Lazteuq (IMP) = 1
   
6. GKC = 0
   

Amicalola is clearly in a leading position right now, but his two competitors are still standing.

With this PB I'm also tracking gold at 100% and science at 100%. These numbers include stuff like monk economy, modifiers and others. Keep in mind that these numbers are virtual as nobody can run 100% of gold or science for all the time. Here you will see the gold numbers with the science numbers in parenthesis.

1. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 1356 (1858)
   
2. Mjmd = 920 (810)
   
3. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 883 (740)
   
4. Superdeath = 135 (185)
   
5. Lazteuq = 31 (35)
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 0 (1)
   

If it wasn't clear by now then these gold and especially science numbers show that Amicalola is clearly in the lead. I think it's also worth mentioning how much the players gained from modifiers, monk economy and the likes. Looking at the total commerce collected I can see that Amicalola gained 274 gold and 776 beakers just from these other sources of income. The other players meanwhile are in the 100-300 areas.

Next let's see how the players do if we add up all the gold numbers (and science in parenthesis).

1. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 66858 (76796)
   
2. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 54917 (57650)
   
3. Mjmd = 48206 (47419)
   
4. Superdeath = 27563 (29461)
   
5. Lazteuq = 21607 (27800)
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 11338 (12509)
   

Jowy is still carried by his early game successes, but like with the T150 report Amicalola has overtaken him by now. Like with the current turn number I can also see that Amicalola earned around 16000 beakers just from modifiers, monk economy etc. compared to Jowy only earning around 8000 extra.

Now we have to set everything in context of maintenance. Thankfully I am now tracking the full picture of maintenance across all relevant data (unit cost, unit supply, civic maintenance, city maintenance and inflation). Because I was asked this in the past corporation maintenance is also tracked by this data, because that is going into the city maintenance. Adding everything together we have the following current turn maintenance numbers:

1. Lazteuq = 43
   
2. Superdeath = 117
   
3. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 317
   
4. Mjmd = 454
   
5. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 509
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 0
   

Here we see the full power of ORG. Amicalola isn't that far off from non-ORG player Mjmd and Amicalola has 1.5 the amount of cities as Mjmd and more pop. Similarly we see the other ORG player being way lower in maintenance compared to his more or less equal Mjmd. It's also worth mentioning that both Amicalola and Mjmd used their courthouse bonus to further decrease maintenance.

With this maintenance we can now get a clearer picture of the current gold rates, which present themselves this way

1. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 847
   
2. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 566
   
3. Mjmd = 466
   
4. Superdeath = 18
   
5. GKC (AGG) = 0
   
6. Lazteuq = -12
   

And here the accumulated numbers of accumulated gold - the accumulated maintenance.

1. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 38273
   
2. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 32676
   
3. Mjmd = 17607
   
4. Lazteuq = 5505
   
5. Superdeath = 9478
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 2863
   

More dominance by Amicalola. But Jowy isn't doing so bad too.

Financial Bonus

As a disclaimer just as last time, here I collected all the extra commerce a player (would) have gained if he was working Financial tiles. For example if you worked a river hamlet tile you normally gain 3 commerce and 4 commerce with FIN. In this case my tool notes down 1 extra commerce. You will also find that I am tracking the CtH implemenation of Financial as well as the normal BtS implementation for comparison. Keep in mind that this is the first time we are playing with the newest FIN nerf, which was that water tiles only give extra commerce with a lighthouse present.

Looking at the current turn numbers first:

1. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 186
   
2. Mjmd = 177
   
3. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 171
   
4. Superdeath = 27
   
5. Lazteuq = 0
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 0
   

From the other numbers at hand I can see that everybody has lighthouses in play in almost every city. Now this statistic is interesting. It shows that the cottage economy of the leading players are almost equal. We already learned that Amicalola's leading position so far came from other sources like reduced maintenance and modifiers etc. This is another proof of that.

Here the accumulated numbers:

1. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 9305
   
2. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 9110
   
3. Mjmd = 8216
   
4. Superdeath = 4296
   
5. Lazteuq = 3944
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 2089
   

Similar things like with the current turn numbers. Amicalola's lead came from other sources.

But how much would the players have made without the lighthouse-FIN-nerf. For this it is worth looking at the numbers from the previous FIN version, which did apply extra commerce for land tiles at 3 and water tiles at 2. Here the accumulated numbers:

1. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 9777
   
2. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 9202
   
3. Mjmd = 8869
   
4. Lazteuq = 4595
   
5. Superdeath = 4590
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 2338
   

Lastly how sever is the recent nerf at the moment. Here the comparison for this lighthouse implementation compared to BtS (delta, reduction in percent):

1. Mjmd = 2196 (-21.09%)
   
2. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 1919 (-17.40%)
   
3. Lazteuq = 1714 (-30.29%)
   
4. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 1491 (-13.81%)
   
5. Superdeath = 1003 (-18.93%)
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 681 (-24.58%)
   

Like with previous PBs we see that the lighthouse nerf is down to some reasonable percentages at this point in the game. If we only focus on the 3 relevant and intact empires we see a reduction  between 13%-21%
It's also good to know what the reduction would be without the lighthouse-nerf:

1. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 1827 (-16.57%)
   
2. Mjmd = 1543 (-14.82%)
   
3. Lazteuq = 1063 (-18.79%)
   
4. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 1019 (-9.44%)
   
5. Superdeath = 709 (-13.38%)
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 432 (-15.60%)
   

Again if we focus on the 3 relevant empires we see a reduction between 9% - 16%. Looking at all these numbers it looks to me that the lighthouse nerf had just the effect I wanted that is reducing the commerce output in the first 100 turns.

Protective Bonus

This is the first time we are playing with the 100% trade PRO bonus and unlike last time we now see a difference between both implementations. Here are the current turn numbers with the difference towards the previous 75% trade variant in parenthesis:

1. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 186 (14 +14.81%)
   
2. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 83 (16 +23.88%)
   
3. Mjmd = 76 (4 +5.56%)
   
4. Superdeath = 14 (0 +0%)
   
5. Lazteuq = 6 (0 + 0%)
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 0 (0 +0%)
   

We clearly see the effect of war around the players when domestic trade routes become more lucrative again. In addition we see one of Amicalola's additional income sources being trade thanks to the Great Lighthouse and Carthage UB. For comparison. Most of the trade routes at this point in the game were domestic according to my numbers.
Also here are the cumulative numbers with the delta and percent towards the previous implementation in parenthesis again:

1. Amicalola (PRO,ORG) = 8309 (555 +6.68%)
   
2. Mjmd = 3328 (146 +4.39%)
   
3. Jowy (FIN,ORG) = 2903 (496 +17.09%)
   
4. Superdeath = 1569 (0 +0%)
   
5. Lazteuq = 879 (0 +0%)
   
6. GKC (AGG) = 448 (0 +0%)
   

Amicalola's combo of PRO, the great lighthouse and Carthage clearly contributed to his great standing in this game. I'm also very pleased with the late game buff towards PRO, which at the same time makes the trait easier to digest.

Misc

I'm tracking a lot more but there is not enough information there to justify an own paragraph. Therefore a little summary here:

• AGG is there and may be noticable at this state of the game. Then again it can't (and shouldn't) compete with the rest of the eco traits
  
• Jowy is still paying the lowest unit maintenance out of the top players with 20 compared to Mjmd (83) and Amicalola (121). But consider that he must have lost a lot of units in the last 10 turns, because previously he was on the same level as Mjmd. How big exactly was your military, Jowy?
  
• Mjmd generated the most great people so far (8) followed by Jowy (5) and Amicalola (4) Lazteuq (3) and the rest (1)
  
• Players really like running slavery. Only exception is Jowy, who ran Caste System since T143
  
• Oh and the barbarians are running Caste System since T184. Good for you guys.
  

Comparing traits

The main goal of all this tracking of course is to compare the economic traits related around commerce income or maintenance reduction. So let's do this:




Regular readers will notice that I changed the layout for these:

1. With one exception we see the usual order of FIN->ORG->PRO->AGG
   
2. That exception of course is Amicalola with Great Lighthouse and Carthage
   
3. One thing that this statistic does not reflect is the additional benefits of ORG in the lighthouse, courthouse and with that further reduced maintenance. That's why I believe that ORG is either better the FIN right now or on equal terms.
   

GG Amicalola. Looking forward to the next game.

[Jowy]

My knights were just wiped out. Maybe my pikes as well if Amica attacked on the last turn.

Do the numbers take into account the extra cost for being in enemy territory?