EitB 0009 Wishlist

[Sareln]

What I've got in mind so far. Sound off in the comments, most especially civic changes and condensed thoughts from finished games? Also wanting thoughts on what to do with the Wither Promotion, Spirit III, and Shadow III.

EDIT: Pulled in the comments from the first several posts (Bob, Mardoc, Selrahc) Changes from the original are in green.
EDIT: Pulled in more suggestions. Changes from the original are in cyan.
EDIT: Pulled in bugs mentioned elsewhere and universal CIV BTS bugs. Changes from the original are in red.
EDIT: If the item is struck, it means I've added it to the latest build I have. If it's bolded then I've also tested it. When everything is struck and bolded, we get another build!

Balance:

1. [STRIKE]Sidar Wanes @ Lv. 6[/STRIKE]
   
2. [STRIKE]Tsunami Fix (Range 1)[/STRIKE]
   
3. [STRIKE]New Promo: Favored (as Arcane Potency, but only for Disciples).[/STRIKE]
   
4. [STRIKE]Spiritual grants favored and Mob1 (Disciples)[/STRIKE]
   
5. [STRIKE]Arcane grants potency and Mob1 (Arcane)[/STRIKE]
   
6. [STRIKE]Falamar loses Adaptive[/STRIKE]
   
7. [STRIKE]Ljosalfar can build Alchemy Labs[/STRIKE]
   
8. [STRIKE]Svartalfar can build Alchemy Labs[/STRIKE]
   
9. [STRIKE] Conquest reduced to +2XP from +3XP[/STRIKE]
   
10. [STRIKE]Command Post reduced to +2XP from +3XP[/STRIKE]
    
11. Council of Esus Changes (See Post Below)
    
12. [STRIKE] Spirit III Spell gives +50% GPP and cures Enraged[/STRIKE]
    
13. [STRIKE] Shadow III Spell summons a Mistform w/ Marksmen[/STRIKE]
    
14. [STRIKE] Wither Promotion gives -1 Defense along with its other penalties[/STRIKE]
    
15. [STRIKE] Sons of Asena costed the same as standard Axemen[/STRIKE]
    
16. [STRIKE] Javelins somewhat cheaper (30H, quick speed)[/STRIKE]
    
17. [STRIKE] Diseased Corpses do not go Obsolete[/STRIKE]
    
18. [STRIKE] Give Specters Death Affinity, remove fear, str. 3[/STRIKE]
    
19. [STRIKE] Boar Riders (Khazad Horsemen) get +40% v. Mounted[/STRIKE]
    
20. [STRIKE] Horse Archer hammer cost restored to original[/STRIKE]
    
21. [STRIKE] Arturus Thorne set to IND/ORG/ING from FIN/ORG/ING[/STRIKE]
    
22. [STRIKE] Fix Consumption Popup[/STRIKE]
    
23. [STRIKE] Fix Basium to properly apply immortal only some of the time[/STRIKE]
    
24. [STRIKE] Fix 7 Pines (Likely Python Broken)[/STRIKE] WAD
    
25. [STRIKE]Change Arcane Lacuna to not require any improved nodes (+0 XP but still block casting)[/STRIKE]
    

Structural:

1. [STRIKE] Adaptive does not remove earned traits[/STRIKE] Only works for case: (Illian Aggressive). Where else can you earn traits that might be removed by Adaptive?
   
2. [STRIKE] Insane does not clear Civilization traits (Perpentachian Kuriotates)[/STRIKE]
   
3. [STRIKE] Change Cassiel's religion weightings so he can adopt a religion if not agnostic.[/STRIKE]
   
4. [STRIKE] Sheelba loses BAR[/STRIKE]
   
5. [STRIKE] Jonas loses BAR[/STRIKE]
   
6. [STRIKE] Clan of Embers gains BAR as CivTrait[/STRIKE]
   
7. [STRIKE] Game Option for Basium to spawn as a human player (Off by default)[/STRIKE]
   
8. [STRIKE] Game Option for Hyborem to spawn as a human player (Off by default)[/STRIKE]
   
9. Tholal's v1.8 or 1.9 if I can find it. He's up to 2.1 right now but it adds some functionality which I don't want to worry about (revolutions, puppet states, BUG, etc.)
   
10. [STRIKE] Traderoute Bug Fix[/STRIKE]
    
11. Production Automation Bug Fix
    
12. Build Culture Bug Fix
    
13. Multiple Techs from Oracle/Tower of Divination Bug Fix
    
14. Reach for the City Capture Culture Conundrum Let's hold off on this one for now.
    

[Sareln]

CoE Changes

I want CoE to be something worth adopting and holding onto, rather than just rushing for Nox Noctis, which you can build without State Religion, or for a quick Gibbon and nothing more. However, I think the pay-for-spells mechanic needed a redesign, say like this:

NOTE: Reworked the list so that spells are either unique or shared by all. This simplifies the XML quite a bit.
DONE.

• Nightwatch - Can cast Extort, Blur, and Poisoned Blade w/ Poisons
  
• Shadow - Can cast Extort, Blur, and Haste
  
• Shadow Rider - Can cast Extort, Blur, Shadow-Walk, and Regeneration
  

With a Spell-cost Breakdown of (Normal Speed):
DONE.

• Extort - Free
  
• Blur - 12 GP
  
• Shadow Walk - 60 GP
  
• Haste - 60 GP
  
• Poisoned Blades - 90 GP
  
• Regeneration - 120 GP
  

Other CoE Changes:

• State Religion - Can cast Esus Spells DONE.
  
• Nox Noctis - Grant HN and Shroud of Noctis.
  
• Eyes & Ears Network - Internet w/ 2 player threshold.
  

Invisibility Structure

Sources:

• Animal Invisibility (Giant Spiders, Mistforms)
  
• Magical Invisibility (Hidden Promo, Into the Mist)
  
• Esus Invisibility (Shroud of Esus, Shadows)
  

Detectors:

• Recon Line & Hawks beat Animal Invisibility
  
• Magic Eye Magical Invisibility
  
• Revelation, Perfect Sight beat Esus, Magical, & Animal Invisibility
  
• Dispel magic beats Esus & Magical
  

[Mardoc]

Sidar Wanes @ Lv. 6

I think Altar pieces should have tech requirements again, and that mostly fixes the Sidar. At least they should be tried in a normal game before we conclude they're broken.

Falamar loses Adapative

Yes. Lanun have been boosted enough, Adaptive on top is too much.

[*] Command Post reduced to +2XP from +3XP

I think you'd do better to put Conquest down to 2 XP than Command Posts. Military Strategy is already a specialty tech.

Structural:

• Game Option for Basium to spawn as a human player (Off by default)
  
• Game Option for Hyborem to spawn as a human player (Off by default)
  

No comments from me on the rest, I haven't tried any of them.

[Sareln]

Thinking of the following spell changes.

Spirit III - Trust -> City Buff of +50% GPP
Shadow III - Summon a Mistform with Marksmen (Sniper T3 summon)
Wither -> Give -1 Defense along with other Malii

[Bobchillingworth]

I like those spell changes



Also suggest making Dance of Blades permanent, not really to buff it so much as save players the annoyance of remembering to constantly re-cast it.



There are still other weak spells, but at least they serve niche roles, and therefore aren't entirely useless.



I also like the various balance changes you have suggested.


In addition to those, I would have:


* Diseased Corpses are not obsoleted by Fanatacism

* Sons of Asena are 30 hammers (same as regular axes, which whom they essentially have identical stats, unlike other axe-replacement UU like Moroi)

* Javellin Throwers are cheaper (maybe 35 hammers?)

* Anything which will make the AI stop all adopting the Leaves and ignoring the Veil. It really sucks to lose SP games because every AI has gone Leaves by turn 60 And even with Leaves off, Veil seems to get adopted in only 20% of my games. I would just give some of the AI huge preferences for going for the Veil (say, Os, Tebby, Alexis, Jonas). Every faith should probably have at least a couple leaders who will always, or almost always adopt it if given the chance.




I agree with Mardoc that Conquest should get the exp nerf as opposed to Command Posts.

[Selrahc]

* Diseased Corpses are not obsoleted by Fanatacism

I'm in favour of the changes proposed.

I'd add, new spectres are awful. If the intent is to indirectly nerf Sheaim, Calabim (and Keelyn) then I guess that does the job. But they're pretty terrible as a choice for other summoners.

Giving them some sort of limited affinity so that they are S3 base, S5 with two death mana would be ideal. They'd max out at S6 with Tower of Necromancy, but be vulnerable to units immune to death damage and destroy undead casters.

Alternatively, return full affinity and remove fear.

* Diseased Corpses are not obsoleted by Fanatacism

I don't think they're obsoleted by Fantacism, but by Eidolons. If you put 4 Eidolon into build queues you should get the option to build DC's again. Of course that can be irritating to do.

[Sareln]

I'm in favour of the changes proposed.

I'd add, new spectres are awful. If the intent is to indirectly nerf Sheaim, Calabim (and Keelyn) then I guess that does the job. But they're pretty terrible as a choice for other summoners.

Giving them some sort of limited affinity so that they are S3 base, S5 with two death mana would be ideal. They'd max out at S6 with Tower of Necromancy, but be vulnerable to units immune to death damage and destroy undead casters.

Alternatively, return full affinity and remove fear.

Capping affinity seems arbitrary. Rather keep the rules simple. Let's try the death affinity but no fear.

Additionally, perhaps we should consider a cumulative malus on the death and entropy manas? Perhaps -1 Happy on Death and -1 Health on Entropy? Or is that just way too harsh to folks who start with it as palace-mana? (Hyborem, as usual, doesn't care ).

[Sareln]

Also suggest making Dance of Blades permanent, not really to buff it so much as save players the annoyance of remembering to constantly re-cast it.

I'll hold off on that for now just b/c "Dance of Blades" sounds more like an effect than a permanent enchantment and it's just a convenience thing.

Anything which will make the AI stop all adopting the Leaves and ignoring the Veil. It really sucks to lose SP games because every AI has gone Leaves by turn 60 And even with Leaves off, Veil seems to get adopted in only 20% of my games. I would just give some of the AI huge preferences for going for the Veil (say, Os, Tebby, Alexis, Jonas). Every faith should probably have at least a couple leaders who will always, or almost always adopt it if given the chance.

As I mentioned in chat, I'm not sure why it's doing this. Perhaps Satyrs are just too much of an allure or there's something else in FoL that is making it super attractive to the AI.

[Bobchillingworth]

Giving the Sheaim -1 unhappy because of Death Mana just seems... odd. I mean, their people put up with flaming zombies without complaint, but skeletons are just too much? Nah, they don't need a malus.




If you give affinity back to spectres, make sure you reduce their strength to 3 again. Personally I think they are okay as-is, but I don't really use summons much to begin with.

[Sareln]

Okay, we'll keep the resource malus off for now then.

Next game you play could you play with Kandros, Sandalphon, Hannah in your mix? Those 3 have 100% affinity for non-leaves religions (RoK, Esus, OO) so I'd like to see what they do.