One of your players in-game yesterday said "We have not seen the main German army yet." Which reminded me of this screenshot you sent earlier. I compared that pic with what we can see in and adjacent to Warendorf. For what it is worth, here is the comparison:
Somewhat similar in make-up. The five axes in bold in the earlier list are the ones clearly missing from the Warendorf area (or they may be hiding in one of the shaded tiles we cannot see). And of course, we can't track the un-named units. My sense is that they have NOT be re-naming units to try and hide anything.
They have been rushing a fair number of units, and I don't know how many you may have eliminated, but this comparison may help somewhat.
Congrats on your success last turn. Our team has been thinking that if you brought maces to the party, which you no doubt have, and the Germans have seen the inevitable conclusion to this war, they may prefer to throw their army against our dog soldiers rather than your maces. We will see as the war unfolds, but again, rest assured that we will not be shirking from combat.
Cheers!
Beta of WPC
I have finally decided to put down some cash and register a website. It is www.ruffhi.com. Now I remain free to move the hosting options without having to change the name of the site.
(October 22nd, 2014, 10:52)Caledorn Wrote: And ruff is officially banned from playing in my games as a reward for ruining my big surprise by posting silly and correct theories in the PB18 tech thread.
Rather than get chewed up outside of Warendorf in clear terrain, (or a move 4 which also left our stack exposed both this turn and next), we have opted to try andsplit the defence. Our main stack is moving north, and then west toward Wesselburn.
Our secondary stack will stay where it is (the desert tile just east of the cows), unless they move on it in force, in which case we will try and draw it into our territory. We have lots of reinforcements coming up, so we are not worried if they try a foray into our lands. In fact, it would problem shorten the war if they did.
At any rate, we have probably drawn most of their army north, so 'go to town' in the south.
If they move to defend Wesselburn, we will adavance on Warendorf. If they don't, we will take it and the other northern city while still working to pin down the bulk of their forces around Warendorf.
Your chariot can either move north with our stack, or back to the desert tile with our secondary stack. Your call, but I would prefer he move north. We have lots of reinforcements coming in from Great Plains, but the big stack will not be receiving any.
That's it from our end. Will end our turn in a few hours.
RB Wrote:Yep, I got the email, thanks. Sorry, I was very busy over the weekend, and we can't get into the game until it's our turn again, so I don't have much to add just yet... We'll have to see how their team responds - we'll let you know how things look.
Chat with CFC Wrote:scooter
Hey Yossarian, you around?
YossarianLives
Hey scooter, what's up?
scooter
hey. so I wanted to pass on a note from the team, and chat seemed easier than email
We'd like to firmly request that you stop pillaging tiles in neutral territory on our front with the Incan team
YossarianLives
Right, about that. I'm reminded of your answer when I asked you if your team would stop gifting a Ivory to the Spaniards
scooter
Meh, apples and oranges. This is pretty much NAP abuse and I think you know that
YossarianLives
The pillage gold is very important to our research plans right now. We can't really give it up
scooter
Anyway, we'd be willing to cancel our ivory trade if you would stop pillaging
YossarianLives
Well, I'll definitely take that back to the team. The Ivory has been a pain in the ass to deal with
But your timing isn't the greatest.
scooter
how so?
YossarianLives
Just that soon it might not be so crucial to us that the deal is cancelled. The damage is done at this point...
I'm sure you've noticed their massive whipping recently
I really don't mean to sound like a jerk here, but you're not leaving us a lot of options scooter
scooter
their whipping has been less than impressive, but yeah at least they've tried a little bit
YossarianLives
brb
scooter
Anyway, I'm being realistic here. I said firmly request, but I know reality is we can't really stop you from pillaging
I just want to communicate to you that refusing to stop is damaging and does anger team members, so if you want us to have any hope of a relationship going forward, I'd ask that you stop.
however if you're willing to burn bridges, then I can't do anything to stop that, and I recognize that. So that's your team's call.
YossarianLives
Alright, I appreciate you being straightforward with us here. I'll take this back to the team and see what I can come up with. I've said it before that I do think we can have future cooperation after T175.
I'm not going to lie, we knew that you'd notice the pillaging and you wouldn't be happy. But we also really did feel like your refusal to cancel the ivory trade was meant to signal that all bets are off, every team for themselves
scooter
We got the "all bets are off" feel from finding out that you were trying to rally certain teams against us. It seems we've been in a bit of a cold war for quite some time
YossarianLives
Well, ever since we asked for assistance after the Spaniards first DOW'ed us and you turned us away, it seems like things have been quieter between our two teams
But that doesn't mean things can't turn around
Did you ever get a chance to talk to CivFr about our war, btw?
scooter
We exchanged a message or two, but they haven't written us back in several days now. They're actually supplying the German team with ivory so you aren't the only ones dealing with surprise elephants :P
Anyway, they say you guys declared war in order to sabotage their great merchant mission which you had previously agreed to allow
seems like a pretty dirty trick if that's true. What happened from your perspective?
YossarianLives
Well, I did go back to the team to ask what I can divulge to you about the war. They said I've already said too much :/
scooter
heh, wow, tight-lipped. You hardly said anything, what could I possibly do with the little you told me? haha
YossarianLives
But obviously we disagree with what CivFr told you. We did not sabotage their GM mission, though we could have
scooter
If anything I probably said too much, even just now, but it still seems worthwhile to me
YossarianLives
Maybe you at least believe me now that we aren't secretly working together or anything like that
scooter
well I know the merchant did not die, but they said it came 1T away from completing the mission. you declared war, threatened it with units (did not kill), so they sprung a golden age to keep from wasting it
YossarianLives
No no, the merchant was never threatened.
scooter
I never really believed that it was a conspiracy even slightly, but I figured a little bit of probing on that would maybe get you to at least give me the real reason
so you deny placing multiple military units next to it after declaring war?
YossarianLives
I'm not the turnplayer so I'm not sure exactly what was around there, but let's say that we used non-combat escorts to show our peaceful intent
It's surprising how hard it can be to get a team to talk before playing out their turns, especially considering how slowly the turns are moving
scooter
haha, well I don't know that declaring war to prevent a trade mission is exactly "peaceful" but fair enough
YossarianLives
I'm glad we're in frequent communication, at least. To prevent any misunderstandings.
DOWs don't prevent the ability to perform the mission, iirc
I'm thinking about when Sullla used a merchant in PB2, although they might still have been at peace with their neighbor at that point. It was so long ago the details are a little hazy
scooter
yeah he did that when at peace, the thing there was borders were closed, but merchants can ignore those
anyway, so why did you deny them a trade mission you previously agreed to allow?
and yes, though sure our relations have been strained a bit by natural game causes, I am glad we've chatted frequently. It's been pretty helpful.
YossarianLives
Again, no intention to deny it. But like I said, the team has asked me to stay more tight-lipped about the way, and you are getting more info from me than they'd probably like, already
scooter
Hah, ok fair enough. It's just concerning to us that you would go back on a deal like that, seeing as we have deals with you and we've considered future deals with you
YossarianLives
Well, if we can clear things up and get into a more cooperative mindset with each other, we can probably start sharing more details about what is going on in the wider world.
But we absolutely will not break any deals that we have made. Our NAP is good, our Marble trade is good, everything else in our treaty will be honored
From here it briefly strayed into non-important personal chit-chat, which I'll include just as a demonstration of what I mean about trying not to burn bridges.
YossarianLives
And on a personal note, I really have enjoyed chatting with you. I do hope we can keep it up.
scooter
Fair enough on that, I had to ask. and agreed. Hopefully you've not taken any of my more "direct" comments personally. Just part of the game and the role on the team
YossarianLives
Oh absolutely. I've told the team several times that we're very fortunate to have you as diplomat. Based on what I've seen from your personality in other games we played, I know that you'd never lie, deceive, cheat, anything like that.
Kind of a Team Gillette spoiler from way back in the beginning of the game, I remember when the team suggested we tell Trolls that I had the highest post count on the team, just to throw them off, and you put your foot down and said "No, we're not lying to them"
That's why I was a little disappointed you're acting as ambassador to everyone. I was hoping some of the TEAM founders would be dealing with the other teams.
scooter
well thanks, I appreciate that. i've appreciated all interactions i've had with both you and caledorn. our teams don't always agree on stuff of course, but I enjoy our chats
haha, a couple of the TEAM founders have ideas of what we should say to teams, and they probably get tired of me overruling them
YossarianLives
YossarianLives
So, I noticed that both our wars were less eventful last turn with no cities captured for the first time since your war started. Things starting to slow down a little for you?
scooter
Well your chariot has a front-row seat so you should be able to see what's going on :P. But I wouldn't say slowing down, just a waiting turn. Fireworks should resume shortly
anyway, headed out to lunch now, so I need to step away
thanks for the chat
YossarianLives
Take care, and I'll get back to you about the pillaging thing
Chat with CFC/Yossarian Wrote:scooter
Hey, you around?
YossarianLives
Getting ready for work right now, so I can't chat much, but I'll try to respond
scooter
Ok, no problem
I wanted to see if you guys had any thoughts on the pillaging issue
also, we're thinking about sending a couple of our chariots over towards the Zulu to see if we can't fund our research a little bit
YossarianLives
Starting early with the threats today, I see
scooter
not a threat at all, just a statement of fact. we thought it sounded like a good idea
YossarianLives
Did our turn player write correctly that after I told you we needed the gold for our research, you went ahead and pillaged your own tiles to deny us?
That might be a more convenient way for you to get the gold you need,I guess
Anyways, I did bring it up to the team. We don't have a decision yet
scooter
Nope. We did that before I talked to you... and it was because it was on a tile we planned on farming, so the cottage wasn't useful to us
but there will be some cottages we would like to keep in future cities
YossarianLives
Not sure if this statement of fact will help or harm your cause, but I'll let them know you're plans there, too
Ok, I see...
scooter
I figure if pillaging in neutral tiles is fair game under our NAP agreement, we would be remiss not to get in on the action
YossarianLives
I haven't brought this up top the team yet, but we will have a source of dyes soon, and we have that agreement to give each other first dibs on resources. Maybe we can work out a gpt trade that will be in everyone's favor
If you really actually need that happy...
scooter
well we are getting dye in exchange for the ivory, but of course we are willing to drop that trade as I said yesterday
and yes, happy is nice when you're drafting and likely about to experience war weariness
hate that mechanic
also, I understand it takes time to decide, I think we were just hoping before this turn is played to know where you stand on the pillaging thing. I don't know how realistic that is?
YossarianLives
Ok, I'll double check
Not sure I can get you the answer before the turn ends, though. There's a lot of different opinions when it comes to our diplo with your team
scooter
heh, that I can understand. Well let me know either way, and thanks
So we're a bit concerned about the state of things. The German team teched Feudalism, and we will both be facing double promo longbows if progress is not made quickly. We'll be taking a 3rd city this turn, and likely a 4th next turn, but things will bog down as they whip out a bunch of longbows from their core cities. Right now you guys are headed up to Wesselburen, but capturing that will not be very beneficial for you if it's choked with culture from their surrounding cities, and I don't know how you could capture those other cities if you're facing a bunch of whipped longbows.
We can capture the cities in our section, though it will be pretty bloody, but if you guys want to make any progress it's pretty important that we both keep up the pressure on them and that their core cities start falling quickly. I'd really suggest you guys turn around and take a shot at Warendorf instead. Many of their units are going to turn around and fight us anyway since you can't hit the city for a few more turns, so things should be softened by the time you get there. The longer you wait, the more longbows will be present, and that will make it impossible for you guys to make any gains. The tundra cities will still be there for the taking when the core cities fall.
RB Wrote:Hey guys, looks like your game is over, sorry to see you go. We've enjoyed playing with you.
We saw you offered us the rest of your gold, and while we appreciate the gesture of friendship, we don't want to set a precedent where a dying civ gifts all their assets to their favorite rival, so we declined the offer.
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