[spoiler!] Ruffing Bull of Spain

[T-hawk]

Right. On your T22, player 1 can steal from player 2 cleanly. But player 1 can refresh counterespionage now so that player 2 doesn't get a steal window on his T22.

Regrettable bug, but at least it can be patched by agreement (no stealing from a later player one turn after counterespionage expires), or just by banning stealing entirely as we often do.

[Ruff_Hi]

Here is an option for a 2nd GEng ... thoughts?

Star_Fox,

I am writing to you about the above game ... as you can see, I have a fair number of military units on your border that are ready to invade. I was wondering if you would be interested in a trade such that my invasion is postponed or averted. The items that I would be interested in acquiring are:

1 x Great Scientist
1 x Great Engineer

Please suggest possible terms for such a trade.

Regards,

Ruffing_Bull
WEGD

Star_Fox,

No answer? Just to be clear, I am not demanding those items ... I am trying to acquire them via trade. As such, I am inquiring what you would want via trade in return. It could be any number of things. For example:

• No war declaration for x turns
  
• Military Units
  
• Workers
  
• Settlers
  
• Cities
  
• resources
  
• Support against another player
  

Please give me an idea regarding what you would like to acquire in exchange for the two items I have mentioned.

Regards,

Ruff
WEGD

Hello Ruffing,

Sorry for the delay.

In return for your friendship and protection, I am prepared to become your vasal for at least 25 turns.

Will this be acceptable?

Star,

That is something that I hadn't considered. Let me think about it and I will get back to you. Initial feelings is 'hmm - that could work' but I am concerned about cancelling it in the game ... not even sure if that can be done.

I'll get back to you.

[Ruff_Hi]

Another dog walk, another chance to think about this game ...

I've decided that a vassal isn't going to work for me ... sends the wrong message to the other players (and Caer) and hamstrings me too much. As such, I have countered with this offer ...

Star Fox,

Capitulation isn't going to work for me ... it sends the wrong message to the other players and could put you too much under my control.

How about this for a trade agreement:

Star Fox gifts the following to Ruff (as soon as the trade is agreed, based on minimum travel time to Western Expanse land):

• 1 x Great Engineer
  
• 1 x Great Scientist

Ruff extends the following to Star Fox:

• Mutual Defensive Pact for no less than 15 turns
  

This will give you significant time to address your military situation given the emerging nature of the land that we inhabit.

Regards,

Ruff

[Nicolae Carpathia]

Holy crap, ain't that a deal. Are you even in a position to defend him from attack?

Probably not, outsourcing your defences is a chump's game.

[Ruff_Hi]

Holy crap, ain't that a deal. Are you even in a position to defend him from attack?

I'm sorry - where did I say that I would defend his cities? Sure ... a defensive pact means that the game will auto-declare on anyone that declares on him ... but the game doesn't auto move my units to attack those forces.

[Nicolae Carpathia]

No of course not. If he takes that deal, you're basically getting two (2) great people in exchange for a worthless piece of paper.

[Ruff_Hi]

No of course not. If he takes that deal, you're basically getting two (2) great people in exchange for a worthless piece of paper.

... and no need to deal with rampant conquistadors for 15 turns.

I really wish that RB had the CFC smilie icon ... you know the one ... the one with the teeth :D

[NobleHelium]

I would take the vassal deal if he's not stupid enough to take this one.

[Ruff_Hi]

I would take the vassal deal if he's not stupid enough to take this one.

Can vassal deals be cancelled?

[NobleHelium]

By the vassal. Maybe by the suzerain if the vassal refuses a demand, that's how it is in SP...