[SPOILERS] Team EggHeads: DMOC and TeddyKGB (Now Lurker-Friendly!)

[TeddyKGB]

T37. Didn't finish turn.
Scout move after CareBears city#3 founded?

Turn 37: Move worker to gold, capital works same 3 tiles as before, MIT is size 2 and takes the 1F 3H tile.
Turn 38: Work the same tiles as before since no new population changes

Not quite. See screenshots above.

[TeddyKGB]

I think we should plan to settle our third city to grab the horses. If the copper pops in a better spot we can re-evaluate, but we need horses or copper with a third city, that is the lesson I have learned from my mistakes in PB13.

Yes, we should. Good point.

[Dhalphir]

wow, third city for a civ on the map already.

Damn those imperialistic pigdogs.

by the way here is my thread in PBEM53 if you want to follow me there from the start of the game
http://realmsbeyond.net/forums/showthread.php?tid=6405

[DMOC]

Teddy - I like the whip settler at size 6 plan. I did a quick runthrough and can verify your earlier plan here.

Some thoughts (correct me if I'm wrong):

-Grow MIT to size 3 (with no food overflow) and then start a worker while working cows, 1F3H mine, and 3H forested hill.
-Once MIT is size 3, we give the pigs back to the capital, which grows ASAP to size 6 while working high food tiles and building warriors.
-Once workerA is finished with the gold mine and its road connection, that should be when workerB is finished from MIT (which then starts on another worker). I suggest having both workers do 1 chop on hills, then road + mine them. WorkerC from MIT can assist in
-Note: turn 45 should be when the capital grows to size 6 (right?) and turn 47 is when we apply the 3-pop whip. Overflow goes into a (hopefully) 1-turn worker, assisted by a chop.
-I agree, getting horses in the 3rd city is a must, unless copper appears really close by.

I have some screens but they're a bit inaccurate. I think it's probably best to build two straight workers out of MIT at size 3, rather than a settler. Also, I think one of our workers should chop one of the hills in the capital. I (mistakenly) built a second grassland hill mine, but if you notice, none of the cities are working it!





Once you can confirm these thoughts we can get the REAL plan laid out shortly so I can link to it in the first post. (I need to correct the workerA, B, and C movements a bit.) No matter what, we should aim for 3 cities on or before turn 50 and 4 workers, with at least 4 warriors and a decent road network. I think that's doable.

[DMOC]

I think we should plan to settle our third city to grab the horses. If the copper pops in a better spot we can re-evaluate, but we need horses or copper with a third city, that is the lesson I have learned from my mistakes in PB13.

Yes, we should. Good point.

Agreed, we definitely need horses. Since we're creative, though, I think we can afford putting horses outside the starting 9 tiles in our third city.

wow, third city for a civ on the map already.

Damn those imperialistic pigdogs.

by the way here is my thread in PBEM53 if you want to follow me there from the start of the game
http://realmsbeyond.net/forums/showthread.php?tid=6405

Yes, which is why we need to make up for it. If you notice, though, the map really favored them geographically; they have irrigated corn, floodplains, and a river near their second city that makes it easy to get a trade route connection, and they presumably have a nice production monster as their third city (which also gets silver (!)), and that's not even taking into account their gold tile. Hopefully we can convince others that they're the top dog at the moment, which will divert attention away from us. Only four teams have at least two cities in this game, if my count is correct.

Vicky/India: Turns 28 and 37
Us: Turn 33
Isabella/Inca: Turn 33
Pacal/NA: Turn 36

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-I logged into the game and moved the scout 3-3, as we're going to have to go around their third city to get the scout back to our lands. Next turn I suggest moving 1 to reveal some new land, and then reevaluate from there (e.g. we could stop him there or if we're feeling brave we could move another tile).

-In diplomacy news, no new messages. Do we want to discuss anything with the two teams we've met?

[TeddyKGB]

@DMOC
Your text is correct for 6->3 settler micro.

Its could be better if we worked 2/1 tile in capital on T34-35 but too late now. Its not speed up the settler but would allow us to regrow faster after whip.
Configuration now still leave us option go woB on T43 in cap at size4, tho. It could lead to this sim.

We have time untill T39 to decide which way to go.

[TeddyKGB]

About CareBears.
Its true, the map seems favored to them.
But they did a nice job as well. Settle on PH, go for BW, mining Sheep, heavy chopping and one whip.

Still, they complete Wheel on T32 only. Their city#2 should be connected by now, but we don't know for sure. There is some more turns to connect city#3 for them.
They are keep ignoring Gold and Fish for now. They are FIN, but let's hope expenses slow them down a bit.

[TeddyKGB]

T38.

Next turn we'll get M&M graphs.
Lets think about units moves.

[DMOC]

@DMOC
Your text is correct for 6->3 settler micro.

Its could be better if we worked 2/1 tile in capital on T34-35 but too late now. Its not speed up the settler but would allow us to regrow faster after whip.
Configuration now still leave us option go woB on T43 in cap at size4, tho. It could lead to this sim.

We have time untill T39 to decide which way to go.

So what are the benefits of the two different sims?

Option 1: 6->3 population whip for settler
-More warriors
-Faster thirdcity by 2 turns
-Weaker trade network, possibly more forests chopped

Option 2: Workboat size 4
-Fewer warriors
-Better trade network and worker situation
-Slower third city by 2 turns

Any ideas? Teddy, you'll know more about the sims than I do. My gut is to prefer the one with the faster settler (The 6->3 whip) but I would be interested in seeing the layout of the empire on turn 50 in both sims. Also, will the placement of our second city matter?

If it helps, I can try to optimize the 6->3 sim in a few more hours.

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Unit moves? I'd suggest the scout just heal up. If team Care Bears get a religion founded in their third city, though, that might hinder our scout's traversal back to our lands. We'll need to keep an eye on that.

I would keep the warrior fortified on the gold tile. Next turn, he can start moving south to explore the coast, which we need to decide on our third city.

Team Margarita and Gladiator's Glory settled their second cities this turn (turn 39).

[DMOC]

I spent some more on the 6->3 whip sim. Here are some thoughts:

-Turn 45 is when we really need to make our worker actions count. On that turn, worker A will have finished his road to connect the gold to the capital (and MIT), and worker B will be produced. (I suggest we switch to slavery this turn.)
-Turn 49: We can settle our third city here by the horses and have insta trade route connection. Worker C is also produced this turn. We have 2 warriors to spare down south, so they should go on either side of the city to keep guard.
-Turn 51: 4th worker done
-Turn 55: Can hook up horses now
-Turn 56: Can get 4th city up by now, but requires capital being whipped to size 2 (don't like it). Otherwise we delay it by about 4 turns, but that actually might be fine if our workers are a bit slow in getting the road network set up.
-Turn 65-ish, can start library production in cities, but then who can make the settlers? Probably MIT will need to do it, but we can't afford to whip the city (it grows too slowly without the pigs).

The turn 51 situation.

Any thoughts? Idealy, I'd like to have libraries close to being done on turn 70, and having 4 cities before turn 60 with ample workers to improve them. MIT can go on full worker duty if needed, while the other cities build settlers.