April 13th, 2024, 16:21
(This post was last modified: April 13th, 2024, 16:47 by xist10.)
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Es war einmal - Once upon a time
The classic beginning for one of the most known collection of fairytales of the world.
The better known (Disney) version is rather unsuitable for FFH2, but the original versions should fit much better - I've heard.
Unlike Disney, the Brothers Grimm had adults as their target audience.
To the game:
FFH2 in the incarnation of the EitB Submod.
It's surprising difficult to find all setting.
I think this is more or less a copy of the last game ?
Six players:
Aurorarcher
Bing
coldrain
Ginger
mackoti
xist10
A bigger map as the last map and a similiar accelerated start.
I don't expect much from this game - I have no significant FFH2 experience and I think, I can't really transport my (small) BtS experience to this mod. And maybe I play to many games.
I think, this report will be more or less a mirror of my german report on civforum.de - Storythread at CF
Uploading screenshots is still not working reliably here, I think.
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Dedicated lurker reporting for duty!
I can't open the spoilers in the linked civforum thread. Do I need an account to do that?
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(April 16th, 2024, 12:03)DaveV Wrote: I can't open the spoilers in the linked civforum thread. Do I need an account to do that?
Nope; Chrome's automatic page translation (and maybe others' too; I haven't checked) somehow breaks their spoiler tags - but if you switch it back to viewing in the original German, click the spoiler tag, and then switch back to viewing in English, you can read the spoilers' contents normally. Also note that Chrome's translation software messes up picture positioning relative to text (but keeps both in the right order) which can be confusing. (Even emoji are affected by this!)
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I hope RefSteel has the solution - this is the first time I read about issues with spoilers.
My report is in the open section, so it should be accessble without an account.
This spoiler is was not really relevant. A short description, what FFH2 is.
And I have no problem to discuss things here - I will report CF first, because I host my screenshots there, but strategy ?
I will try to summarize a conclusion, but there is no need to mirror the discussion.
And welcome on board.
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Yes, RefSteel had it exactly right. I can expand the spoilers in German, then switch to English, and read the spoiler text.
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I'm glad it worked, DaveV! Annnnnd...
Stormsail Haven Wrote:A family of sea-faring dwarves long ago built their home on - and inside of - a lonely rock jutting out from the sea between two river estuaries, turning it into a safe harbor some distance off the coast that seems to be completely self-sufficient so long as the storms fill their cisterns: Using stone they brought up from within the isle and wood from the local shore, they built the rock up into a tower standing far above the waves, with enormous sails that spin gently in the constant ocean breeze - and wildly in the area's frequent storms. Made from incredibly strong, thin, durable material and anchored to the tower by dwarven skill, these sails have stood a thousand storms and in some mysterious way seem to transform the strength of the storms themselves into labor for the dwarven family. Mainlanders who fish and make their living on the seas can take advantage of the safe harbor and offered by Stormsail Haven and the light that glows on dark nights from its peak to fish the seas around it longer and more safely, and can barter with the dwarven family, taking advantage of the ease with which the dwarves - or their sails - seem to labor, and of trade with an otherwise-isolated dwarven family whose needs and products are entirely different from those of their mainland neighbors. Some hint that the dwarves made a terrible pact to attain their sail tower though, or whisper of an evil prophecy that one day the tower will be cast down and burned by raiders from the sea and nothing will remain but drifting scraps of their silken sails, valued slightly in themselves as they occasionally wash up on the rock and the shores of the sea nearby.
Your start:
And your first set of options:
Tasunke (Aggressive/Raiders) of the Hippus, with Animal Husbandry OR Calendar
OR
Dain the Caswallawn (Philosophical/Arcane) of the Amurites, with Mysticism
OR
Falamar (Expansive/Charismatic) of the Lanun, with Cartography OR Fishing OR Hunting
(Or you can throw all three back for a different set of three.)
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Thanks. More thoughts in about a hour.
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Or in 6 hours.
The Techtree is a lot shorter than in BtS, but more wide.
I can find more or less 4 Subtrees without (many) intersections.
Worldly - most military and buildingstechs - here ~7 subtrees - culture, meleeunits, trade, maritime...
"Philosophy" - economic techs (cottages) and "ideas" (feudalism for example).
"Magic" - mostly military value
"Theology" - not the best, because it has military and economic value, but often worse than Magic or Philosophy
I don't really like Hippus.
UU needs a wonder, traits have a clean military focus.
Worldspell is okay, Hero should be to late. Palast mana is okay ? nature seems to be bad, air okay, horses are nice, but IF I find some on the map, a wasted slot ?
I think, the techs are the only reason to pick them.
Amurites are my actual favourite.
I fear, I could be even more of a target, because Mig won the last game, but from options, this would be my plan too.
The focus is more narrower - only arcane units - but stronger.
UU are not that good, but still nice.
UB is good. Palast mana is top.
Hero is later than the Hippus hero ? more or less support.
Techs are not that good. Revolt in godking and research agriculture first ?
Lanun are not banned, so they should be not that good.
Very nice on water maps, but a weaker champion is not that good.
Best palast (and UB fpr watermaps) of the group.
Hero is a better boarding party. Worldspell seems to be bad - I need more than one stack to use it. Against one stack, maelstrom should be okay too.
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A few words in defense of Tasunke: the combination of Horselord (+1 movement for mounted units) and Raiders means Tasunke can strike incredibly deep into enemy territory, frequently being able to capture/raze cities defended only by a single warrior. Alternatively, he can run a pillage economy, moving through enemy territory to pillage, then having enough movement to run away. The Raiders trait doubles FfH's already boosted pillage gold; you can earn hundreds of gold by pillaging down a couple mature cottages. His lack of any economic boost is potentially a very big problem, though.
I didn't say anything during the setup phase, but it sounds like this will be a very big map, with room for >20 cities before bumping against other players. The ability to establish an economy will be key to keeping up enough in tech to be able to attack or defend.
Frankly, I'm not thrilled with any of your options. Tasunke is, as you pointed out, built exclusively for warfare. Dain can do the Philosophical great sage bulbs that Miguelito managed so well in the last game, but Mig's economy was a train wreck and he barely squeezed out his win. Falamar can build a nice pirate cove economy, given enough water, and EXP will help build FfH's very expensive settlers more quickly (but not twice as fast, because settlers tend to be built mostly with food). I think you're underestimating the Lanun world spell; most people consider it one of the stronger ones.
Out of the three, my preference would be Falamar, but a strong case could be made for throwing them all back into the pool and trying for a new set. The disadvantage of the latter move is that the other players are likely to pick off some of the best leaders and civs, leaving a weaker pool to draw from for the second round.
And, of course, it's your game and I'm just offering suggestions. You're free to ignore everything I say and play the way you want to.
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Yes, this is my game, but I value your input - my experience in FFH is rather low.
In the german thread, I wrote, that Mig won, because the map was to small - still a good game, but Mig was able to conquer Coldrain and Auro and destroy Q's army during the worldspell.
Commando units from start is something I'm relativ sure I undervalue - I didn't really considered the implications, but effectiv 8movement is horrible to defend against. Add a Metamagic1 adept (in own land) for scouting purpose ?
I'm not sure if throwing all back is a good idea. EitB has 21 civs, 19 are possibly picks. I can't really hope for a good civ in the second round - and bigger map means eco is important. Better leaders are an option, but even there are the ecotraits weaker than in BtS.
I think, the Amurites are incredible potent and I can pick actual one natural counter - Fireballs have a possible strikerange of 6 ? Extension 2, 2 movement fireball, 2 movement (haste) wizard. Not that easy to get a first strike - even as defender. Own hast spell is more or less required.
Second best military have the Hippus - I think the loss of the lategame gunpowder units is not that important.
Lanun have the weaker champion and such the worst military.
From a eco point is difficult.
The cheaper Elder Council is an argument for many small cities, which are research with the elder council, but maintance is a problem.
Lanun have the eco traits and strong coast tiles. But I expect not much water on this map. I hope for a few island, but still, main focus should be inland.
I have the Amurites as favourite, but I'm still undecided.
This should be a longer game, which should benefit Amurites most - but if I can't close the gap somewhere ?
I have Hippus at the last spot, but they are still a ziv with easy acces to movement 4+ commando units. And with 4+, they don't need railroads.
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