SG2- People Who Also Still Want to Get Better at Civ IV

[T-hawk]

I am looking forward to landing Three Gorges eventually. That thing will make our production beastly. I just don't think have the health to build coal plants.

Yeah; coal plants are actually +4 unhealth; it's +2 directly (which never goes away even if superseded by a better plant) and +2 if it is supplying power (can be superseded.)

My usual tactic is to selectively build coal plants in a few cities with good health - some combination of river, coast (harbor), and extant forests. Almost always I put a coal plant in the Ironworks city and that city itself will build the Dam. The IW city has the hammer power to build itself out of health trouble, with a hospital and public transportation. Maybe one or two other coal plants if I'm also trying to build some of the Broadway-Radio line of wonders. But most cities do just wait for the Dam.

[Gold Ergo Sum]

By that logic, we would probably only build coal plants in St. Pete. There are probably a couple other cities it might work for, and would definitely be useful in Moscow, but Moscow doesn't even have the health right now it needs. St. Pete is on a river and with a coal plant will have sick production, so we should definitely build Three Gorges there. We will want to put Ironworks there first, though, I think. I had thought about putting Ironworks in another city to spread out production capacity, but really, something like The Space Elevator just needs max production.

Is there a way to determine if a city is at the proper latitude to build Space Elevator prior to trying to queue it up?

I think any future GGs should be used to build the +50% military production building in DRC and maybe Stalingard. Should we put West Point in DRC? Red Cross in Stalingrad?

[DaveV]

Is there a way to determine if a city is at the proper latitude to build Space Elevator prior to trying to queue it up?

I think all you need to do is check a forest at an equivalent vertical tile: pine trees = no; deciduous = yes.

[Thoth]

Yeah; coal plants are actually +4 unhealth; it's +2 directly (which never goes away even if superseded by a better plant) and +2 if it is supplying power (can be superseded.)

Not quite. The +2 unhealthy from the coal plant does go away once you get a nuke/hydro plant going, but ANY source of power will add +2 unhealthy to your factory.

Factory adds +1 unhealth.
Coal + factory adds +2 unhealth
Oil + factory adds +2 unhealth.
Power (from any source) + factory adds +2 unhealth.
The coal plant adds an additional +2 unhealth until it is superseded by another power source.

[Nakor]

I took a look at the save. Things look pretty good, besided that Zara is getting a bit strong. We need more of an army. I'll try to work on that on my turnset.

I think we need to do the Mass Media tech line first for the wonders AND MOSTLY to get rid of AP. After that Combustion (to get Oil hooked up) and Ind for tanks/3 gorges. After that we can go for Biology.

I think I'll be building a lot.
Regarding future targets, I suggest we move our army south first to "help" Zara in the war with Ceasar. We might be able to take some of Rome's cities before Rome falls. After that I suggest we take out Sal or Ram. Leave Zara untill the last when we have more supperior units.

Thoughts before I play?

[Nakor]

My turn! Let's see what I can do. (Sorry for the crappy pictures, forgot to turn of a program...)

Plan: Infra again and army building. Teching towards Mass Media to get rid of AP!

T255: I switch some GSpy's to GE's and do some micro.

T256: Nothing special.

T257: Communism is in, decide to go Combustion first (3t). Order up some more rifles. Kremlin is a 14t build (will finish SB first and maybe even a factory in Moscow). We get the GREAT SPY!!!!

T258: We get a GS. Decide to build an Academy in Yaroslav.

Rome is doomed:


T259: next wonder due T284



But more importantly, Zara and August make peace. Rome is save. What happened there...

T260: Zara kills our privateer. Why did we build it anyway? Zara has a huge army doing noting... not good...
Combustion in, go for Electricity next.

T261: What is August planning? Good I'm building an army.



T262: More building

T263: Things can work in our favor


I abstain.
Electricity in, onto Radio. Northern city set on Broadway (21t) for culture purposes. Should be in time for our next wonder if Kremlin somehow fails.

T264: The vote makes it! Rome has a city back.

T265: Oil connected. Workers are connecting all cities by railroad. Still going to improve Faro. It can be a better city then it is now.

T266: Sal is Pleased towards us! Order up some Public Transportations to deal with health issues....

T267: We enter the Modern Era. Radio done, Mass Media next to get rid of AP.

T268: Nothing really going on....

T269: All the same. Moscow starts Kremlin (11t), should be done by t280. And we have Broadway as a backup, finishing around t284.

T270:


Bye bye AP! I put us on Industrialism but you can veto that.

I suggest going Ind - Plastic (3 Gorges) before the Biology line.

Army build is going nicely. With Ind we can start turning out Tanks to get ready for another war. Ramses should be our next target since Sal and Zara are our friends and Ceasar is.... Ceasar.... I think Zara will go for him again, so let those two fight!

We can easily run 80-90% science. Now, how to finish this game...

Didn't build IW yet, since I didn't know where to put it. We also still have 3GP for GA's around. We can use them for mass-tanks after Ind is in...

[Gold Ergo Sum]

Good turns.

We are guaranteed to get Kremlin because no one else has Communism, so we should delay it by a couple turns to finish around T283. And then should delay Broadway for 20 turns or so and use that as our Wonder after Kremlin.

I think we should go after Caesar next if we want to win by Domination, because otherwise Zara may take him out first, and Caesar is far more backwards tech-wise than Zara. Sal and Zara should be last since they actually like us.

If we are doing space, I wouldn't even waste time on war. Just build Observatories, Factories, and rush our way to Superconductors as fast as possible.

If doing Dom, we should reduce our science rate some, and rush buy tanks and artillery in our best XP cities. We should build West Point at Stalingrad or DRC.

Ironworks cannot go in St. Pete. It has Heroic Epic and Wall Street. We can put it in Moscow, which still only has National Epic, or Stalingard or DRC.

I agree with teching to Plastics and then going down the Biology line towards Superconductors.

[Thoth]

Note that wonders only obsolete when the controlling civ gets the tech to obsolete them. The AP will be active until the controlling civ gets Mass Media.

Lisbon would make a fine Iron Works city (it will need some worker turns to convert riverside farms to waterwheels and non-riverside tiles to workshops)

I would stronly consider using the Gspy to trigger a golden age and swap civics to State Property/OR. The food corps are not going to be very strong on this map, and OR would let you spread Judaism to the rest of your cities for an extra 30gpt or so. You would also gain +2rp/+2g per state religeon building from Sankore/Spiral Minaret. Free religeon isn't doing you much good.

At the end of the GA, consider swtiching to caste/rep. You'll pick up ~150-200 bpt with rep vs US and caste will buff up workshops (you'll want a pile more in Portugal and St. Pete/Stalingrad) and give you more flexibility with Moscow's specialists.

Techwise, I would suggest heading to Biology/refrigeration/superconductors ASAP (you would be a long way ahead in beakers/growth if this had been done a couple of turnsets ago)

[regoarrarr]

I would stronly consider using the Gspy to trigger a golden age and swap civics to State Property/OR.

Yeah - I was also going ot point out that generally this late in the game, it's better to save GPs for golden ages rather than building academies in your 3rd or 4th best cities

[Gold Ergo Sum]

Techwise, I would suggest heading to Biology/refrigeration/superconductors ASAP (you would be a long way ahead in beakers/growth if this had been done a couple of turnsets ago)

There are no Wonders down that line. We had to be able to build Pentagon and now Kremlin. We should definitely do it now though.

I am not sure I want to get out of Universal Suffrage. With Kremlin, we will be able to cash rush all kinds of stuff. We also have a ton of towns now. Whatever production we would gain in workshops would not balance out with the hammers we gain from towns now I don't think, especially in our production weak commerce cities, where we still want to build infrastructure right now. Depends on if we are going for space or not.

State Property could be worth it though, depends on how distance maintenance compares with 18-20 extra trade routes. We have Forbidden Palace and Versailles at the northern corners of our empire. I agree with changing around a lot of the tiles up in Portugal. I wouldn't rip down any cottage that is close to village status or better, but anything else could be fair game.

OR could be a good idea, though if we went to Caste System, we might need the FR happiness.