All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.
From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king.
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FFH-20: Jonas Endain of the Clan of Embers
EITB Pitboss 1: Clan/Elohim/Calabim with Mardoc and Thoth
So, how do we feel as lone hippie among the horde of rushers and warmongers? Because I'm kind of tempted to go back to that Kandros / Doviello option right now
Ellimist Wrote:You mentioned the possibility of teaming up in another PBEM as Mahala. With unrestricted leaders, I'm not sure if I'd choose her, but if you're interested in teaming up we could find a fun combination.
Maybe a tolerant doviello or something, ;)
Ellimist
Mist Wrote:Nah, Tolerant on Doviello sucks ;)
First a disclaimer - I have not read the thread yet, so don't know the
proposed game rules.
Nevertheless, I always considered Khandros Fir of Doviello is a pretty
interesting proposition :]
Ellimist Wrote:Yeah it was the first thing that came to mind if we were going Doviello again. It would have been interesting to have Lanun/Calabim cities(moroi!) last game.
Kandros sounds good, I think the Doviello get more out of aggressive than most civs and financial is always nuts.
Would we want to go Doviello, though? Other civs could probably offer a bit more without giving up early rush potential. Maybe we wouldn't have 3 players eliminated by turn 30. Perhaps Kandros of Illians or something.
Ellimist
Mist Wrote:Well, if we don't go Doviello, and we don't want some other obviously
cheesy combination ( like Flauros of Calabim or Keelyn of Balseraph ;]
), how about this for an idea :
Arthurus Thorne of the Clan
Ellimist Wrote:Clan sounds fine to me. Any particular reason for Arturus? Is it warrens + command posts?
I think we won't have access to any worldspell if we aren't at peace with barbarians.
Some possibilities:
Varn(Spi/Cre/Adap) of the Illians:
No agnostic trait so we can get a religious archmage with ice mana. Spiritual gives faster temples and more powerful priests of winter and adaptive can give summoner or something else. If we can't get Varn but want to go Illians, we could do Keelyn(Cre/Sum) for PoW 2 turn Ice elementals.
Varn of the Sidar:
Spiritual gives potency to disciples and we can adaptive into charismatic if we want for earlier waning.
Varn of the Svartalfar/Ljosalfar:
They already want to build lots of priests of leaves and Spiritual combos well with that plus adaptive is good.
Kandros(Agg/Fin/Ing) of the Doviello: Financial plus cheap upgrades boosted by aggressive means a strong enough (upgrade?) rush with potential for the endgame.
Arturus(Ind/Org/Ing)of the Clan: Soldier of Kilmorph abuse and warrens synergy with command post.
Tebryn(Arc/Sum) of the Amurites/Balseraphs: Abuse summoner trait.
Perp(Insane) of the Kurioates: Lose the sprawling trait, keep the jewelers/tailors/etc.
Perp(Insane) of the Grigori: Lose the agnostic trait, keep the good Grigori stuff.
Cardith Lorda(Exp/Phi/Adap) of the Clan: Expansive doubles settler production, warrens doubles it again and we have adaptive instead of the barb trait.
Mist Wrote:
Quote:Varn(Spi/Cre/Adap) of the Illians:
No agnostic trait so we can get a religious archmage with ice mana. Spiritual gives faster temples and more powerful priests of winter and adaptive can give summoner or something else. If we can't get Varn but want to go Illians, we could do Keelyn(Cre/Sum) for PoW 2 turn Ice elementals.
Not really in mood to play Illians, but not a bad idea.
Quote:Varn of the Sidar: Spiritual gives potency to disciples and we can adaptive into charismatic if we want for earlier waning.
Good one, something we've been looking for and makes Sidar very strong
towards endgame.
Quote:Varn of the Svartalfar/Ljosalfar: They already want to build lots of priests of leaves and Spiritual combos well with that plus adaptive is good.
I don't like playing elves, they stoke my worst builder instincts :]
Quote:Kandros(Agg/Fin/Ing) of the Doviello: Financial plus cheap upgrades boosted by aggressive means a strong enough (upgrade?) rush with potential for the endgame.
No rushes. Go full farmers gambit while threatening everyone with
hostilities. Avoid BW as long as possible, go RoK, grab mines then
switch to OO and beeline early Fanaticism. Destroy the world with
cheap Beastman->Drown->Stygian abuse :]
Quote:Arturus(Ind/Org/Ing)of the Clan: Soldier of Kilmorph abuse and warrens synergy with command post.
Yup. Add chokes with early Wolfriders to the list.
Quote:Tebryn(Arc/Sum) of the Amurites/Balseraphs: Abuse summoner trait.
Kyan will do puppets to death in VII, no need to repeat that one ;)
Quote:Perp(Insane) of the Kurioates: Lose the sprawling trait, keep the jewelers/tailors/etc. Perp(Insane) of the Grigori: Lose the agnostic trait, keep the good Grigori stuff.
I love both of these. I love Grigori more of the two :]
Quote:Cardith Lorda(Exp/Phi/Adap) of the Clan: Expansive doubles settler production, warrens doubles it again and we have adaptive instead of the barb trait.
I'm still rooting for Flauros of Khazad.
And if we want to go full warmonger.
Hannah of Hippus? :]
Ellimist Wrote:It sounds like the following might happen:
Quote:No snake pick, duplicate leaders permitted but not civs. Send a sealed list of top 3 options to someone who replies with everyones final civ. Then when the player knows what civ they have, they pick the leader that best suits the civ. A snake pick is going to destroy whoever is first in the pick, because FFH lacks a lot of trait combinations. Duplicate leaders (but not civs) will give players options and we won't get screwed over if someone takes the 1 leader that works with the chosen civ as we intended.
Mist Wrote:So, which 3 do we want to play most? :]
Ellimist Wrote:It's hard to narrow it down... I guess my preference is for civs that people rarely play except we substitute a good leader in.
Doviello(Kandros): No rushes. Go full farmers gambit while threatening everyone with hostilities. Avoid BW as long as possible, go RoK, grab mines then switch to OO and beeline early Fanaticism. Destroy the world with cheap Beastman->Drown->Stygian abuse. And if we're aiming for early fanaticism we may as well try for Basium too.
Sidar(Varn):
I'm not very familiar with the Sidar, but hopefully few people are.
Grigori:
I'd have to test this and see whether we'd need to use perp to lose agnostic or if we could use a better leader. Maybe Cardith or Hannah.
Khazad(Flauros):
A strong leader that makes up for the weaknesses of the civ. This seems more challenging than the other options due to vaults and other restrictions.
Mist Wrote:Let's go for Sidar, Khazad and Dovielo then, in this order.
Unorthodox, fun and somewhat challenging. At least we won't be bored
;)
We also had several chats that covered the same topics.
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FFH-20: Jonas Endain of the Clan of Embers
EITB Pitboss 1: Clan/Elohim/Calabim with Mardoc and Thoth
Ellimist Wrote:Do you think our Sidar plans are doomed?
They suddenly got hell more challenging ( seriously, what's with all these bloodthirsty players in this game ). And you thought Khazad would be hard
We'll probably need a serious farmer's gambit ( like Agri -> Calendar -> Education -> CoL -> Veil beeline ) shrewd diplo and whole lot of luck early on. Not being next to the Clan or Hippus would help too. Once we limp to zombies and pyromaniacs ( we're switching Fin first, don't have the luxury of choice with competition like this ) we should be fine to turtle up and go back to what we planned to do.
Mist Wrote:we should be fine to turtle up and go back to what we planned to do.
So...when do the lurkers find out about this plan?
Also - any vote from you two on increasing map size a smidgen so I have a sea to play with? I would be surprised if you objected to putting more distance between you and the others, but I've been surprised before.
Mardoc Wrote:So...when do the lurkers find out about this plan?
After we limp to zombies and pyromaniacs in one piece Unless Elimist writes up something in these <reserved> posts earlier
Mardoc Wrote:Also - any vote from you two on increasing map size a smidgen so I have a sea to play with? I would be surprised if you objected to putting more distance between you and the others, but I've been surprised before.
Increase away Any chance you can make it 250x250 or something? Or at least put us somewhere on an island in that inland sea
Not sure how much I'll be lurking this.
). And you thought Khazad would be hard 
And I can't stretch my mandate *too* far.