Quote:Here's another suggestion: do a civics revolt (HR/OR) but not a religious revolt. Save that for a free Golden Age change. The civics are likely worth a turn of Anarchy. Having a state religion likely not. (OR still worth it so we can build missionaries without monasteries.)
Doesn't OR only let you build missionaries of your state religion?
OR allows you to build missionaries for any relgion present in the city.
(I'm not certain if you can adopt OR without a state religion though.)
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(October 29th, 2012, 18:15)SevenSpirits Wrote: Doesn't OR only let you build missionaries of your state religion?
I am pretty sure one can build any missionaries for which the religion is present.
Edit: Note to self: Don't take more than a minute in replying to this thread.
Merovech's Mapmaking Guidelines:
0. Player Requests: The player's requests take precedence, even if they contradict the following guidelines.
1. Balance: The map must be balanced, both in regards to land quality and availability and in regards to special civilization features. A map may be wonderfully unique and surprising, but, if it is unbalanced, the game will suffer and the player's enjoyment will not be as high as it could be.
2. Identity and Enjoyment: The map should be interesting to play at all levels, from city placement and management to the border-created interactions between civilizations, and should include varied terrain. Flavor should enhance the inherent pleasure resulting from the underlying tile arrangements. The map should not be exceedingly lush, but it is better to err on the lush side than on the poor side when placing terrain.
3. Feel (Avoiding Gimmicks): The map should not be overwhelmed or dominated by the mapmaker's flavor. Embellishment of the map through the use of special improvements, barbarian units, and abnormal terrain can enhance the identity and enjoyment of the map, but should take a backseat to the more normal aspects of the map. The game should usually not revolve around the flavor, but merely be accented by it.
4. Realism: Where possible, the terrain of the map should be realistic. Jungles on desert tiles, or even next to desert tiles, should therefore have a very specific reason for existing. Rivers should run downhill or across level ground into bodies of water. Irrigated terrain should have a higher grassland to plains ratio than dry terrain. Mountain chains should cast rain shadows. Islands, mountains, and peninsulas should follow logical plate tectonics.
(October 29th, 2012, 15:11)luddite Wrote: But on the other hand, it would be really nice to grow some bigger cities, especially our capital. And it may be a while before we can even hook up the two calendar resources, so we'll be stuck at size 5 everywhere until then. Even longer until we can get any markets built.
Let's figure this out. Best techs after currency (to me) look like sailing -> calendar. That is 675 base beakers or pessimistically 13 turns of research. At that point we can hook up silk and spices. (Spices require a jungle area city, but not IW.)
Other possible paths to happiness include:
* Monarchy. 450 base beakers so pessimistically 9 turns of research. Then 1t of revolt. And at that point it's only providing 1 happiness unless we are willing to build extra units - which at this point in the game (no academy, for one thing...) is not worth it unless we need the units for other purposes too.
* Another option: Monotheism + Monarchy for 566 base beakers (11t research). Revolt to both civics and hinduism over two turns. Now we have +1-2 happy, almost as good as from calendar, plus the OR bonus, but we just spent two turns revolting and don't want to build a lot of buildings yet anyway.
* Third option which I honestly like better than the last two: simply revolt to hinduism. Maybe get Meditation and build a monastery to spread it. Worth about 0.5 happy since it's not even in every city.
I'm really underwhelmed by these compared to just teching Calendar immediately. If you consider the full cost of revolt turn I think it's actually cheaper, since we can get the civic-based happiness in the golden age for free! Plus it enables MoM nice and early, comes with sailing too, and lets us continue on to other important techs like Aesthetics and Literature sooner, giving us a better shot at the associated wonders. Plus, waiting a bit on switching to OR mode after getting the shrine gives more time for us to get free spreads.
OK I misread the map- I didn't see that it was possible to build plantations on the silk and spice without iron working. If we can really get calendar within 13 turns of research then, by all means, let's go for it right after we (hopefully) land the oracle.
However, I still don't like the idea of leaving our capital stuck at size 8 for so long. With HR, we could very quickly grow it up to size 15 and fill its BFC with cottages, setting it up to be a ridiculous powerhouse once we switch to bureaucracy.
What do you think of my last idea- running priests in MM and using a 2nd prophet for a golden age right after finishing the MoM? 12 turns of golden age would be enough to then pump out a 3rd prophet and a scientist in the capital (with help from caste at the end). Then we can have a third city start running merchants, to get us a 3rd golden age .
If we land the Oracle EOT68, we could get calendar around turn 80, and finish the MoM about turn 85-90 while we tech monotheism and HR. We could revolt to HR/OR at the beginning of it, caste system halfway through, and bureaucracy at the end .
(October 29th, 2012, 20:13)luddite Wrote: With HR, we could very quickly grow it up to size 15 and fill its BFC with cottages, setting it up to be a ridiculous powerhouse once we switch to bureaucracy.
I don't think this is true. If you look at the sim and our situation after it, we really don't have the production to be building a bunch of military units to grow the capital. And that isn't without its maintenance costs. Not to mention that without multipliers, pop is just pop as darrell said.
(October 29th, 2012, 20:13)luddite Wrote: With HR, we could very quickly grow it up to size 15 and fill its BFC with cottages, setting it up to be a ridiculous powerhouse once we switch to bureaucracy.
I don't think this is true. If you look at the sim and our situation after it, we really don't have the production to be building a bunch of military units to grow the capital. And that isn't without its maintenance costs. Not to mention that without multipliers, pop is just pop as darrell said.
Are you taking into account the extra production potential of a golden age? Hopefully by then we coild trade away our copper, too. And it would have a very large multiplier after we get into bureaucracy and set up an academy.
If you mean after we start the golden age - nobody is arguing against growing the capital at that point. I wouldn't be dead set on speeding up the golden age by running additional specialists though.
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