[PB75 Mjmd] Call to Power

[Amicalola]

100% convinced EXP Khmer is a hidden OP combo in CtH that everyone is too scared to try because the UB sucks in Vanilla. A 2-whip with high overflow (or better, a 1-turn build post-worker whip) for +1 food permanently is busted. I did not play PB66 well, and got shafted by the map, and EXP-Khmer was still very close to dragging me into contention.

[Mjmd]

What would you think of a non expansive combo like Hannibal? You've played both Hannibal and Khmer so would be curious to your thoughts. Again, I don't plan on picking this game unless A) I don't get Neb and B) I decide not to do something I've done before, but I am curious on that combo.

[Miguelito]

One wary to look at it maybe: with 1f->2h conversion from slavery (Yeah, fraught), a Baray becomes an AP building, without the wonder and without further advantages until much later. How much would you be willing to spend on that, given that you probably want early maths?

[Mjmd]

I mean let me be clear I don't think its stronger than America (mind I don't think anything is). I don't think its stronger than Zulu or org Sumeria. Is it stronger than financial Mali? Probably not, but maybe. But I have wanted to try for a while. Specifically in a game that will go later so A) the payoff time increases and B) the health matters more.

Mind you it is very clear Neb first because that is totally stupid but fun sounding and if I don't get then decide.

[Commodore]

Mjmd: Zulu start

[Mjmd]

I'll be reusing songs from games. Brief history included, but don't worry I'll do more when I get to actual game.

Liverpool Judies PB70. Top GNP city and site of 2 almost attacks.



I meant to do a post, but since it seemed like we had time I kept procrastinating, but lets do now.

So young Mjmd really liked Civ Call To Power, but didn't like it crashing on him all the time. Therefore it will come as little surprise that when civ 4 came out I got it pretty fast. I then proceeded to play a crap ton of single player games mainly at prince. Relevant for this story is that I also introduced it to my best friend. He was the one who found a couple civ stories and shared them. There were two that he shared most. I can't remember the other one, but one was Sulla. Fast forward years and one of AI survivors started, my friend reminded me, and I reread a bit. And then I decided that I wouldn't just join a multiplayer game. No no, I would organize one........ 

PB51 -  Can someone link the thread that has the civ game history? I had found, but now I've lost again..... Here is link to forum.
https://www.realmsbeyond.net/forums/foru...hp?fid=329

PB51 has the distinction of being the most recent base BTS pitboss game. I was a little intimidated by all the changes in RtR, so I started a base game with a point system for traits / techs I stole from PB44, which was the first game I lurked on the forum. There were other games going on at the time, but because of all the changes I mainly lurked just that one. Although I eventually got into PB49. 

So in single player you are just thrown in and then analyze your start. I naturally was a complete idiot, so this is also the last game played where you didn't get a starting screenshot.   It was supposed to be a large map with lots of players so I choose a late game combo in Elizabeth of Korea (again first game with point system cut me some slack). But point being I really wanted a academy capital and 



Now there is another plains hill in view that has more river tiles, so moved the scout



I was somewhat ridiculed for moving in lurker thread, but I stand by it. Now game had two copper sites, both were bad, but the one I moved toward only had a 2ng ring fish as food OR I could settle on and steal the grassland deer. Now I started next to SD of Agg Rome this game. And let me say there are reasons I no longer allow vets to join greens games. One is SD, the other is Plemo. Now sure SD play wise isn't always great, but its above most greens and picking agg Rome in a greens game is NOT cool man.... He also settled on copper, I initially decided to rush, then didn't, but did build 3 early axes....... Suffice it to say between no new food for 2nd city and building early units I shouldn't have I was SLOW this game. I made tons of mistakes, but one of the biggest was that I built a bit too much infrastructure / didn't assign cities to tasks as much. Point being after SD broke not only a fish for fish but a PAID fish for fish I got rolled up pretty well by him. The Korean UU was nice vs praets. I traded ground for time and eventually Lazteuq on other side of SD kept me from being killed. You'll note I don't mention any other neighbors and that would be due to the desert on the other side of me and Vanrober also being weak. In overall terms Plemo sharked the game, so it wasn't that much of an overall game although El Grillo did some valiant fighting after chariot rushing Amica.

Again, someone post the history thread please, but my thread is NOT the recommended one to read for this game. I would choose El Grillos probably.

[El Grillo]

Ah PB51, fun times. I also made a ton of mistakes that game and got pretty frustrated at times, but fun times nonetheless. By far the biggest takeaway from that game is that I chatted a bit with Amica in and out of game after unceremoniously war chariot rushing him in his first ever MP Civ4 game, and it turns out we had a bit in common and we ended up forming a weekly board gaming group with Jowy and Kaiser, which has continued to the present day.

Good luck and have fun in this one, Mjmd! Also happy holidays and hope you have a gentle year-end

[Tarkeel]

Again, someone post the history thread please, but my thread is NOT the recommended one to read for this game. I would choose El Grillos probably.

This one? (It's pinned in the Civ General Discussion forum)

[Mjmd]

Mjmd: Zulu start

Ragamuffin PB65. Solid city but mainly chosen because I love it and it speaks of beginning anew. 



PB67 quotes with some key strike throughs

So some people might be disappointed with this start and others might see it as an opportunity to play India! (ie low tech requirements and lots of flatland forests). To be fair tech requirements mean any civ is good to go here, so maybe should choose leader first. But I feel like I've lost "Mjmd always plays India" tag and I don't know if I want to let that go...... The main problem with India is myst starting tech, but could always try for Stonehenge, its been a while.........
River going each way means hopefully easy trade to a second city. That is all I got for now.

If you give Mjmd a start with lots of flatland forests and low tech he will want to play India.
If he wants to play India he will want to build stonehenge.
If he wants to build stonehenge he will want to be Industrious...... You know a trait I said I didn't want to play this game..... grumble grumble.
Man, I'm feeling it though....

So ya LOTs of forests and a lot of them flatland at that. Now you really want AH for this, but as I'm already committed to Neb...... India IS the best civ for industrious, but it IS awkward with wanting AH and needing hunting on way to AH. I don't think India is necessary though and I probably should pick a better tech civ and pick up myst later, but if its still hanging out there on snake wheel I will be tempted. Heck this would be an excellent Victoria of India start...... Imp with all the hammers here is great you can 5T settlers like I did PB66 (its almost 4T here), plus lots of river for financial,  but no no I must remain strong. To be fair all those forests will also be good for Industrious although..... it is awkward with my plan, but maybe a city that shares a lot of them. One of the problems that you can see in my crossed out quotes is that there is only one direction of river here meaning trade connect for a 2nd city without wheel wil be tough. Especially as all the food I could share is the opposite direction.  

A civ I was hoping for without real hope was Rome for its UB ironically, but fishing tech is a blank here and I will want to avoid for a bit. I also may just eat lost trade routes and try to avoid wheel, although I LOVE having wheel as starting tech. Ironically Khmer doesn't have bad starting techs. With tech requirements though I think I basically want mining plus either hunting or agriculture. I was hoping for no AH resources so I could do myst plus something civ maybe even Arabia, but especially with a nice sharing city 1SW of the grassland cow (gets new cow and shares 2 others, and is close) I think myst is out. I probably would take the current Zulu as just a great late game pick even if it has two cheap starting techs, but they don't go great with Neb. Thinking more though maybe a wheel civ isn't too bad as it is great for efficiency..... just make sure I build a crap ton of workers to chop out stonehenge once myst comes in. I'll probably do on two cities instead of getting another settler out which will feel weird.

Btw this should be obvious, but all Industrious leaders want stonehenge, but Neb REALLY wants stonehenge. There is a reason I didn't want a lot of players for this game and its going to require me to play a bit differently than my normal expand really fast.

[Mjmd]

Again, someone post the history thread please, but my thread is NOT the recommended one to read for this game. I would choose El Grillos probably.

This one? (It's pinned in the Civ General Discussion forum)

Ya that one.

Ah PB51, fun times. I also made a ton of mistakes that game and got pretty frustrated at times, but fun times nonetheless. By far the biggest takeaway from that game is that I chatted a bit with Amica in and out of game after unceremoniously war chariot rushing him in his first ever MP Civ4 game, and it turns out we had a bit in common and we ended up forming a weekly board gaming group with Jowy and Kaiser, which has continued to the present day.
Good luck and have fun in this one, Mjmd! Also happy holidays and hope you have a gentle year-end

Thanks and that is cool. I don't suppose you want to add a bit more to this history? Here is what I have, feel free to just edit the page if you have better. This was a game that didn't have any history. I know other stuff happened, but honestly no one besides you was even close to Plemo. I did add Lazteuq as another thread to read as Ref was ded lurking.

Large map donut base with additional land added on right side. El Grillo war chariot rushed Amica successfully. However, this allowed Plemo to take more land on El Grillos other side. Plemo landed a 12 city T86(ish) HG and kept a constant lead through the game. El Grillo and Plemo had off again on again wars but Plemos lead eventually grew too large.