Khan Rides Forth <SPOILERS>

[Khan]

Welcome to my spoiler thread.

At this stage, what is there to think about? I could ponder over possible leader and civilization choices, but that largely depends on my snake pick position. With India and Inca banned, I am largely inclined to focus on leader traits and just grab a civ with appropriate starting technologies.

I admit to having a weakness for an easy way of popping borders. I struggle to plan cities utilising only the first ring initially as this loses value and, accordingly, upsets me tremendously. Now, with Inca banned and Willem likely banned, this means I will probably go down one of the following paths:

1. Choose a leader with Creative. Financial is such a good trait! Suryavarman would probably be my favourite if I go this route. Sury is unlikely to be picked so this means I could take a civ first. I really have no idea which civs actually have meaningful unique items. This would mean a quick start though but, end game, what advantage do I have? No financial and no industrious. It's all about whether I can leverage an early game advantage. If someone goes aggressive on me, this could all fall apart.

2. Found an early religion. Possibly go spiritual trait to allow easier transition into a religion? Therefore, Mansa Musa? Again, he's unlikely to be an early pick so this gives options. I quite like this option as it allows a fair bit of flexibility.

3.Build stonehenge. This can be a big time sink so maybe I should take Industrious to go alongside this? Huayna Capac is a great leader. Huayna is probably going to get picked early and having him in the game weakens the value of industrious trait. If I get first snake pick and take him, that might put others off and give me maximum value. Things to consider. Huayna has a slow early game though. Bismarck is quicker off the mark. Build stonehenge and oracle metal casting for forges. If I did this, how badly would I fall behind the expansion curve? I tend to expand rather aggressively against the AI, but these are real players.

If anyone is thinking about becoming a dedicated lurker, you would be very welcome.

[pindicator]

How do you normally like to play your empire? Are you aggressive and a conqueror as befits your name, or a softie builder like myself?

[Khan]

How do you normally like to play your empire? Are you aggressive and a conqueror as befits your name, or a softie builder like myself?

I normally play on random unrestricted, so this would largely play out depending to what combination I get. The AI is easy to war with though, I doubt humans are so easy to defeat. If I get Aggressive Rome, then praetorians go on the march etc.

In this instance, I suspect this is a losing tactic but it does depend on the map. If I share an island with someone, I would definitely be interested in taking them down and then going pure peace mode and run minimalist defences to expand using my extra room. I do enjoy building up a nice empire and mounting an unassailable lead before crushing the opposition, usually with knights or drafted units. War sounds more fun on the face of it, but realistically, I intend to adapt to my situation. If the map is big, I will certainly try and expand rapidly.

Or, rather, what is the correct answer to persuade you to be a dedicated lurker? I won't stick by my promise but it will be too late for you then!

[pindicator]

I think the biggest change between AI and human battles is tempo becomes a lot bigger factor. The AI will kind of increase its defenses when you invade, but a competent human is going to whip every city every possible turn to bring together a defending force. So 2-mover invasion forces are more the norm to give your opponent less time to react. There are other ways to get around this: naval forces greatly increase your mobility but are limited to costal avenues of attack; and slow moving stacks can still work but only if you have overwhelming numbers or tech advantage, usually both are needed.

I'll try to stick around and ded lurk, sure. I don't think I've read much else in this game, and if I have I've already forgotten it

[pindicator]

[quote='pindicator' pid='531534' dateline='1427299378']

In this instance, I suspect this is a losing tactic but it does depend on the map. If I share an island with someone, I would definitely be interested in taking them down and then going pure peace mode and run minimalist defences to expand using my extra room. I do enjoy building up a nice empire and mounting an unassailable lead before crushing the opposition, usually with knights or drafted units. War sounds more fun on the face of it, but realistically, I intend to adapt to my situation. If the map is big, I will certainly try and expand rapidly.

This is the perfect mentality to have!

[Khan]

That's great. A rational head in this thread should put me in good stead to get ahead...

Yes. That did happen and I make no apology for it! So, we (see, I'm including you already!) are third in the pick order. I think the pick order is one of those things where I would have immediately negatives of any position I had been given. Grass is always greener etc.

So, third. Let's recap the settings:

Settings

Speed: Normal (DTG, ipecac, LogicalTautology; Alhazard will vote to gain a majority; Khan prefers Quick but is ok with Normal)
Barbs: off
Huts: off
Events: off
Corps: off
Difficulty: Prince
AI diplomacy (can still make resource trades and have open borders; no written communication inside or outside the game, no requests to "declare war on X," no requests to "sign a trade embargo against X")
See starts: yes
Spies: passive espionage only (don't build Spies; can view graphs)
Snake pick: yes
Accelerated start: no

Bans

Standard RB: no vassal states, no nukes, no WE (Ballista Elephants excepted), no spying missions, no AP/UN resolutions, no diplo victory, no blockades, no tech trading and brokering.

Civ: Inca and India, banned

Leader: Willem + Pacal, banned

Wonders: GLH if there is a lot of water (mapmaker's discretion)

In the spirit of playing with what we're given, the main observations here are two fold: Firstly, normal speed. This is very significant and I will come back to this momentarily. Secondly, Prince difficulty.

Difficulty first as this is simple, Organised is worse as maintenance is less of an issue. Conversely, expansion is easier and therefore imperialistic is buffed. I'm not sure it's buffed enough for us to consider it. What do you think Pindicator? If we want to expand as quickly as possible, the best choices in my view are Suryavaraman, Joao or Catherine. They both give two nice early game traits. Willem and Pacal are banned so if we want a happy medium with one expansion trait and one long term trait then we are looking at Victoria or Augustus.

I am, perhaps worryingly, rather tempted by Catherine here but would that leave us too vulnerable in the later game with no 'real' traits? There is also the consideration that if we intentionally get off to an explosive start (with no end game), we put ourselves forward on the demographics as a target and then can't back it up.

Huayna Capac is obviously still really strong as I find it unlikely others will take industrious once he's picked but I don't expect he'll still be available to us. There is also part of my brain saying pick financial or you'll just regret it. Fun choices!

Game speed. Now this opens up a whole new can of worms. As well as making the early turns torturous, this has another big influence in that units are relevant for longer. Praetorians move one tile regardless of game speed. Strong unique units will be even better than before. Heck, it's entirely possible that praetorian, war chariot or cataphract rushes might even be the right answer here. My nervousness comes from the fact it's a fairly obvious all-in play. Once you pick the civ, people are already nervous. Egypt maybe masks that a bit because they have strong techs and are a popular pick regardless. Picking Egypt initially and Catherine on the way back up would certainly be a novel way of playing the game. Is it an effective way to win the game? Probably not. A lot would depend on the map which we can't determine beforehand.

Sumeria has a universally nice unique building which, if we were going down some of the more religious techs anyway, is a good boost. Again though, how necessary will this be on Prince. The alternative is to just pick a civilization based on the techs we need at the start which is a strong, albeit boring, play. Have you any thoughts on civilizations you would consider in this instance?

[Commodore]

Here's your capital. Stuff in the fog might change, but capital stays the same. Enjoy!

[Khan]

Thanks a lot. Can you confirm whether that deer is forested? I don't think it is but am not certain.

[Commodore]

Thanks a lot. Can you confirm whether that deer is forested? I don't think it is but am not certain.

It is, thus the extra hammer.

[Khan]

Thanks a lot. Can you confirm whether that deer is forested? I don't think it is but am not certain.

It is, thus the extra hammer.

Even better! Thank you.