October 29th, 2021, 21:22
(This post was last modified: October 29th, 2021, 21:32 by ljubljana.)
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Hmm, this is a little concerning. If he attacks Abugida this turn, it will be one turn before I finish Medieval Walls there and the city could fall quickly. But if I sail down to fight him directly he will first strike me and I will take major losses even at the islands. 293 + 173 + 58 (my gpt income) = 523, just short of the threshold to upgrade an ironclad fleet (580). Blah.
I can at least leave my fleet in position to first strike him if he does go for Abugida. He has been cautious so far, maybe he will stay cautious and try to spend one more turn pushing me back if my fleet is still in theater. I will also finish Enlightenment for the policy swap, since it looks like I will need Bastions sooner than later.
Agreed about pushing your fleet up, and probably we should take some clads out of the southern cities (eg Hod) that are not being immediately threatened and add them to the main fleet. If he tries to take Abugida, at least we should be able to get some kind of a surround on him, and he would have to commit frigates to cracking the city at the same time as he tries to fight us off. But ofc I would also be careful to not move into range of a full first strike from his whole fleet if possible, like you did last turn.
edit: I could also try to fight him off for exactly 1t, which would give us a number of defensive advantages at Abugida - medieval walls, Bastions, and an ironclad fleet upgrade. But I do not know if the number of ships I would lose would be worth it. Best guess is probably not...we really need the first strike to have a chance to take down this fleet, and at least we would get that if he goes for Abugida this turn.
October 29th, 2021, 21:33
(This post was last modified: October 29th, 2021, 21:47 by ljubljana.)
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What are the support bonuses of those ships next to the fog? Would be nice to know how far north this fleet extends. I could maybe give him a small first strike at Abugida to buy the city one more turn for the defense strength upgrades to come in, but that only seems worth it if it doesn't cost too many ships. There may not be that many frigates in range of the city this turn if we are lucky.
edit: If there are ships NW of the admiral in the fog, they may be in range of the GA-boosted portion of my fleet. I assume williams has taken this into account...but if there are NOT shipw NW of the admiral in the fog, he probably does not have more than a handful that could hit Abugida.
edit2: Another reason to be careful with ship deploys is that he can move past you before DoWing if you are out in the open to get a surround. If you move up, probably best to stick close to the shore in some kind of harbor, like that at Heimdall (though that one seems a little too close to his fleet), to limit the possibility of that.
October 29th, 2021, 21:56
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The northern most frigates are at +12 and the caravel is +14. The two frigates along the northwestern angle (with the GA and Courser) have +14 support and the lone double promoted frigate in the west along my coast has +8 support (which I don't get because each ship should give +2 and there are only 3 unfogged tiles where ships could be located, so maybe a embarked unit gives support too?). My best guess would be ships on all the fogged tiles north and west of Balder.
October 29th, 2021, 21:57
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If we did attack this turn, you are actually in a pretty good position to fight him...you could get a partial surround in the south and, if you moved the ironclad out of Balder, he could not escape that way. And I could move my fleet down and reoccupy the islands in a good defensive position. We would also both be engaging him on the same turn and wouldn't have to worry about our fleets being too separated to help one another. And Balder's defensive fire would make it tough for him to reposition, while you could move clads through the city at will. If we are going to commit to giving him the first strike, this is actually not a bad place to do it, the only issue is how much damage that first strike will do...
October 29th, 2021, 22:04
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If there are ships on all the fogged tiles, I THINK that means at least some of his ships are in range of the GA-backed portion of my fleet. But it's hard to tell from this shot...do you think you could post a more northerly shot that shows my fleet positions, with the support boni pinned? If we can get a partial first strike in, it might be worth going for it...we may not get a better chance to engage positionally, and I don't like the thought of having to switch off ships and onto pike and shot if Abugida gets attacked...
October 29th, 2021, 22:04
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Here is a better look...
October 29th, 2021, 22:06
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(October 29th, 2021, 21:57)ljubljana Wrote: If we did attack this turn, you are actually in a pretty good position to fight him...you could get a partial surround in the south and, if you moved the ironclad out of Balder, he could not escape that way. And I could move my fleet down and reoccupy the islands in a good defensive position. We would also both be engaging him on the same turn and wouldn't have to worry about our fleets being too separated to help one another. And Balder's defensive fire would make it tough for him to reposition, while you could move clads through the city at will. If we are going to commit to giving him the first strike, this is actually not a bad place to do it, the only issue is how much damage that first strike will do...
To be clear, I can not attack anything this turn. They are all to far away or if I did attack, it would be a lone ship that would get wiped out. I can move up and pressure him though.
October 29th, 2021, 22:08
(This post was last modified: October 29th, 2021, 22:09 by ljubljana.)
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Thank you! Do you know if there are ships in that last line of fogged tiles based on support bonuses?
There are so many of them...
edit: Looks like I may be able to attack, but only with a few ships, caravels and 2-3 frigates. Not sure that's worth it...
October 29th, 2021, 22:18
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The front line is fully supported, so more ships on the fogged tiles. Whatever you do, I think you pack your ships in tight to maximize support bonuses. I think our best option is to have you retreat a little bit and see if we can draw him between us and China and then I can plug the hole between Heimdall and Balder, basically pinching him in and negating his extra movement.
October 29th, 2021, 22:19
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If I move north and he attacks Abugida next turn, I'm not actually going to get in much of a first strike, am I? I would have to retreat north past the Mitla/Abjad pair, and he can use ironclads to block that while his frigates work on Abugida. Maybe if I retreat another turn, he will just accept the small first strike that I can deliver and start working on the city so he can faith-buy Cossacks. That would be quite bad for us since he would get a ton of damage in before I have Bastions up and block my Medieval Walls...
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