[PB69] Lurking the dreams of summer

[Tarkeel]

What will the gods of chaos throw this time?

[Amicalola]

If I was playing in this game, I'd rank these picks (not including players) on a random map like this:

1. Pacal (Exp/Fin) of Mali

2. Mansa Musa (Fin/Spi) of Sumeria

(drop)

3. De Gaulle (Cha/Ind) of Rome

4. Victoria (Fin/Imp) of Carthage

5. Tokugawa (Agg/Pro) of Khmer

(drop)

6. Montezuma (Agg/Spi) of Spain

(BIG, HUMONGOUS, ENORMOUS DROP)

7. Joao of Celts

8. Saladin of Germany


Would anyone else have any notable differences?

[El Grillo]

I might swap Victoria and De Gaulle depending on the map, but otherwise, that looks reasonable. Maybe the map will be extra nice to Commodore of Saladin/Germany this time.

[Mjmd]

I rolled 10 maps and #1 and #8 look promising. I'm leaning #1, but wanted some general input on which shape looks better

#1


#8

I'm mainly against upper left having so much room and rest being kind of squeezed.

[Amicalola]

I think number one is better. Orange is squeezed and has a lot of neighbours, but the others all seem roughly in line. Maybe Celts are too strong, they don't have many neighbours. Hard to say without seeing resources, but nothing appears game breaking.

There are basically no islands for either, so PRO will be terrible, fwiw.

[Mjmd]

I had time tonight so I'm just going with #1. It was the first one anyways. Here are the starts and changes I've made to them. AS A REMINDER* this is a random game and they are lucky I persuaded them to let me upgrade.

Note as you can probably tell from prior screenshot I did cut a channel down south. Also as they added two players it is obviously tighter than PB64 (I tried going a size up but it was WAY over then, so technically this is map #2, but I'm not counting test for size)

Mali

Who got the uber cap placed in the tundra. YOU DID! No changes, but reason I put this one out of order is no other start comes close. This is the Ginger start of this map. I upgraded every other start but 1 because of this one, but even still this is better. I didn't want to do multiple upgrades on each cap for the most part, but feel free to suggest otherwise. I also wouldn't hate deleting a crab, but again, random map and junk.

Sumeria

Clam changed to fish; made the island 2 tiles because 1 tile islands are banned

Carthage

Clam changed to fish. Listen it has a banana but everyone else was getting a fish.

Rome

Clam changed to fish.

Khmer

Made the island NW 2 tiles because 1 tile islands are banned. No other changes as had two five food tiles already.

Germany

Clam changed to fish. I find it funny Commodore got another isthmus empire with some weird land to expand to down south, which Spain can contest.

Spain

Who got the hidden resources; you did! Oh wait that isn't as good.

This is only one I made multiple changes to. Cow changed to pig and fish moved 1 tile closer. This is the only start with a plains hill, which isn't worth nothing. BTW I made mention of this with SD start last game, but this map was rolled as "wet".

Celt

Clam changed to fish.

Again, let me know, but in the spirit of "these people are idiots for wanting random" I'm tempted to just send it.

[Tarkeel]

Mali: Don't discount that no less than four workboats are required, and there's no plainshill at the start to speed it up.

Sumeria: I think this is one of the stronger starts, even before the fish change.

Carthage: Probably the strongest start, would def keep the clam.

Rome: OK with this one changing.

Khmer: Check that moving 1S2W isn't a too good start, as it's the obvious scout move.

Germany: OK with this changing.

Spain: Ouch. Would consider adding a clam, but that's probably more than they wanted.

Celt: OK with this changing.


Summary: Carthage and Sumeria changes should be reverted; would consider adding more to Spain but then that might be too much change.

[Amicalola]

I'm pretty sure the Mali one is the weakest. Other than Spain, the Commodore start of this game. I would recommend changing the pig back to a sheep, but adding a clam/crab. That start is obviously worse than the rest, and also appears to have the worst surrounding land. Just needs a little boost to be playable, imo. I think jSumeria is ok, but would also revert Carthage, which is obviously the strongest here.

Edit: Another good option is to remove all the edits and just keep the Spain edits - that way it's more in line. I actually like that more tbh. Don't take this the wrong way but I know you like strong starts, and I think you are somewhat imposing that on the players here. They know what they're getting into, and only asked for minor edits for really weak starts, which would mean just keeping the Spain buff here imo.

[Tarkeel]

Edit: Another good option is to remove all the edits and just keep the Spain edits - that way it's more in line. I actually like that more tbh. Don't take this the wrong way but I know you like strong starts, and I think you are somewhat imposing that on the players here. They know what they're getting into, and only asked for minor edits for really weak starts, which would mean just keeping the Spain buff here imo.

Yeah, that's another good idea. Sometimes I'm too literal at giving feedback.

[Mjmd]

Khmer would lose all 3 food and gain (mind totally unseen a plains hill gold and plains hill sheep). Even if knew I doubt they move.

Reverted Carthage change.

Sumeria to me looks similar to say Rome, Germany, or Celt changes.

I'm surprised you both think Mali is one of the weakest even with all that food. Get 1 boat, get a worker and chop away.