[SPOILERS] Woden and ljubljana like boats

[Woden]

Agreed on not attacking that caravel, it's a trap for sure. I think Russia is making a bit of a mistake by splitting his ships against me like that, it means the Hieratic group is without a GA and I should get a kill there this turn. And they gave me a free shot at Cuneiform too...?

How much does your single IC do against that frigate fleet at Cuneiform? Could be a good trade (one IC for a fleet frigate) if you can knock it into kill range of the city center + the frigate inside. Other that that, I think your fleet IC up there should probably retreat...

A single ironclad will do about 70-80 damage against a fleet frigate. Probably a good trade. Maybe I could send my fleet ironclads up by Runic, just out of range of any ships we can see and then if he sends more frigates to Cuniform to kill the ironclad, I can kill them. A fleet can 1-shot a frigate fleet.

[ljubljana]

Ok, definitely think we should take the single IC for fleet frigate trade then.

As for hiding the fleet IC, that could a good idea if you don't think he will guard with melee ships. Trading IC fleets for frigate fleets is still probably good for us. If I get good die rolls we might be able to kill 3 frigate fleets this turn, which would be very impactful (3 fewer battleship fleets!). He will probably scout you though after we kill the frigate fleet, so perhaps it is better to pull back for now and wait a turn until we have the movement edge.

[Woden]

That could a good idea if you don't think he will guard with melee ships. Trading IC fleets for frigate fleets is still probably good for us. If I get good die rolls we might be able to kill 3 frigate fleets this turn, which would be very impactful (3 fewer battleship fleets!). He will probably scout you though after we kill the frigate fleet, so perhaps it is better to pull back for now and wait a turn until we have the movement edge.

He would scout what killed the frigate but not the northern sea. I might also send you 4 coal to have maintenance coal. Then, bring your ironclads just outside Linear B, in reach of Cuneiform. If he moves on Cuneiform to kill my ironclad, we may be able to kill more ships. He also may have just wanted to hit the city once to stop more walls from being built and will focus on Hieratic and Abugida before pressing Cuneiform.

[ljubljana]

The wall block shot seems likely, but that is a poor use of an invaluable frigate fleet IMO. And yes, once we have the movement advantage, I think my IC and caravels and your IC should lurk just out of range of his ships and try to find opportunities to pick off frigates.

As for the northern sea, your single IC will be decently far west of his Hieratic fleet at least. Is there anywhere you can stash them where they are in range to pick off frigate fleets but out of range of his lead ICs this turn? I would just hate for you to lose your ships literally two turns before they get +2 movement and Russia loses +2 movement...

[Woden]

The wall block shot seems likely, but that is a poor use of an invaluable frigate fleet IMO. And yes, once we have the movement advantage, I think my IC and caravels and your IC should lurk just out of range of his ships and try to find opportunities to pick off frigates.

As for the northern sea, your single IC will be decently far west of his Hieratic fleet at least. Is there anywhere you can stash them where they are in range to pick off frigate fleets but out of range of his lead ICs this turn? I would just hate for you to lose your ships literally two turns before they get +2 movement and Russia loses +2 movement...

I can stash them 10 tiles from the western most frigate at Hieratic, 6 tiles from Cuneiform. His GA is by Abugida so his northern frigates should only have 8 MP (5 + 2 dedication+ 1 GL) and would not be able to fire. If he has a caravel NW of the fleet frigate, it could hit my ironclads but wouldn't be able to kill them.

[ljubljana]

Okay, fine with me then. His ICs might still have 10 movement if he has some around, but as long as he doesn't kill you, you can retreat past Runic next turn if he scouts you and tries to attack. For my part, I will move my own clads and caravels such that they can hit things by Cuneiform once the movement bonus comes in next turn.

You might want to send 5 maintenance coal instead of 4 if you have it though - I am not sure if dropping to exactly 0 coal is good enough to not incur the CS penalty...

[Woden]

Turn 179-Vikings cont.
I hit the frigate for 80 damage, received 12 in return...
   

My 2 ironclad fleets are hiding up by Runic. I have 3 more single ironclads inbound and 2 more finishing next turn over in England (I also have 2 finishing on my mainland). 

Sending my new ironclad around the southern tip of the mainland, I ran into a privateer...
   

Since I can't retreat, I decide to kill it and move my other ships down to group them together. Not sure what is waiting in fog to spring the trap but hopefully this is a little far for them to travel. 

Incidentally, I did the same thing over by Australia...
   

I moved the ironclad out to see if I could find his ships in the fog and ran into this guy. I killed him and assume my ship will die but maybe not. It would take a bunch to kill him. Regardless, that is one less privateer for pillaging and I suspect he was going for the niter. 

Down by Australia...
   

Both my frontline berserkers lived but are badly damaged. I sent the triple-promoted one north to heal in TMMLP. The double promoted one was sent next to the city. He might die because there is a crossbowman coming from TLET but those are only doing 5-7 damage and this guy has 12 HP. You do need to take out the walls at MBDF so he does die from the city. Also, roland does have a field cannon now. I spotted it on one of the lumbermill tiles by the little point in the west when I moved the ironclad fleet down. 

Next turn, I get 4 more frigates out. I got out 3 this turn. Here is what I have right now...
   

Slowly rebuilding my fleet. They are currently spread out a bit and I will need to merge a few into fleets as I will shortly hit my coal cap but I will also hook up another source in 4 or 5 turns. I have a few more chops at England but I am slowly depleting choppable features but with a little builder love, most of those cities will be able to 5 turn ironclads.  I will get a few chops out of Australia's lands too. 

Finally, I will start bombarding one of Kaiser's cities next turn. I figure a few turn of bombardment and then I can take it. Then a few turns later, I should be able to attack his last one.

[Woden]

Wild idea for a little down the road, what do you think about using all your frigates in the southern sea to go after Olsyabya and raze it. I could use my fleet ironclads and you hit it with your frigates. It would take a few turns but the city has the Great Lighthouse and it would slow Russia down a bit. I am going to hit Fuji's holy site next turn to hurt that cities production and I think only the cities we can see can contribute to any ship building. I can chop out a few frigates out of the Australian cities and maybe plan on upgrading them, then hit the city before Russia can get battleships.

[ljubljana]

Turn 180 - Phoenicia

As far as attacking Olsyabya goes, I like the idea, but it would be VERY slow. Here is the kind of damage we would be looking at with my best, GA-boosted ship:



It will probably take us 4-6 turns of maxed-out frigate attacks to take any given Russian city, and we would need to take Fuji as well or my frigates will wither and die under a hail of city defensive fire. I think that would mean giving up our chance to really put the hurt on Australia before they hit WoR + Nationalism + Steam Power, which seems not quite worth it to me, as Australia offers the most additional Woden productivity per frigate fleet turn (to use the relevant ROI metric ). If we end up having spare time left after defeating the Australian navy and conquering their core, our frigates will be right by Russia's original capital and best-developed cities, which would probably hurt them about as much as razing this undeveloped but GL-bearing city. Now wouldn't that be a noble last ride for my zombie fleet of ghost ships, the pride of the Phoenician navy going up in flames in the harbor of Borodino...

hey it's my thread I can fantasize if I want to



...right, anyways. I got some pretty good rolls in the city attack, and it should be ready for you to take next turn. Luckily, the caravel's sudden appearance should not set me back too much, as the Ark Royal, at exactly 50 health, is ready for a fourth promotion to heal off the two attacks from last turn. Then, I moved the rest of my ships back up north to avenge your ironclad, should roland be foolish enough to go for it. I am far enough away that my deploy is unlikely to be scouted, and if we are lucky, he will attack without factoring in the Golden Age bonus movement and give us a good trade.

Looking at the north (yeah, I'm really procrastinating on Russia this time...):



I do not know how long it will take for roland to capture Anoch Sun, but he has two turns before I get walls there, as I am dropping the obsoleted Twilight Valor for Limes next turn. That might be enough, but I do not really care, as that city is terrible and was taken mostly to deny it to Kaiser. In fact, I am quite happy he is going for this target rather than, uh, using this fleet to help defend his exposed core...

One annoying thing roland could do is sneak a decent-sized navy past Mato Tipila in the north to try to pillage our harbors. I am considering sending those two caravels up there to block at the choke and hopefully delay that, although I doubt I could prevent it entirely. But again, the more force he devotes to doing things like that, the less he has back at home to defend his cities, so it's probably not the worst trade if some ships do make it through.



Well, I got the easy frigate fleet kill from the one you injured, and one more from a slightly-injured double-promoted fleet at Hieratic. At Nsibidi, I had a choice between killing the privateer fleet or going for a somewhat long-odds kill on the double-promoted frigate fleet. This time, I chose the latter, as the privateer is terrible against cities and my primary aim to minimize the speed of his conquest. But I missed the kill and had to settle for decent damage on both of the two frigates. Probably the wrong choice there, those two frigates will be out of action for 3 or so turns now, but I would rather have sent at least one Russian ship to the bottom of the ocean... This is why you ALWAYS go for the kill, kids, unless the unit being killed is hugely less important than the one you're taking potshots at.



Tile reallocation at the doomed Hieratic, where I am giving Russia the mines it shares with Cuneiform to deny them a few pillages. I thought about giving them the lumbermill with the injured P/S as well to get a scorched-earth pillage, but decided against it as that tile would give +5 to their Cossacks in a spot that threatens to seriously undermine my defenses. I am getting a bit worried about my P/S line collapsing, to be honest, as I am about to lose Twilight Valor and Russia is starting to be smart about Cossack positioning and tactics. I may have been a bit too eager to declare an end to the pillage campaign earlier, I did not envision them having enough faith income to continually to flood me with units as they have been doing...

[Woden]

Are you planning on building more P&S or are you thinking of going back to ships? You could merge some of the P&S to give them +10CS. Also, what 3 dedications are you thinking? I would take all but the one that provides the production equal to campus adjacency. That way you get extra movement, 15% production for units, and your trade routes can't be pillaged plus +3 gold for each district in the destination ((W)Odin has 5 districts).

As for faith for Cossacks, I think he is making a bit over 300 per turn and gets 15 faith for each pillage from Theocracy. Probably enough for a Cossack each turn. I am a little surprised he has the horses. They cost 10 horses each but they have no encampments for extra storage, so they had 50 horses each plus whatever they are making per turn. I haven't looked to see what their supply is but he has to be limited on what he can buy each turn.