[PB78] Underdogs and undercats: The Mrrshan warlords visit the world of Civ IV

[xist10]

The +25% did show up when I had a gunpowder unit selected and a quick WB test showed, the 25% do show up in the combat odds.
And from where comes the idea that CI don't work against gunpowder ?
Walls and castles explicit say it - that they do not work.

[scooter]

The +25% did show up when I had a gunpowder unit selected and a quick WB test showed, the 25% do show up in the combat odds.
And from where comes the idea that CI don't work against gunpowder ?
Walls and castles explicit say it - that they do not work.

I did just check this afternoon in PB77 where a player owns CI and confirmed that the cultural defenses appeared differently when selecting a Musket vs Longbow.

[xist10]

Of course it changes.
With longbows you should see 75% or 125% from wall (and castle), with musket 45% or 65% for the first or second KE.

[Donovan Zoi]

Hey all, thanks for the discussion about Chichen Itza  I decided to run WB and confirm for myself as I assumed the wonder would protect against GP units.  Otherwise, why keep it around until Rifling? 

Thankfully, I was correct in that assumption, as you will see in my findings.  I’ll keep it brief.

Our city, 40% culture, Wall, Castle, Chichen Itza

125% against Longbow attack.  No questions here, as the 3 buildings override the cultural defense.





65% against Musket attack.  Walls/Castles removed as expected, but CI still adds to the 40% defense that remains.





65% against Cuir attack. Same





But T-Hawk mentioned WB giving us rose-colored glasses, so let’s have China step in to help us check it out.

Enemy city, 40% culture, Wall, Castle, Chichen Itza

125% against Longbow attack.





65% against Cuir attack.






I’m sure it hasn’t helped that I’ve kept you out of the loop for so long.  Let’s put this in the perspective of the game we’re playing. 

We’re entering the elimination phase and have one objective already met – removing Gavagai’s fearsome stack and dividing his land.  Next it looks like Magic will spend his combined 3rd & 4th Golden Age (he just nabbed the Taj, playing MoM perfectly) under assault from us/SD to keep him from blasting off into the stratosphere.  Should we be successful, then it’s just us, SD and Dreylin.  I haven’t thought that far ahead, but there’s a good chance we could end up on the wrong side of a final 2 v. 1. 

So I stand by my decision.  I think that the defensive combo of Chichen Itza, G3 Muskets and even Castles (there is still primarily pre-GP “trash” out there) is a solid way to weather the aftermath of the next 15 turns.  Let’s face it, at this point I’m looking for any advantages we can get against final boss Superdeath, so I chose this wonder knowing he’d soon have Cuirassiers. It will also help to hold newly conquered cities once they come out of revolt.


It’s pretty clear that my next report will need to be the current turn, so I’ll start working on that so we can apply these variables to where we are now.  That is if I don't get sidetracked playing around with Cannons now that I'm in WorldBuilder.

[T-hawk]

Sorry for the confusion and glad you tested it. I really thought I remembered that it doesn't work against gunpowder, and Scooter concurred in the lurker thread. In that case it actually does look like a pretty good choice here.

[scooter]

My mistake then! I'm glad for you then, especially after the GE investment.

[shallow_thought]

Out of MP, always something new.

[thrawn]

DZ, how is the game going? No need for historical reporting, just give us the current state in case we can help. Or if it will make it easier do you mind if I log in to have a look?

[Donovan Zoi]

DZ, how is the game going? No need for historical reporting, just give us the current state in case we can help. Or if it will make it easier do you mind if I log in to have a look?

Hi thrawn,

I'm fine with you jumping in if you'd like.  The whole field is in some type of war, so the turn order is: SD > Us > (Gav anytime after me) > Magic > Dreylin.  I'd prefer we as a team honor the current split, so feel free to check it out after SD plays or right after I do (though who knows how long that will take).

We are in a perennial second place, with Magic down to 9 cities but still putting up a hell of a fight.  I'm gonna play the turn now, and see if I can get the basics for you afterward.

[Donovan Zoi]

Turn 184

OK, shady's back, hopefully for the duration of the game.  The way things are going, there really may not be much game left!

Here’s a shot of the Mrrshan Empire from a few turns ago.  I’ve already got our religion into the new cities from Gavagai to maximize XP. 




Speaking of XP, I’ve put both recent GG’s into Reticuli to get elite units out of the Heroic Epic.  We're about halfway to our next GG, which will soon allow this city to produce Commando Melee and Gunpowder units!  All we need is Chemistry and Military Science to get there.

Northern Region

Here’s our border with Magic’s Iran.  We had a rough spell a few turns ago when Magic levelled our stack of 25 despite being pretty well defended (he lost 13).  He is showing mostly Pikemen now, so I’m making an effort to produce some Melee units to get up there and support my new stack.




Magic’s troops have thinned a bit, having also done damage to Dreylin in a similar fashion.  SD’s has gone unscathed so far, having held back at the outskirts of Marathon for the last 6-8 turns.  Iran had 34 Pikemen in his capital so I can understand why – SD’s stack is primarily Cuirs, Knights and Catapults. Most of Magic’s Cats have been exhausted taking the fight to Drey and I, but hopefully SD will meet with some decent resistance to level the playing field somewhat.


Southern Iran

I’ve got a stack of 15 (10 Knights, 1 Musket, 1 C3 Shock Mace, 2 pikes and a Catapult) 2 tiles SW of Gaugamela.  2 Muskets and an XBow are coming up from the SE to help cover the stack.  Magic has offered me peace 3 times, but I’m not giving up my claim to these cities by tapping out at the wrong time.





Island Conundrum

And then there’s Gavagai’s city of Goodneighbor.  I had to research Compass/Optics to scare his 4 ships from my coast but I haven’t been able to act yet.  He’s projected to get Optics in 2-3 turns so I am looking to get two more Galleys here to boat the island 4-6 units at a time.  Gavagai also offered me peace, but I declined in case I could use Bombay to take a crack at New Cunaxa.  There were once 6 units there, but now it’s down to 2.





Middle Region

This area is coming along nicely, but I’m back to favoring military builds.  Not only for the current wars, but also to be prepared to deal with Superdeath and/or Dreylin once Magic falls.  I’m also using unit whips to parlay the Forbidden Palace in Whynil, which we’ll finally have in 2-3 turns.  And new city Ixitixl is finally built after bored workers developed 4 Farms here.





South Region / North Iran

So SD has about 15 Cuirs, 20 Knights and 20 Cats finally descending on Marathon.  Magic still has about 25 Pikes as well as other units to still do quite a bit of damage.




I’m a bit concerned about Yarrow once Iranian culture is removed, so i’ve been sending a few Catapults down here and will continue to do so.


Build Queues




I’ve been trying to slow build growth, so we’re getting 12 new builds next turn on only 3 whips.  Almost all 25 cities will have Barracks and will begin contributing to the war effort.

I tweaked the screen a bit so I can keep tabs on our progress for certain building initiatives.  I also added a foreign trade route column so I could check if it’s worth rioting into Mercantilism now that we have Banking.  Doing so can help us with free tech and culture specialists, since we have to compete with established borders in Gavagai’s old territory.  I’m still going to hold off for a few turns because I want to promote at least 2 CR3 Swords to help bring down Goodneighbor.


Techs

Our path has been: Guilds (T165) > Gunpowder (172) > Compass (175) > Optics (177) and Banking (184).  Optics was hastened by a 1-turn war with Dreylin.  He razed a former Gav city that was threatening his island site, Diamond City.  But he offered peace and 200g, allowing me to build Caravels for my own island conquest from Bombay.

I’m considering Chemistry > Mil Science next to use Commando as well as field Grenadiers, and I think Blitz could come in handy for some Knights to clean up injured enemy units twice as fast.   But am also thinking Astro first so that we get some good ships along the way (plus Observatories).  I’m parked in Philo for now to mask those plans while my current allies aim for Paper.  I know our tech path is a bit unconventional but I really think it works for us.


Wonders

In addition to the FP in Whynil, I’ve started the Parthenon in Mentar and the National Epic in Quayal.  However, I’m also being practical about it, granting overflow to build two new Maces this turn in the north instead.


That's it for now, but let me know if you have any questions.  There’s a good chance I already have a screenshot for anything that’s happened in the last 20 turns.  Also,  I see thrawn has spent some time in the save, so he may also have more to add.