Oh, and before I forget. Because of the road timings at Coast, the settler can be delayed 1 turn on the build but still settle on the hill on the same turn. This might be important if Sailing 4th is wanted to 1 turn a light house to open up that GLH play.
Regarding the coastal start, I don't see how it can be improved from that WB -> worker opening, unless something in the terrain changes. The avoid growth trick is crazy and I'm still not sure exactly how it works (it seems to create food from nowhere). The 16/16 food at size 2 is perfectly planned (I thought 17 food would have some effect, but the avoid growth doesn't count the extra food).
Food:
Sheep variant has just grown to size 5 using wheat instead of sheep for 1t, and has 9/20f. Growth in 2t.
Wheat variant has just grown to size 5 after AG trick, and has 15/20f. Growth in 1t.
Production:
Sheep variant has built a second warrior and then started a library. 14h in the library.
Wheat variant has built a second and third warrior and has 3h overflow, so 1h less total and didn't have library option until a turn later (not 100% sure on the last bit).
Commerce:
Sheep variant has earned +20 commerce, from working sheep 2x more and gems 2x more. Both are about to grow onto their first cottage. Wheat variant will get its first turn of its second cottage 1t faster, 2t from now.
Workers:
I think both variants make good use of their in-transit worker turns - I don't see a difference in quality here.
In a vacuum I'd say the 20c + 1h (+more hammers put into library) beats the 5f, since we are about to reach happy cap anyway. But it's worth mentioning what the plan is with both variants after they grow to 6. My tentative plan for sheep variant was to reach size 6 (with 32/60 in the library) and then switch to a settler. Settler finishes after 5t of 15h/t, so t32, and has 10h overflow. Library therefore finishes 2t after that, 34, at 60/60; food is approximately at enough to grow to 7 (but we don't want to - no happy) but hopefully the sheep or wheat can be borrowed by the new city. So this plan is a bit inefficient as we don't use some food at the end, which we had to produce while completing the library.
In the wheat variant, I haven't run it this far but Krill says we are whipping the settler and regrowing on the library. So there's a good chance we can use the food (and, we get the settler earlier), though the tradeoff is fewer cottage turns I guess. It's a tough call and I guess we need the specifics of the settler whip plan to compare. And, we may need some more map knowledge to know which one is better.
Quote:Krill: Using the avoid growth trick, can use the turn growing to size 5 to build into a settler
Do you mean in Uruk? If so, building into the settler defeats the purpose of the AG trick - we don't put any more food into the granary. If not, I don't know what you're referring to.
(March 4th, 2013, 19:15)Ichabod Wrote: Regarding the coastal start, I don't see how it can be improved from that WB -> worker opening, unless something in the terrain changes. The avoid growth trick is crazy and I'm still not sure exactly how it works (it seems to create food from nowhere). The 16/16 food at size 2 is perfectly planned (I thought 17 food would have some effect, but the avoid growth doesn't count the extra food).
For the record I tried worker first for a comparison point last night (still teching AH-pottery), because I was noticing that WB-first was a bit lighter than we want on worker turns. Well, worker first does give us +4 worker turns. However, the cost is 14f, 3h, and 12c. I'd spend four worker turns chopping THAT forest.
I'd suggest not picking black; besides the fact that it might confuse other players, it also tends to fade into the background if one does not look closely enough.
Merovech's Mapmaking Guidelines:
0. Player Requests: The player's requests take precedence, even if they contradict the following guidelines.
1. Balance: The map must be balanced, both in regards to land quality and availability and in regards to special civilization features. A map may be wonderfully unique and surprising, but, if it is unbalanced, the game will suffer and the player's enjoyment will not be as high as it could be.
2. Identity and Enjoyment: The map should be interesting to play at all levels, from city placement and management to the border-created interactions between civilizations, and should include varied terrain. Flavor should enhance the inherent pleasure resulting from the underlying tile arrangements. The map should not be exceedingly lush, but it is better to err on the lush side than on the poor side when placing terrain.
3. Feel (Avoiding Gimmicks): The map should not be overwhelmed or dominated by the mapmaker's flavor. Embellishment of the map through the use of special improvements, barbarian units, and abnormal terrain can enhance the identity and enjoyment of the map, but should take a backseat to the more normal aspects of the map. The game should usually not revolve around the flavor, but merely be accented by it.
4. Realism: Where possible, the terrain of the map should be realistic. Jungles on desert tiles, or even next to desert tiles, should therefore have a very specific reason for existing. Rivers should run downhill or across level ground into bodies of water. Irrigated terrain should have a higher grassland to plains ratio than dry terrain. Mountain chains should cast rain shadows. Islands, mountains, and peninsulas should follow logical plate tectonics.
(March 5th, 2013, 11:14)Merovech Wrote: I'd suggest not picking black; besides the fact that it might confuse other players, it also tends to fade into the background if one does not look closely enough.
I don't think Black is that bad. Byzantine gray, HRE dark yellow, all tehse seem worst. But, yeah, not a big deal. I just thought Black and White would look good.
Well, I look at some screenshots from Locke's thread on PB4 and I have to agree, black gets a little confusing, yes.
I'd spend four worker turns chopping THAT forest. 
