Pitboss 66 Tech and Setup Thread

[Miguelito]

Bit late, but why did we not vote on spies? Have they ever even been perceived as a problem in past games? If Ramk can change the option in a running game, do we want to vote on it? I suppose nobody has made their pick dependant on that option. I kinda want spies but it's not a big deal.

[superdeath]

Bit late, but why did we not vote on spies? Have they ever even been perceived as a problem in past games? If Ramk can change the option in a running game, do we want to vote on it? I suppose nobody has made their pick dependant on that option. I kinda want spies but it's not a big deal.

#nope.  Spies introduce many things that are imo best left out of the game. Even with the "really" bad ones taken out. Bad enough that we run espionage on

[Miguelito]

Well that's why we could have a vote on it?


edit: whatever. I see it was not only on the second page of the voting spreadsheet where we were supposed not to look at, but also in the OP, and I could have complained earlier. Leave it then, but for the future I don't see why it should be an automatic ban.

[Magic Science]

I will summarize the actual game settings, the ones that need to be set in Worldbuilder, as they were established in Amicalola's first post and in my voting spreadsheet for the past weeks.


MOD: Close to Home 3.0.0 (the newest version)
DIFFICULTY: Emperor

TECH TRADING: Off (correct)
UNRESTRICTED LEADERS: On (correct)
EVENTS: Off (correct)
GOODY HUTS: Off (correct)
UNIT GIFTING: Off (correct)
SPIES: Off (correct)

SCORE: On (correct)
WAR WEARINESS: On (correct)
CITY TRADING: On (correct) (additional rule of 1 city trade allowed per peace treaty enforced through out-of-game means)
BARBARIANS: On (correct)
BARBARIAN CITIES: Off (correct)
BARBARIAN SHIPS: Off (correct)


So everything seems good, except maybe 2 items of housekeeping.
1: NO VASSAL STATES is the usual setting for these games, so I think it should be on as well. However, I see now that it was never edited into Amicalola's first post. Sorry for not being pushier about getting this resolved when I brought it up earlier.
2: I think that NO TECH BROKERING often accompanies NO TECH TRADING, correct? Should it be on as well? But I'm not sure if NO TECH BROKERING even does anything without tech trading, and it was also never edited into the first post, so I don't know about this one.


Lastly, there is something that absolutely should have been resolved long before this, but again I failed to bring it to completion when I brought it up earlier. What does No Spies (the rule, not the game option) mean for Great Spies? I asked about this earlier thinking that it had an obvious usual meaning that I had forgotten during my time away from the forum, but the few people who responded to me indicated that is not the case [EDIT: They indicated that there is no consensus]. So what do we do about this? Just let Great Spies move and act as they are mechanically permitted to do, or establish an honor system that limits them?

I support not placing any restrictions on Great Spies because meh, and because the snakepick is over and the game is hours from starting.

[superdeath]

Im in favor of letting Great Spies scout/do other things so long as they cant run actual missions. They are so bad in comparison to other Great People, that i think its fine.

[Ginger()]

Great Spies are already solid because of their rarity, they're guaranteed Golden Ages because of no duplication.
I think you should be able to infiltrate with great spies, but not have them hang around as scouts because it warps the vision game.
Honor system to not leave your borders until you want to infiltrate and then do it ASAP in the closest border city when you decide to.
That's my 2 cents

[Amicalola]

To be honest, I hadn't really considered Great Spies before writing my opening post because as mentioned, they're so rare. I'm happy to leave it up for a vote, for which my vote would be free movement, but no missions.

[Magic Science]

Okay, I created a new page in the voting spreadsheet called "VOTE AGAIN HERE!". In it you can vote on Vassal States, Tech Brokering, and Rules About Great Spies. If you vote Yes for Rules About Great Spies, then please clarify what rules you mean in this thread. Let's get this sorted out soon.

Link again: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1...edit#gid=0

Oh, and Mjmd, you have been included as a voting member of Pitboss 66 this time.

[Tarkeel]

Great Spies are already solid because of their rarity, they're guaranteed Golden Ages because of no duplication.
I think you should be able to infiltrate with great spies, but not have them hang around as scouts because it warps the vision game.
Honor system to not leave your borders until you want to infiltrate and then do it ASAP in the closest border city when you decide to.
That's my 2 cents

Agreed. Main reason I don't like spies, is that they warp the vision game.


Charriu has fixed the traditional reason for disabling vassal states, so I don't see the issue with leaving it off anymore. It's unlikely to matter, but I see it as a way of in-game concession, but don't particularly care.

Tech brokering is meaningless with no tech trading.

[superdeath]

It's unlikely to matter, but I see it as a way of in-game concession, but don't particularly care.

The Vikings could use some vassals...