RB PBEM #1 - Discussion Thread - No Players!

[haphazard1]

This game has been very interesting to follow so far. It is good to see some different plans (and different skill levels), and how each player is adapting to what they find and their competitors' actions.

On an early rush, it is really worth going for? It may fail, leaving you in a very poor position. Even if it succeeds, you have likely seriously damaged your diplomatic position, and are behind in development and tech compared to your neighbors. You get more land, but also more maintenance costs and defense challenges with a distant city. Much of the land the eliminated civ would have expanded into will end up being settled by others, who become larger and more powerful then they otherwise would have been.

Maybe I am too timid, but unless your land is poor compared to your neighbors or you get a big prize (e.g. the target civ completes the Pyramids or a shrine before you take their capital), the risks outweigh the benfits.

[kalin]

I was wondering if some of the members of the community would comment on the relative positions in the game of the various players.

From my perspective it looks like Dreylin is in a pretty strong position right now: good land to expand into and relatively easy to defend, NAPs in the east. It looks like Ruff may have limited himself a bit with the settling deal. Sooooo has a nice solid plan to execute and he is also in a nice position. MH expanded and secured nicely his land, but is that enough? Athlete is a bit behind and his plan of going for culture doesn't seem to materialize, so he may have to go to war...

K

[sunrise089]

Soooo is still my favorite to win, and would be without even looking at the game threads.

I think Dreylin has pulled away from the pack into a clear second, Ruff is third, and M_H and Athlete are fighting for fourth. Other than Soooo's clear SE plan I think ability to arrange trades has been of primary importance so far. That may change once relative levels of success emerge and people try to exclude the dominant team. Remember how different the demogame diplomacy was when RB, Templars, and Imperio looked to be roughly equal in power.

[kalin]

Soooo is still my favorite to win, and would be without even looking at the game threads.

Is that based on your a priori knowledge of his skill? How does that fare in the light of ruff thinking about warring with him at some point...

K

[regoarrarr]

I see a ruff and dreylin war vs. soooo in the not too distant future

[Krill]

I think Dreylin is alot closer to first place than it appears. Ruff can't ally with sooooo to take out Dreylin without some very secure trust between the two, because the distribution of land would be hard. The western pair are in disarray and behind in worker actions (mh) and growth (Athlete). Dreylin only needs IW to get access to more good city sites though. I think if Dreylin can get another couple of trades set up, and get out his workers He'll be in the driving seat of the game, even if he is not strictly #1. I have to agree that a Ruff+Dreylin alliance against sooooo is pretty likely.

soooos' plan for the dedicated GE pump is pretty nice, but not optimal IMO. I wonder if he'll consider just shoving everything (HG, GL) into his capital along with the NE and settling all of the GS/GS he gets in his cap. As he is planning on settling them anyway, it doesn't matter where he gets them from or in what proportion. So I think his plan of separating hte wonders is a bad idea. Everything else seems solid though...

(just a FYI for those looking at soooos capital, it can work the sugar, rice and 1 irrigated grassland, and 4 specialists at size 7, for 76 gpp a turn if he shoves in the GL and HG. That's some serious gpp production)

[Swiss Pauli]

I'd agree that Dreylin is in a better position than sooooo because he has plenty of PBEM experience (look how well he handles the maladroit diplomacy from ruff), has played a strong opening, and isn't burdened by being the bookmaker's favourite, which will hinder sooooo considerably.

It'll be interesting to see how the Demogame players handle mh: by his own admission, he's not a particularly strong player, but the time & effort he put into running the C&D Dept over at Poly might make everyone but athlete 'misoverestimate' his turnplayer skills.

[Fenton Denton Smith]

I would agree that Dreylin has eeked out an advantage - especially since he will soon have IW for some more city sites.

Interestingly a war now for anyone would really throw the cat amongst the pigeons. No one is prepared and all pretty much have peaceful plans for the imediate future. I'd love to see a war soon but it's hard to say where it will be... Athlete may do it randomly!

I'd like to see sooooo get his Glib up and then start pumping troops. If he gets a really good commerce city up and running, it could support an early(ish) war. This is the strongest play I can see but it will take time to set up by which time longbows are likely to be aorund - especially if Athlete intends on researching Feud and trading it around.

I'm not sure who the best target to hit would be though...

[Krill]

I'm wondering how Dreylin is going to get some Great Priests for the double holy city. Do it the hard way and get a temple in his capital for hte first one, then run 3 preists through the shrine for hte second? Then what aboutthe academy...

Decisions decisions...

[shadyforce]

I have to say, I'm not a fan of the "is stealing techs harmful spying" question. And while I'm at it, I'm not a fan of earlier questions that related to when people expect wonders to get complete and what they should do if they don't get such wonders. Maybe I'm biased because I know that these questions implied things I know to be true from other threads (that Ruff is planning to steal techs and that there was a race for particular wonders) but I'm concerned players are going to draw the same conclusion.