pindicator's Warlords3 report

[DerangedDuck]

Being a horrible code-junkie (or would that be code-duckie?), I could not resist the urge to look up the code-ish questions you ask in your report.

With regards to religion spread: As far as I can tell, the only factors that affect chance of religion spread are straight line distance from holy city (nearer == better chance) and presence of shrine in holy city (2X chance). Also, the two cities have to be "connected", but I haven't quite been able to figure out what constitutes "connected", because that uses proprietary path-finding stuff for which Firaxis doesn't seem to have provided the code. However, connection is a yes/no factor, either the cities are connected or they aren't. In the Cuban Isolationists game, I remember reading about them finding religion that had spread to people they hadn't even met, so the "connected" criteria is probably pretty relaxed.

With regards to tied UN votes: Whichever player happens to be first on the game's list of players gets to be a candidate. I think that the player is first on this list, so that they would always win ties. Otherwise, whoever happens to have been picked for the game first is the lucky AI.

[KMad]

i did meet russia once on an archi map in warlords 2.08 when my state religion spread. i'd actually forgotten there was a civ i hadn't met yet. cathy called me up on the holy hotline and it scared me! so that can happen. in the "i know i read it somewhere on CFC" category, there's a "trade-route connected" category and also a "trade-route capable" (i don't know the actual wording) category. cathy didn't get my religion until after i learned astronomy, and at that point our cities would be legally allowed to trade if we cleared a path through the blackness in the ocean, so that would match that theory. religion can get through the unseen parts of the map i guess is the deal.

to be super nitpicky, your "the only factors" is taking as a given that natural religion spread is possible only for cities that do not already have a religion, correct? everything i've ever observed and read agrees with that. a very sane friend recently said he's fairly certain he did get a natural spread once to a city with religion. but ... his case was in an SG, no one noticed when the city got it, the city had FOUR religions already, and they had OB with isabella who was the one with the religion that spread. so i'm betting that she sent a missionary who wasn't noticed at the time. i mean, we're talking izzy here, and it was a culture game but the fact that they got a new religion for free they only noticed when checking a save after someone else's round *giggle*. i trust my friend but that's a lot of "but"s!

[Compromise]

Also, I think to be "connected," the civ with the holy city and the civ with the religion-needing city can't be at war. But it is possible to get religion from the AI in an Always War game if a possible connection exists but you haven't formally met the other civ. Of course, if they have that religion as their state faith, you immediately meet them, go to war with them, and there won't be any more free religion spread to any of your other cities.

[DerangedDuck]

to be super nitpicky, your "the only factors" is taking as a given that natural religion spread is possible only for cities that do not already have a religion, correct?

Ohyea, absolutely no spread if the city already has a religion.

a very sane friend recently said he's fairly certain he did get a natural spread once to a city with religion. but ... his case was in an SG, no one noticed when the city got it, the city had FOUR religions already, and they had OB with isabella who was the one with the religion that spread. so i'm betting that she sent a missionary who wasn't noticed at the time. i mean, we're talking izzy here, and it was a culture game but the fact that they got a new religion for free they only noticed when checking a save after someone else's round *giggle*. i trust my friend but that's a lot of "but"s!

I always play with 'see friendly moves off'. I bet most other people do too, because watching the AI move 50 zillion patrols in circles gets boring quickly. But this means that 'interesting' moves like missionaries (and AI vs. AI battles) don't get shown either. Even if this was on, it'd be easy to miss. And, yea, the AI sends lots of invisible missionaries to me too. So, I'd agree that it was probably a missionary spread that just wasn't seen. The religion spread message is exactly the same.

Also, I think to be "connected," the civ with the holy city and the civ with the religion-needing city can't be at war. But it is possible to get religion from the AI in an Always War game if a possible connection exists but you haven't formally met the other civ. Of course, if they have that religion as their state faith, you immediately meet them, go to war with them, and there won't be any more free religion spread to any of your other cities.

Interesting. I would've though that wouldn't be the case, because the trade route calculating routines use the same path-finding routine and also make a check for at-war status. That would mean I guess that the path finding routines also check at-war status, so it gets done twice?

I really should set up an experiment with the worldbuilder to figure out exactly what connected means.