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[PB37 SPOILER] Coeurva, Bacchus -- Cyrus of Carthage

Played T152 (was it?) -- whatever turn it is.

Bad news: we lost seven of our ancient ships and it turns out they did fuck all damage to Krill's galleons, for the most part (think 3.5 str left). A counterattack was simply not possible. That is, on Krill's naval forces.

The good news is that Krill diverted considerable force into his centre (the Bracken area) and landed six swords (most actually promoted along the Combat line, not CR) inside the city to reinforce it, also putting two extra (unpromoted) longbows onto the hill where we could have landed. So we didn't land. Instead, we retook Sweet Water and Regna hammer because I correctly called that Krill had diverted most of his outflanking galleons into the center. He can snipe one of our NavII galleons, but would leave himself open to our own C2 galleon if he does that.

Mandrake has been reinforced with a knight, catapult, and Guerilla longbow. That's not going to fall any time soon. Pay attention to Chehalis, though -- or a brute-force attack past Chehalis/Mandrake against Maudlin Sphinx!

I expect to lose Regna/SW again (at least the latter, although that's a rather marginal city to begin with) unless Krill has no swords left on those galleons; and this time, he'll probably just raze both cities. Nonetheless, I've offered him peace for (our) 300g (no gpt, though) -- some compensation and perhaps even a way to turn diplomacy around. (Krill is not the enemy, he just happened to hold a few cities we needed.) Maybe he'll take that and focus on Joey or Donovan? He has OB with Donovan btw, that's where his two northernmost galleons are parking. I'm astounded. He didn't send another absurd peace offer, which is kind of him.

Savant responded to our two galleons taking position at Styx by moving three! more units into Fountain Head (including a pike, he knows we have knights, which means he must have looked at our workshops' yields -- the guy is attentive) and covering the Tularian landing with a lbow. But then he left a worker out in the open?! -- In reality, those galleons are empty and are just sitting there to deny Savant a path towards our western islands in case he declares.

Demos not looking so good. Fourth in food again, but only 6th in MFG and pop -- that's the key, the galleon whips etc. and loss of Regna/SW have cost us dearly. We have room to improve, though, and Moai should give us another reprieve in 2t.

Going forward, we need to focus on three goals (if Krill signs peace, otherwise that's still top priority, be that as it may):

a) settle the two islands still available (between Sphinx and Mandrake, and one towards Joey in the western sea, sharing fish with Crested Eyrie)
b) improve infrastructure (e.g. Sphinx doesn't even have a lighthouse and cothon yet, due to all the military whips; get castles, get banks, spread Confu some more)
c) improve defenses against Savant (probably a lost cause to try defending against dtay in an actual war, but just keep Spire a prickly place and he might decide the Buddhist shrine would be juicier to take; don't protect Emerald Isle too much if it can't be held, focus on Ignis, which is the gate to Rhapsody)

Having played doesn't change that I'd very much like a sub. EDIT: But seems that at least Joey is fine with you taking over, chumchu. Krill too if you haven't read his thread since T140.
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I'm on it now.
My singleplayer balance mod of BTS: https://dl.dropbox.com/s/3u6g4b2nfa74qhm...%20mod.odt?
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Played my first turn and the military situation is not good. Savant and Krill are both attacking in the eastern sea and our mainland defenses are quite small except for the garrisons north, south and in Mandrake. I'm planning on whipping up a stack of 10 cats and 20 knights/numids to counter pushes from Krill, savant or dtay against our vulnerable mainland. Switched a lot of cities from wealth to military. That is a purely defensive move and not a way to win though. We need time to build infrastructure and settle some fillers above all else. I do not see that we have any easy military conquests. Maybe Savant later.

Better ships are needed if we are going to fight Krill but I would rather not. If we can just defend this front it would be fine. Theocracy is within easy reach but it is not what we need after the war and and a double civic switch hurts too much. Bulbing chemistry is the other option. If I understand it correctly we need to tech engineering and gunpowder and save up 2 scientists. That is doable. With that in mind I hired another scientist in the cap and started teching engineering. Engineering will be needed against dtay and for zone defense. Castles would help eco as well as defense and are cheap enough. Banks are better but they will have to wait until there is peace. Chemistry is also on the route towards steel, sci meth, biology. If we get peace we can hold off on it and use scientist for GA or bulbing philosophy and gunpowder on the way to drafting defenders.
My singleplayer balance mod of BTS: https://dl.dropbox.com/s/3u6g4b2nfa74qhm...%20mod.odt?
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Just want you to know, in case you feel like I've straddled you with an unsalvageable -- and more direly, unenjoyable -- game, feel free to pass it back to me. I'll stay unspoilt until Carthage dies.

And uh, we're not going to win this, so don't worry about whipping off pop for units. We might not be going to survive the next 20t. At best, we hold off Savant and Krill for a while until dtay techs Cuirassiers. At worst, Savant takes Ignis Fatuus and breaks open the empire. A few C1 galleons in the west could divert units from his stack, perhaps; he should have Optics, but should not have Astro yet. What about Guilds? Check his workshops.

I'm quite sure you can't build Numids at this stage, unfortunately. And yeah, get OF into walls into castles wherever possible; for raw economic benefit, they're more efficient than courthouses here, thanks to cothons and stone.

Most of the mainland fillers would't actually work additional tiles. They could be useful for extra build queues, maybe, but food->hammer conversion is much poorer in RtR than what you'd expect from BtS Slavery. Two grass mines cost as much as 1 unhappy citizen for an extra 60h over 10t -- with RtR slavery, a double-whip is worse unless the unit gives you an economic benefit, e.g. settler/worker (not losing one's capital is one such benefit as well, though) whereas BtS slavery comes out ahead (no worker labour wasted for essentially the same price, for one)
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Thanks! I appreciate that. I so not think it will be necessary but it is good to know.

I think savants attack is opportunism as he threatened one island city with a small stack transported via galleys. The plan is to trap his units on that island by killing his fleet and threatening his better island instead. He should not be able to do much without galleons. Krill is the real problem.

No new numids but we have five on the mainland that can be withdrawn from garrison duty and replaced with lbows and crossbows.

They have a use now when the bigger cities are whipped down and later on when we need to draft with nationalism. With currency and cothons the trade routes should make them profitable fast as well.
My singleplayer balance mod of BTS: https://dl.dropbox.com/s/3u6g4b2nfa74qhm...%20mod.odt?
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Can ships be attacked by other ship inside ports?
My singleplayer balance mod of BTS: https://dl.dropbox.com/s/3u6g4b2nfa74qhm...%20mod.odt?
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They cannot.

I have had a lot on my plate recently, so can't contribute much. Don't bother to try and hold onto islands, do hold onto mandrake.

How to play when odds of winning are low is a debated issue. I would still build the empire to exploit any openings that can arise. These are: dogpile against dtay and gavagai's attack against Dark Savant. I would also still consider culture. You can build towards exploiting both of these concurrently -- figure out where you will grow the artists and build cathedrals in the future, make some missionaries now, Sistine a little later, build units everywhere else. Teching to chemistry quickly is probably pointless know, would have been powerful if we were allied with Krill.
DL: PB12 | Playing: PB13
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I thought so but I got worried there for a moment.

Savant has knights as expected. Will add in pikes in build queues for northern and southern cities but there is so much that I want to build.

Re winning: the curves of other players are accelerating upwards whereas we are stagnating. If we can get some peace and quiet we might be able to settle a few cities, build infra and then pounce on someone later. The problem with culture is surviving the inevitable attack against you when you are getting close. But it does not hurt to prepare a bit towards it. Right now I need missionaries for all the cities first.
My singleplayer balance mod of BTS: https://dl.dropbox.com/s/3u6g4b2nfa74qhm...%20mod.odt?
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Don't bother with pikes, build knights. Yours are better promoted, and you can hit out with siege first.
DL: PB12 | Playing: PB13
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Interesting argument. In theory I agree but that would only work once I have enough knights and cats to strike a big stack. A Dtay stack might be 30+ knights or even cuirassiers in a while. That I can not counter at the moment so I think adding a pike as a top defender in border cities still makes sense. They are much less vulnerable to forking that way as well.
My singleplayer balance mod of BTS: https://dl.dropbox.com/s/3u6g4b2nfa74qhm...%20mod.odt?
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