[SPOILERS] scooter's thread: England

[scooter]

Bit confused by the England and Germany builds.

I mostly agree. Hopefully scooter will enlighten us.

Yeah I figured those builds would raise a few eyebrows . I'll answer why I built Army Liverpool first. Essentially, it was just a diplomatic move. It's the only move that I can safely argue is neither anti-Italy (when talking to Rowain) nor anti-Russia (when talking to Regoarrar). Few considerations first:

1) I really don't need another fleet right now. Fleet Edinburgh was a consideration, but it's not necessary and would telegraph my intentions to Regoarrar. Though in fairness, supporting Uberfish into Bot last turn may have done that anyways.

2) We really do not need another English army in Europe at all. Adding another army there does nothing to speed Nakor's death, and all it really does is result in out-of-place military once Nakor is gone.

3) I still don't really know yet if I'm headed at Russia next or Italy next. The original thinking was to dispose of Italy after Nakor (easiest source of centers for me), but with an A/R alliance looking pretty solid, that's starting to look like a foolish decision that will simply result in A/I/R vs E/G, which basically equals stalemate.

So I don't need a fleet, and I don't need an army yet... but I will need one. So Liverpool gives me the flexibility to go north to Russia or south to Italy next year. So for instance, Swe->Nor->Nwg this year and Lvp->Cly would let me convoy into Norway next year and put added pressure on Russia. That's not the only fleet that can make that convoy by the way, but it's just an option. On the other hand, he can hang in Liverpool and convoy to Portugal/Spain for an Italy stab if need be. It's flexibility... but I can easily go to Rowain and say that Liverpool is my way of keeping Russia calm for just a bit longer until I can actually convoy into the Northeast and put pressure on him... And I can go to Regoarrar and say I'm going to stab Italy and put up that build as proof that I don't have hostile intentions towards him.

The underlined portion is the key here. It's diplomatic flexibility for a build that I didn't really need quite yet.


So why did Uberfish build Fleet Kiel instead of Berlin? Basically to do the same kind of thing... Regoarrar has of course been poking me and Uberfish about stabbing each other... That fleet will definitely go into the Baltic, however building in Kiel allows Uberfish to have a chance at convincing Regoarrar that he could stab me... It likely will make no difference at all, but it gives him an "in" to possibly get Rego to open up a bit about his plans.

The reason we'd like to know his plans is because Regoarrar has a big conundrum this year. If he holds in St. Petersburg and moves Livonia to Moscow, he can safely protect St. Petersburg from us. Howeva, that would mean Regoarrar is unable to build in St. Petersburg or Moscow (he will likely get 2 more builds this year), which would be bad because that's where it's most critical that he gets builds. Sooo.... It's probably going to be another guessing game this year. What I don't want is for him to build another fleet in Stp or something, as that would just bog things down and make him more dangerous in the north. Not fun.


Any questions?

[Commodore]

Any questions?

Yep. It seems like you and Uber are trusting each other, coordinating well, etc...but unsure about where to go after Nakor falls, either Russia or Italy offers good options. So why aren't you opening up your Ebonics Dictionaries and pushing Lew hard here? E/G/A seems like a fairly equitable division of spoils.

[scooter]

Yep. It seems like you and Uber are trusting each other, coordinating well, etc...but unsure about where to go after Nakor falls, either Russia or Italy offers good options. So why aren't you opening up your Ebonics Dictionaries and pushing Lew hard here? E/G/A seems like a fairly equitable division of spoils.

Excellent question, you are definitely thinking the right way.

We actually are doing that, but I'm letting Uberfish do the talking here. Basically, it's much easier to get Uberfish to make the case to Lewwyn... If both of us are pushing it, he may be a bit more skeptical that we're just using him to hurt Russia... Whereas a Germany/Austrian relationship in this situation is a little more feasible IMO. Uberfish has a LOT of ammunition here that he has been using:

1) Russia's next play almost HAS to be to stab Austria. The only real 3-way alliances that can work well is E/G/A and E/G/I, and EGA is probably more powerful than EGI. Notice what was missing from those? Russia. With 5 people left, if a 3v2 situation arises, Russia will likely be left out unless people play sub-optimally. By that I mean: EG vs AIR is effectively a stalemate and would be pointless, but if stubbornness remained there may be nothing to do about it... But Regoarrar recognizes that he's better off with 4 players (including himself) than 5, and in a world where Russia has an ally AND absorbs Austria's land - well that's a beautiful spot for Russia to be in... So Uberfish is pressing Austria hard in saying that Lewwyn must stab Regoarrar because if he doesn't, Regoarrar will be the one doing the stabbing.

2) For Lewwyn to stick with Russia, if Russia does NOT stab, his best-case scenario is finishing 2nd, because Russia is benefitting far more from Turkey falling than Austria is. Whereas if Austria turns on Russia to form an EGA - he's got a real shot at winning with immediate access to a TON of centers to his east.


So believe me, work is being done behind the scenes on this... But thus far, Lewwyn has been cautious/stubborn/etc. Hopefully progress will continue.

[Sareln]

Excellent question, you are definitely thinking the right way.

We actually are doing that, but I'm letting Uberfish do the talking here. Basically, it's much easier to get Uberfish to make the case to Lewwyn... If both of us are pushing it, he may be a bit more skeptical that we're just using him to hurt Russia... Whereas a Germany/Austrian relationship in this situation is a little more feasible IMO. Uberfish has a LOT of ammunition here that he has been using:

1) Russia's next play almost HAS to be to stab Austria. The only real 3-way alliances that can work well is E/G/A and E/G/I, and EGA is probably more powerful than EGI. Notice what was missing from those? Russia. With 5 people left, if a 3v2 situation arises, Russia will likely be left out unless people play sub-optimally. By that I mean: EG vs AIR is effectively a stalemate and would be pointless, but if stubbornness remained there may be nothing to do about it... But Regoarrar recognizes that he's better off with 4 players (including himself) than 5, and in a world where Russia has an ally AND absorbs Austria's land - well that's a beautiful spot for Russia to be in... So Uberfish is pressing Austria hard in saying that Lewwyn must stab Regoarrar because if he doesn't, Regoarrar will be the one doing the stabbing.

2) For Lewwyn to stick with Russia, if Russia does NOT stab, his best-case scenario is finishing 2nd, because Russia is benefitting far more from Turkey falling than Austria is. Whereas if Austria turns on Russia to form an EGA - he's got a real shot at winning with immediate access to a TON of centers to his east.


So believe me, work is being done behind the scenes on this... But thus far, Lewwyn has been cautious/stubborn/etc. Hopefully progress will continue.

Clearly you just need to fly someone out to China to ply him with good booze...

[scooter]

Clearly you just need to fly someone out to China to ply him with good booze...

Well considering last time he got boozed up he submitted pro-Russia orders, I'm not so sure that's the route I want to go.

[Brian Shanahan]

Well considering last time he got boozed up he submitted pro-Russia orders, I'm not so sure that's the route I want to go.

I honestly don't think he was boozed with those orders. I know I'm going on two posts (in the organising thread), but as someone with experience of posting while drunk, they were just too calculated and polished to be actual drunk talk.

[scooter]

I honestly don't think he was boozed with those orders. I know I'm going on two posts, but as someone with experience of posting while drunk, they were just too calculated and polished to be actual drunk talk.

Glad to know I wasn't the only one who thought that.

I'd like to make a prediction by the way. I predict that Lewwyn's "drunk posts" are faked so that he can "accidentally" do something this turn. I have no idea what though... Uberfish pinged me on chat and told me that Lewwyn isn't going to attack Regoarrar (apparently Lewwyn told him that in a very drunk way), but who knows what he'll order at this point.

Wait, you have experience posting while drunk? Links please . I do distinctly remember Sciz rampaging all over RB one day awhile back.

[Brian Shanahan]

Glad to know I wasn't the only one who thought that.




Wait, you have experience posting while drunk? Links please . I do distinctly remember Sciz rampaging all over RB one day awhile back.

I have a strange habit of not going out of my head drunk, and usually delete my worst excesses, but I believe there are still some funky posts back in CFC. But my biggest problem with alcahol is that it usually takes me 20 minutes to spell "the" correctly.

[Sareln]

I honestly don't think he was boozed with those orders. I know I'm going on two posts (in the organising thread), but as someone with experience of posting while drunk, they were just too calculated and polished to be actual drunk talk.

Eh, you should've seen the orders he submitted

[scooter]

Eh, you should've seen the orders he submitted

Paste them in here!! It's not like it's spoiler info, but you've really piqued my interest now.