[PB78] Underdogs and undercats: The Mrrshan warlords visit the world of Civ IV

[williams482]

I'm a much bigger fan of the HBR play than machinery. Cheaper and a more targeted benefit.

Is Organized Religion worth two anarchy turns over a later GA-assisted Theocracy? It's definitely a nice boost, but losing two turns of yields to get into it is a very heavy price. I'm also not sure we can afford the extra maintenance relative to cheaper civics right now.

[Donovan Zoi]

Is Organized Religion worth two anarchy turns over a later GA-assisted Theocracy? It's definitely a nice boost, but losing two turns of yields to get into it is a very heavy price. I'm also not sure we can afford the extra maintenance relative to cheaper civics right now.

I must agree that OR is a costly detour, so scrapping that plan takes us down from 2 anarchy turns to 0 before the GA.  Forges + Courthouses should suffice for now since we only have one Market happiness available anyway.  And because we're considering wealth builds here and there, it makes more sense to swap in Libraries where needed as a 3rd objective as we don't have any yet.  This will enhance the time we spend at 100% and there's a cultural benefit too.

The 3 above builds will give the chosen GP city 4 specialists to devote, counting us down to a GA in 9 turns.  Less time if we use Morrig.  I think I'd like to keep the Great Engineer in Reticuli pure in reserve for the next GP, another reason to consider Hagia there if it's still available.  Just a thought however, and far down the list of priorities.

EDIT: In fact, we may want to consider starting a GP in two different cities now in case we roll a Great Engineer first, as I wouldn't want to waste it on a GA. I'll start vetting possible sites now.

I am sure the others will agree, and if so, then it appears that thrawn has successfully worn me down and I'll gladly be researching Aesthetics after HBR. 

[Donovan Zoi]

Another small wrinkle is that we will need Meditation in order to build the Paya, but it won't slow us down now that we can take the cheaper religion path with OR off the table. The only thing I would really covet from the other path is Poly's Parthenon and I'm not even sure its still available. But definitely not a worry at this time.

So that makes it:

HBR > Aesthetics > Med > (Lit) > Priesthood > Monarchy > Feudalism. Literature can be delayed a tech or two to coincide with Paya's completion.

[williams482]

Polytheism is necessary for literature, unfortunately.

[thrawn]

Meditation is also needed for monasteries to be able to spread the religion ongoing since we are not SPI. But Med and Poly are cheap at this stage and there is a small cashback with Priesthood.

[Donovan Zoi]

Just finished T126. I'll post a detailed report tomorrow morning, but first a quick diplo update:

Dreylin, Gavagai and Superdeath all returned my Fish/Corn offers, and dead silence from Magic. In addition, Gav and SD each offered war with Dreylin in 15 turns, and the matching time periods lead me to believe that they've joined together to make this happen.

I'd be curious of your thoughts on this development. It sounds like it could be good for the short term and troublesome for the late game if we don't find a way to break up this loose partnership should Dreylin (and possibly Magic) be forced out of the picture by the 3 of us.

[Donovan Zoi]

Turn 126

A Look Ahead

OK so here are the two war replies we received:







By getting the diplo separately, I take that to mean that the Fish peace is independent of our invitation to the war.  And it looks like SD is open to attack Gav as well?  15 turns may also be a reasonable time to let a peace deal with Dreylin expire, but I’m thinking we stick to my original plan and look for opportunities later in the conquest when Drey has moved from our borders to other fronts.


Found It!




24 Horchers at the center of Gav’s territory.  It’s nice to know they shouldn’t be coming our way for now.  Since our defenses are more spread out, I think it would be best to get some pre-emptive 1-2h WE & cat builds in most cities so they can be whipped at a moment's notice.


Commence Barb Raid, But Where?

Them



Us



The taking of Shady Sands comes with its own set of challenges, as we have a Cho-Ko-Nu (!) awaiting our arrival.  If I’m doing this right, successful conquest of this city will earn it the name of Draconis.

Since we only have one Galley, we would have to make landfall two at a time and it could be trouble if the ChoKu actually attacks out.  I have 2 CR3 Swords aboard the ship, and a Level 4 Dog/CR2 Sword ready to swap in, but I think I’d like to postpone the attack until we can 2-whip a WE from Yarrow to absorb the blow.

Instead, we can send the CR ship to Zhou to meet with the C3 Sword outside of town.  If there are indeed 3 Archers here , then it should fall pretty easily.  I’m in favor of keeping the site since it would be a tactical nightmare for SD to even try taking it, but I’ll re-check the area to see what city opportunities he still has there.

There’s a Part 2 coming, but figured I’d get you started with this.

[scooter]

Micro

Whynil was indeed a blunder on my part and will be rectified next turn.  I may keep the grassland forest going so we can 3 whip the Courthouse here, and then borrow back the Corn from Fierias to recover pop quickly.

I suggest turning on the governor more often. I noticed it was disabled in basically every city. This may be a playstyle thing, but I try to keep it on by default, and THEN check on case-by-case to see if I need to make my own adjustments. And when I do override, I try to turn it back on shortly after. In general it does a good job 90% of the time on keeping you on the best tiles, and it helps you avoid little stuff like this.

[Donovan Zoi]

I suggest turning on the governor more often. I noticed it was disabled in basically every city. This may be a playstyle thing, but I try to keep it on by default, and THEN check on case-by-case to see if I need to make my own adjustments. And when I do override, I try to turn it back on shortly after. In general it does a good job 90% of the time on keeping you on the best tiles, and it helps you avoid little stuff like this.

Hey scooter, thanks for checking in.  I typically never use the governors, which likely explains a lot!  My main reason for the manual approach is so I can personally ensure that no resource gets lost in via city swapping.  But hey, I'll definitely put it in action if it allows me to whittle my turns down to 3 hours. 

So, while I have you....

Any idea how ChoKus will react in the above defensive scenario, you sly devil?     Kidding of course, and well played, sir.  We're perfectly fine figuring it out on our own.

[Donovan Zoi]

Turn 126

I’ll probably do a full city report every 5-6 turns, but in the meantime I’ll try to spend each turn shedding light on cities that are related to the discussions we’re having.


Morrig




This city and Fierias whipped Courthouses this turn.  This will be a great site to build a Monastery to goad our religion into a militaristic frenzy.  I’ll be completing 2 mines here, and put the whip overflow into the Catapult before it costs us hammers.


Whynil




Message received, loud and clear.  This site still grows nicely despite lending some food out.

And now I think I know what happened.  I originally had heavy production here to rush the Galley, and never changed it after learning about the canal.  I’ll remember to remove it from the queue next turn.


Quayal




With Corn complete in 2 turns, I am going to whip at Size 3 instead so we get to keep using it.  I’ll still have to do the math on WB v. Walls, and Quayal has the opportunity to borrow the Morrig mine I just started once it hits Size 3 again.  I may have to keep one Worker here to slow build some Cottages and a Quarry since the sea will be mostly devoted to Moai.

This site also looks like a top contender for National Epic, which makes eventual defense a priority.



F1 Gettin’ Toast-y!




We had 3 whips this turn, and a whopping 8 cities will grow next turn.  This is the perfect time for us to grow with others projecting interest elsewhere in terms of war.  I added Willow to Wealth and may need to add just a few more to get Aesthetics within 3 turns.  We’ll definitely be grabbing up the cheapies quick at this rate however.


Demos




Not much time to get into detail here, but we’re at least average on all aspects except Soldiers.  And I think we’re also technically 1st in land when you consider all of the unincorporated land you rightfully talked me out of settling.

With Magic’s peace deal ending and Gav showing at least neutral intentions, am all for gathering a stack near the 3 tile railroad south of Morrig.  I think a Trireme or two may be enough to protect our seas against Iran in the south, so let me know your thoughts.  If Magic stays true to form and chills, then we may be okay either way.