When do we get a warlords epic?

[mbuna120]

the title says it all...

[pling]

When do we get a warlords epic?

... somewhere in another thread (which I'm afraid I'm too lazy to go look for ) Sirian said something about sticking to vanilla until & unless a decision was made to move all future epics over to Warlords ... and said stuff about not making the decision in haste as they'd done so for a Civ3 expansion & regretted it. So I guess that means the answer to your question is both 'nobody knows' and 'probably not soon'

[Sirian]

the title says it all...

From the original "Warlords has Gone Gold" thread:

My involvement with Warlords is greater than zero but not significant. I have not, for instance, seen any of the builds in action. Since we're not even remotely close to running out of good scenarios for the core game, there is no pressing need to move forward. I'm skeptical of the six month development cycle and wary of some of the new features. I know there are talented people at Firaxis, so I'm willing to be impressed by Warlords, but the product will have to earn my respect and support not with hype but with performance. "Show me the money."

To that end, I intend to submit the new expansion to the same rigors as any other mod that we would consider. There will be the opportunity for members of our community to engage in an Approval Process. If the evidence produced by thorough investigation looks good, we'll adopt Warlords.


There are five possible outcomes:

1. Not enough interest to produce a sufficient Approval Process. Result: We stick with the core game.

2. The RBCiv community concludes that Warlords is not as well balanced as the core game and would be a net drag on our events. Result: We stick with the core game.

3. The game turns out to have issues, which revolve around bugs or correctable mishaps. Result: We decide to "wait and see what happens from patches," postponing a decision.

4. Opinions are divided or the evidence is confused and unclear. Result: We run some expanded events but continue with vanilla events, too.

5. After due consideration, the product receives a glowing recommendation. Result: We move the RB tournaments to Warlords and never look back.


In any event, publication is still a couple of weeks out, and then it will take time for the process to unfold. As of this writing, I do not expect to rush out and get a copy for myself. If that changes, I'll say so.

I hope this clarifies our intentions.

We're still idling at the first option. However, anybody with the interest can get the ball rolling. If the demand is there, we'll put up the games.


- Sirian

[dsplaisted]

Well, it seems that the approval for Warlords would not be the same as for a normal mod, because normally we would not accept any mod that altered the gameplay.

[Dreylin]

We're still idling at the first option. However, anybody with the interest can get the ball rolling. If the demand is there, we'll put up the games.

Well I have Warlords, but have not had much chance to play as yet - mainly because I choose to spend the majority of my limited CIV time participating in the RB events! So I would definitely like to see it being adopted for some RB events in the future!

I would suggest running some sort of "parallel" event to start the evaluation process rolling: generate a map populated with leaders whose traits did not change under Warlords; create a Warlords and a Vanilla save file (I have no idea how to go about this) and then offer it as an Adventure where people sign up to play either the Warlords or Vanilla version. That should give a starting point for balance discussions, which could be continued to evaluate new traits, etc.

I think the issue with subjecting it to the existing process is that there are so many changes in there (traits, buildings, Great Generals, Chariot upgrades, etc) that it's difficult to separate them out for evaluation. There are also things in there which will impact on the existing discussions regarding exploits/uber-strats - e.g. how does the Temple of Artemis combined with an early beeline to CS compare with the earlier access to Bureacracy from the Oracle/Prophet slingshot?

Maybe we should be discussing the potential balances offered by Warlords and whether or not to pursue that route before legislating Vanilla?

[sooooo]

I'm officially registering my interest in a warlords event . Maybe an adventure to test the waters and see what the turnout is like.

[mbuna120]

Maybe we should be discussing the potential balances offered by Warlords and whether or not to pursue that route before legislating Vanilla?

I agree with this wholeheartedly. I do not play vanilla for personal games at all anymore, in fact. I, for one, would like to see a shift towards the expansion. With that, perhaps some of the exploits would simply stop being so effective, negating the need to set additional rules. I would like to see some trials especially to see how vassal states work out. I have found warfare to be a little riskier now, especially if you have a starting position in the middle of other civs. Starting a war to munch up some cities from one civ in the east, eg, may find your west end attacked by a new vassal state... Also, this makes it harder to end wars and exploit techs... I'm not totally crazy about some of the trait shifts, but I really like Julius Caesar now! I like his early, CHEAP growth potential. At any rate, the specialty buildings don't seem to have a HUGE impact, but do add diversity. And as for the special wonders, yes things like the University of Sankore could be a BIG boon, but only time will tell. The only glitch I have seen at all in Warlords is that sometimes in late modern age, sound gets cut out or distorted in my game. This has happened several times, actually, but I don't know if it is just my copy of the game or what. Anyone else noticed this?

Anyway, blah blah blah. I want a warlords epic, lets get it rolling!

[LKendter]

Well I think I am rare one in no rush. I have *not* bought warlords, and I am not ready to. If the epics move to Warlords, then I will drop out.

[Harleqin]

The only glitch I have seen at all in Warlords is that sometimes in late modern age, sound gets cut out or distorted in my game. This has happened several times, actually, but I don't know if it is just my copy of the game or what. Anyone else noticed this?

Same here. No problems with vanilla, but it happens some times with Warlords. It also seems to run less smooth than the vanilla version, but that may be fixed when a patch is out.

The best thing in my opinion is that chariots can counter axes. That improves the early balance. The worst is probably that it seems too easy to get vassals at least on prince level. For me that makes the game a bit easier.

I, however, have also moved completely to Warlords for private games.

[blid]

For the "jump out of skin" sound problem in warlords, you got to edit one of the xml files. Check it here:

I will be interested in some events running warlords and banning trebs
In fact, I find the AI a bit better in warlords. I had games where AI was defending with archers and HA inside city and won't attack making it harder for me to take the city. AFAIK, in vanilla those HA would have suicided against my spears in the forest hill
The little improvements like decimal precision and whipping bug resolution are a nice addition too.