[SPOILERS] Peter of the Ottomans carries a big stick

[thestick]

Uh, Krakatoa isn't quite a 'frontline' city. Still, settling the Stone city will block off the land to Tankra if he doesn't invade (and he probably will at some point). That Stone won't be much use if we don't land the Hanging Gardens, except for Walls.

[thestick]

Okay, I whipped the Granary in Tohoku. I also made the Worker north of Krakatoa road, since the cottage completed. That's what I get for trying to do micro in my head... I swapped to cottages in Yellow River and Krakatoa. The Great Scientist comes out of Aral Sea T66.

More importantly, the Hanging Gardens. I'd overestimated the distance to Masonry. Mathematics comes in T63 from burning the saved gold, and Masonry comes in T65! Time to speed up the Hanging Gardens plan.

There are two options: stone and no stone. The Stone plan will actually work out. The road to the Stone site (which I will be calling Deepwater Horizon, just without the space in Civ due to character limits) will be finished up to the tile next to it T67. The Settler will be whipped out of Katrina (since I don't want to delay the Great Scientist or Masonry by whipping away Aral Sea's Scientists) T66, the Settler will be in position T67, and the city will be founded T68, just when the Hammam completes and we start the Hanging Gardens themselves.

However, I don't think we should settle the stone site. The main reasons are economic and military. Take a look at the map:

If the Dropbox link doesn't work (it doesn't for me right now), I've placed the image at the bottom of this post.

(Would you believe me if I said that I reconstructed most of this map from memory?) Tankra's Dumb city of Mud is pretty well positioned to fork the two cities. Place a stack on the Sheep, march it to whichever is less defended. I'm also worried about sudden Chariot strikes from the Sheep on Deepwater Horizon, and Aral Sea once the forest SE is chopped.

We don't have much military in the area right now, just an Archer and an Axe. We'll move the spear from Katrina down there. That's enough to defend Aral Sea, but not Deepwater Horizon.

Deepwater Horizon will be absurdly expensive. Yellow River was about 5 dollars! We're only really making about 15 surplus gold, the rest is Library bonuses and Scientists.

Other things: if we don't land the Hanging Gardens, that stone will be near useless. I really don't want to whip that Settler over a Hammam out of Katrina. We really don't have the Worker labor for it.

Now for the no stone plan. We can get the Gardens T74 by chopping all of our forests. Each forest we don't chop will make the Gardens take one turn longer. We'll need to chop at least one forest to clear the land for a plains hill mine. We'll also need two Workers to build the Mine, as we'll chop the Forest T68 and work the second Mine T70. (Mines take 4 turns to build, right? If not, I'll just send more Workers) I've posted the micro spreadsheet at the bottom of this post. Feel free to have a look and tell me if I've made any stupid mistakes. I probably did, considering I did it with pencil and paper and typed it up later.

I think of the 'Stone' plan as the guaranteed short-term gain for a long term liability, while the 'No Stone' plan is better in the long term, while a bit risky in the short term. I really wish I knew how close our rivals are to Mathematics and Masonry.

[NobleHelium]

Mines take 3 turns on Quick speed. And I think Normal speed too, but I'm not certain of that.

[thestick]

Mines take 3 turns on Quick speed. And I think Normal speed too, but I'm not certain of that.

Thanks. Well, in that case, we should be able to chop the forest T67 to get absurd amounts of overflow from the Hammam, then have the mine ready by T70. I'm not sure we'll be able to get the Hanging Gardens, and I'm not sure it's worth it since we only have 5 cities...

This turn was rather uneventful domestically. The Spear in Katrina finished, and I sent it to Aral Sea. I queued up a Monument in Tohoku and a Library in Yellow River. Tohoku isn't much of a commerce city. I see it mostly churning out some Workers and units in the short-term. We might run some Scientists later, but that's in a while. I'll probably funnel a chop into that Library in Yellow River, or just use those 20 hammers for a Monument. We discovered Mathematics on the turn roll and Katrina and Krakatoa grow to Size 5 and 7, respectively. We've recovered to about 35% research.

The biggest news was foreign. Nicolae declared on Sian and took the city of Chlamys! Sian only has 2 cities, one of which has the Buddhist shrine! Well, Nicolae and SAT should be crashing their economies, except Nicolae has the Pyramids and Representation Scientists. He's clearly the most dangerous. We're pretty clearly the third place Civ here. We're third in GNP and Crop Yield. First is Nicolae, second is SAT, fourth is Tankra, and last is Sian.

I've been considering going to Construction and whacking Tankra with Catapults (War Elephants are banned for obvious reasons). Tankra's soldiers are all lower than Strength 4, unless he grabs Horse Archers (then, we run into Flanking issues and need to take Repel a Leper and the Horses there). Grab Repel a Leper with a Chariot strike (there's still only one Dog and one Archer), then march a good old Stack of Doom at Dumb Mud. The other option is the bog-standard Currency/Code of Laws/Civil Service economic path. Possibly Monarchy if we're feeling the happy crunch.

[Bigger]

whats our breakeven research rate? Are we close to any economic techs (currency, code of laws, CS, etc.)?

I do agree that taking dumb mud would be preferrable to founding stone city in jungle <G>

also, yellow river will be a nice whip production city if we ever get iron working .

[thestick]

whats our breakeven research rate? Are we close to any economic techs (currency, code of laws, CS, etc.)?

I do agree that taking dumb mud would be preferrable to founding stone city in jungle <G>

also, yellow river will be a nice whip production city if we ever get iron working .

Breakeven is 30%, 28 beakers with +1 gold. Of course, this is boosted from the 11.25 beakers we're getting from Scientists. We just finished Mathematics. Currency and Construction are both available. Calendar seems pretty useless since we don't have a single calendar resource yet. I'll get the report up once I cut up the pictures, but we're 2nd in GNP right now. 1st is Nicolae who's buffed by Pyramid culture.

I can't believe I never realized that about Yellow River...

Maybe I'm ignorant, but what does the <G> that you end your posts with stand for?

[Bigger]

<G> = grin.
yes yellow river will be an outstanding city once all the cottagees are built, borders expand so we can work those sheep, and we have iron working so we can work the pigs.

looks like our economy situation improved not so much because we got better but because everyone else got worse, haha.

also, I'm lmao at you putting me in your sig. Go Texas!! .

[NobleHelium]

http://bigthink.com/strange-maps/537-wha...s?page=all

[Bigger]

that's an interesting article Noble, thanks. There is another reason the split never happenned: which "state" would get the Alamo?

its a little outdated though, Texas is number 2 in population now (only behind california, New york is 3rd).

Here's an interesting fact you may not know: There are 3 electrical grids in the U.S. One covers all of eastern USA (divide somewhere in the midwest, not sure exactly). one covers all of western USA. And the third one just covers Texas <G>.

[thestick]

This turn was rather uneventful. More growing, building more cottages, the works. I think we might want to take a pass on the Hanging Gardens. Spending 200 hammers to get 100 hammers doesn't seem good. The health is mostly irrelevant, we're swimming in health. Those 200 hammers could be a huge stack of units!

Speaking of that, the basic plan right now is Tech to Construction while building some Axes, Spears, and Chariots, then chop out some Catapults and enough Chariots to take Repel a Leper (which I'm guessing is about 5~6, we'll need enough to suicide against the inevitable Spear). Tankra is the obvious choice over SAT. SAT has higher power and more cities. Tankra still has 4 cities (though his city of Seline Felines pretty much counts for our two cities of Aral Sea and Katrina). Our Strength 5 Catapults will win against his Strength 4 Dog Soldiers and Spearmen. The strike on Repel a Leper is to disconnect Horses so he doesn't get Horse Archers, which are his best counter to Catapults. The upsides of this plan are obvious - Tankra's land! Catapults are the nearest flashpoint for military. The downsides are the obvious whipping away of those Scientists and crashing the economy before Currency. Give me some time to think...

Another thing, I think we should whip Hammams even if we plan to invade. More happy will be great to stave off the whipping anger and maintain good production.

In foreign news, SAT took the city of Chiton! Chiton has the Buddhist Shrine. Sian's down to only his capital! SAT has 8 cities!

The cities at the end of the turn:
Krakatoa:

My plan here is the 3-pop whip of the Hammam, overflowing into something miltary-related. Simple.

Aral Sea:

I'm thinking of two-pop whipping a Worker and overflowing into some military here. Of course, whipping away those Scientists will be a huge blow. I can't believe that Aral Sea is making as many beakers as Krakatoa.

Katrina:

I've sent a Worker to build another Cottage here. After Masonry comes in, I think we should whip a Hammam for three-pop, shut of research, and come off the Gold in favor of cottages.

Tohoku:

The Horses will be hooked up T65. I think we should just let the Monument slow-complete off the hammers from the Horses.

Yellow River:

I'll send a Worker to chop that forest into a Monument. A second cottage is being built right now.

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