[SPOILERS] Woden and ljubljana like boats

[ljubljana]

In fairness to my computer, I'm not sure I like the WC screen all that much either

Got my one vote submitted. It didn't even let me vote against my own proposal like a good parliamentary proceduralist, the only choice was whether or not to spend 10 favor on it.

edit: It was my computer's fault last time, PYDT froze after downloading the save and I guess didn't quite get it all. This time, no idea. But we will see if Bruindane is able to play or not, I guess, or if save corruption converts all your destroyers into Russian ones, or something...

edit2: I shouldn't be complaining as it's a major stroke of good luck that Australia's favor appears to be going to waste without converting into a +2 against you. But...why couldn't I vote for that emergency? And, for that matter, why couldn't Australia propose one against you for your own ancient city-state conquests? What is going on with this game... I just wish I knew how the mechanic worked so that I could, like, use it... (Never mind that my own illiteracy last turn is probably exactly why this happened )

[Woden]

Turn 193-Vikings cont.
Where to start, let's go to Japan/England. I see a notification that the campus at the former Japanese capital was pillaged. Luckily, I have a builder I have been saving to hook up the oil nearby once the coast is clear available to check things out...
   

I also brought the ironclad I had in the area (but too far to hit the 2 by the city) over and ran into another privateer. I hit the one by the city with the city once and got a bad dice roll, letting it live with minimal health. The one by the IC was sunk after the policy swap. Russia also pillaged the campus at Illmatic, so 2 science pillages for Russia.  

I pillaged the oranges at Japan and the harbor at Oracle Bones and was able to upgrade 8 destroyers and pay 560 gold for a policy swap (I guess I am off by my understanding of the cost of these). That leaves me needing...
   

19 coal and 8 oil. I am making 24, so now my ships can heal is they need too. I did end up killing the caravel by Cuneiform. I just couldn't leave it there for Russia to see anything. I didn't get a screenshot of my final position but I moved my battleships NE of Runic, out of range of any Russian ship unless he has some by the ice in the north but williams482 doesn't seem the type> I also upgraded a destroyer on the NE nub of Cuneiform's borders, which gave me vision east and it was all clear. I think Russia is retreating and heading towards W(O)din. 

Here is my policy swap...
   

I left in the coal card. My income is now negative but barely and the new trader in 2 turns should cover the deficit. 

Over by Australia...
   

I moved my ICs up and didn't find anything. A couple of other things going on in this screenshot. Look at all those trade routes in the south. I think I have seen all 4 of the routes inside College Dropout in the water at some point but there is also minimal roads heading down to Russia, meaning those are water routes. There is potential for 8 traders to pillage. Add in the improvements at Borodino and there are some juice targets down there. Finally, notice the builder on the oil tile. He will need 1 turn to remove the farm, 1 turn to hook the oil up, and 1 turn to get 3 oil for upgrades. We might see subs in 4 turns. 

Finally, lets check in on Japan...
   

I pillaged the citrus and had enough movement to move east . I also moved my injured berserker up. Not sure if Kaiser can kill him with the samurai and crossbow alone but probably could if he suicides the musket. Regardless, the city will be mine once I can pillage the theater square and cotton.  Those will probably go into Conservation while I slow research Totalitarianism. It will finish when the War Department finishes.

[Woden]

I think with the city state emergencies, you have to have had an envoy in the city to be included. I don't know if you ever did. Other than Russia, I don't know if anybody did.

No clue why Australia couldn't call one because I have his capital. Maybe just not paying attention.

[ljubljana]

Those privateers at Tibbet's Brook may have survived this turn but they won't get far. I think with your IC and my caravel we are guaranteed to get them after williams' next turn if we play our cards right.

Ok, I am getting weirded out now about the total absence of ships in Russia's homeland. Where are all the privateers? Surely he will attack next turn when I move up at Rodeo and not just let us pillage his traders...right? I counted and he had 7 turns to build privateers since Turn 186 when it became clear that he would need them. We killed 4 in that time but I would expect at least 10 more...

re emergencies: Well, that does make sense, pretty sure I never had an envoy there, and maybe Australia didn't have one in your CSs either. We probably seriously lucked out on the timing on Australia. I bet the game decides which emergencies you are part of on the first turn you are eligible to propose, which would be Australia's t182, and doesn't change its mind on the next round even if major events occur in the meantime, such as, uh, your capital getting conquered...

[Woden]

If he had privateers near his capital, I don't think we could see them unless right next to the city center. It is curious that there are no other ships around unless he correctly assumes one of us has a spy there. In that case, they are probably up by the northern island waiting for us to go for the cities or splitting the distance between Australia and our mainland, just in case I was move my fleet to his core instead of chasing him off by your capital. Either one is plausible. I think we will have a better idea on my next turn.

[ljubljana]

We are totally walking into a trap, huh? Well, I do think we can fight off 10 privateers, which can probably kill 3 of our ships but will be badly outclassed on the counterattack once they have revealed themselves. And if it's worse then that, well, on your turn you can take Rodeo with one clad and the rest of our ships can run for it, I guess. The nice thing about fighting pirates is that they do not exert ZoC themselves in addition to ignoring it, so they can't really trap us like other ships could unless they can form a solid wall to block our escape.

Sadly, we have to cross the horn at some point, and the longer we wait, the more he will build up. So I do think this is the time to do it, in our narrow window before he has sub access, and not in 2t when the destroyer gets there (which can only incompletely scout for pirates anyways). We might get punished, but what else is this fleet going to do, really? Let posterity record that I thought this was a risk worth taking at the time, and am therefore responsible for whatever catastrophic consequences may spring from its undertaking...

[ljubljana]

The more I think about it, the more I think we really need to devote a couple of ships in the south to not just privateer duty but to "watch for embarked engineers" duty. If they are smart, they are researching Fission now and will beat you by 2-3 turns with the science pillages. Then, Imperator Aleksandr looks like this:



I count cow (3) + coal (7) + 2 mines (8) + 4 lumbermills (20) + 1 quarry (3) + 1 lake tiles (2) + coal plant (6) + Lavra (not sure, let's say 16) + city center (2) = 65 base hammers/turn. A 15-turn Manhattan Project and 28-turn nuke clock, assuming I didn't miss any hammers and there's nothing else out there to accelerate this. Borodino has oil (5) + 2 lumbermills (10) + 2 mines (8) + quarry (3) + 7 coast/lake tiles (14?) + workshop (3) + IZ (3) + coal plant (9) + Lavra (unknown but looks like 12) + city center (2) = 69 hammers/turn for similar timings. We need to at least make sure your first nuke out of Thor can beat this, or, if that's not possible, we need to find the engineer and kill him before Russia can create a silo to launch nuclear strikes against your core.

But I don't know what happens if we beat them to the first nuke, really, other than burning down a nasty Russian city or taking out 7 Russian warships. That won't exactly force a concession when every city is making nukes. One thing is for sure, I think - unless they are researching the wrong tech now, we are not going to get a window where one player has nukes and the other doesn't, not for more than a handful of turns, at least. If no one concedes before then, the nuclear warfare is going to be prolonged and mutual 

And what does that mean? Russia winning because they have more production? Us winning because you have more uranium and more total cities to serve as targets? China winning after we nuke each other into the ground? I don't know, but...strap in, folks...

[ljubljana]

What does their uranium situation look like, by the way? If we are looking at an apocalyptic nuclear war, we may want those cities to be our first targets over the ones in the Russian core...

[Woden]

What does their uranium situation look like, by the way? If we are looking at an apocalyptic nuclear war, we may want those cities to be our first targets over the ones in the Russian core...

There seemed to be good distribution with everybody having 2 sources.

First nuke will go to the Great Lighthouse city because it has his only Encampment. You need Armories to build Engineers. No Engineers, no forward airbases or missile silos.

As for his production, you also have to consider unhappiness. Cities at -2 have a -10% penalty, -3 or -4 is -20%. Thor should get close to 100 production once I finish Conservation and get a few more trade routes.

[Woden]

Quick turnaround on the world Congress. I voted for both resolutions. I also marked Russian/Australian uranium. They have 4 sources that I can see on there island but 1 on the east coast by the cities I captured and the only 3 are in Russia.