[SPOILERS] Team EggHeads: DMOC and TeddyKGB (Now Lurker-Friendly!)

[DMOC]

Turn 154 - 880 AD

Looks like I finally found some time to play after all.

I launched a golden age and converted to Vassalage. I did six whips, so we'll be getting six cataphracts next turn, and I've got around six more planned for the turn after that. Hopefully with around 5 cataphracts a turn, we'll get a sizable force by turn 160. After Guilds, I'm thinking of Alphabet -> Engineering, and I really want some spies in Bison's land so that I can get visibility on him.

Also, you'll notice Bisons won the liberalism race and took Printing Press. Why SutOxy didn't take the free tech, I have no idea. Bisons can also research gunpowder. I worry that we'll see a ton of muskets and pikes soon. (I've been stalling him for a while, hoping he doesn't tech Engineering.)

With the Golden Age, our demographics look very good. We are tops in production, and this screenshot was taken after my whips.

But Bisons land is so good. I mean, with Colossus, Golden Age, + Financial, that's almost unfair. Honestly, this game makes me realize that Financial is by far the best trait in the game.

We'll get another Great Person by the time the Golden Age ends.

The Heroic Epic city is going to build a stable, and then hopefully 1-turn as many cataphracts as possible. I've got two workers on that island tile building a workshop.

We've also got eight catapults that we'll use. Bisons has two cities that we can attack on the first turn of the war, but I'm debating on splitting the catapult stack into two so that we have four to help out for each. Any thoughts? With engineering, we can probably get one trebuchet for each stack, so long as we whip in the cities closest to the border.

Here's the southern border, with military units highlighted:

Note that Bisons said by email that he generates 25% more gold than suttre at 0% research. Well, that would be impressive, if SutOxy weren't already whipping so much. Anyway, we'll see what he does. I suspect he researches Engineering (which should take about two turns for him) followed by Gunpoweder.

[NobleHelium]

I think you misunderstood what I wrote, or maybe I wasn't clear. I am asking why Bisons thinks that it is better not to have size 16/17 cities right now and have them spread over size 12-15 cities, and I suspect that better players would understand the reasoning behind Bison's claims (because I legitimiately think that it's good to have higher population cities). I already have size 12 ciities, as you can see. I am not asking why Bisons is criticizing me --- I'm asking about the reasoning behind his claims.

I'll make some detailed comments on this question when the game draws closer to conclusion.

[DMOC]

Okay, sounds good NH. I will fully admit that the biggest mistake we made was signing that stupid defensive pact against Rome, which put us behind the tech leaders the whole game, but there are certainly other things we could have done better. Or maybe we should have just picked a Financial leader.

[DMOC]

Turn 155 - 900 AD

So apparently things didn't go as planned. When whipping HA to completion, you need enough to get the 90 hammers for cataphracts anyway, so we only got one this turn. (But finally! Turn 155 and one cataphract!) We will get ten next turn. They could also be used for a war against Arkipeller or Barteq.

Right now we'll research Alphabet (to get spies!) followed by Engineering for movement, pikemen, and trebuchets. After that, I am planning on shutting down research, aside from a detour to Drama to get the Byzantine hippodrome. Cataphracts are almost as good as cuirassiers and it doesn't make sense for us to try and continue teching when the empire is in full-fledged war mode. The genera plan is that we whip cataphracts, plus a few maces, in our large cities. In the smaller cities by our border, we can build spies and perhaps catapults.

As planned, the Heroic Epic can one-turn seven-XP cataphracts. The fact that it's close to both of our borders (Bisons and Arkipeller) but also quite defensible is a plus. I am only worried about this city being navally assaulted, but only SutOxy can do stuff like that.

Suttree and I also seem to be following similar strategies of having two high-population cities: the capital and a Heroic Epic city, and whipping everything else. Unfortunately, I think our Heroic Epic city is worse than theirs.

Our iron could be vulnerable to a spy pillage, so I'll keep four workers near the area so they can one-turn it and mine for precautionary purposes.

As far as real wars go, DT is clearly on their way out of the game, as B4ndit has joined in the war. I wonder if Barteq is talking with them. But B4ndit at 0% research (he's taking 33 turns to research Meditation) only generates 74 gold. We can generate three times that much with enough wealth. Yossarian told me in email that suttree said B4ndit still thinks he can win the game. Uh ... what?

Here is the technology screen. (Bisons can also research Gunpowder.)

Tech and gold changes from previous turn:

Bisons: no techs researched, but gold is up to 324 from 241 last turn. I fear he will get Engineering next turn.
SutOxy:
B4ndit:

Demographics after whipping. I'll take a good note at our power next turn, when it shoudl take a huge jump. No huge spikes from Bisons yet. I'm sure he's building maces and spears in most of his cities.

Side note: espionage levels. I've got 250 points on Bisons, but he's got 326 points on me, so I think he's been pumping them up, perhaps working spy specialists or even increasing the slider, because I rememer before that we had more points on him.

Side note II: we founded our seventeenth city down south, and that will be it for city expansion. If Harvard can make even one extra cataphract, I'll consider it a net plus. We have three workers down near the area.

[DMOC]

Just a quick update --- been super busy as usual, and I've got to give an important talk in a few hours, so no updates until much later. I've stored screenshots of every turn. They will be up soon.

It was somewhat amusing to receive B4ndit's latest message. He said Bisons is #1 in power, when the power graph (at the time he sent the message, and up to now) clearly shows SutOxy at #1 (will be attacking Arki next turn, t159, judging by Arki's whips) and me a clear #2. Also, I have no idea why B4ndit and Bisons think I can defeat Bisons quickly. Only the most naive of Civ players could think that.

Finally, can someone explain why Bisons said he has played pitboss games on emperor and immortal (see tech thread for relevant details)? I thought higher difficulty levels just mean increased tech costs (and not a harder game, strictly). In fact, going by that logic, the game goes by slightly quicker on Monarch than on Emperor/Immortal due to cheaper tech costs, so games may end 5-10 turns earlier.

[NobleHelium]

I laughed at Bisons's post for a reason.

[Dhalphir]

DMOC, if you are struggling with being super busy, I can take over as turnplayer for you. I remain unspoiled except for one post in the lurker thread in which I posted an opinion on something I read in your thread - I've read nobody else's threads and not read the lurker thread.

[DMOC]

Yeah, that'd be great if you could help me out for the rest of the game. I've got some ideas and let me tell you them once I get a chance to look at the game again.

[Dhalphir]

Still waiting for Bisons to play his turn.

[B4ndit]

But B4ndit at 0% research (he's taking 33 turns to research Meditation) only generates 74 gold. We can generate three times that much with enough wealth. Yossarian told me in email that suttree said B4ndit still thinks he can win the game. Uh ... what?

I guess you must have missed espionage graph. Didn't 0% research and astonishing 74 gpt make you suspicious? You had me on graphs so you could easily check that my GNP was not lower then yours...

Btw, I still regret that we couldn't talk you out of attacking Bisons. I didn't have time to read your thread more then 2-3 pages back, but I can not understand your strategy and your decisions. Why did you turn down on DT and signing a NAP with GG? Why did you (as clear #2 power. At least until t150 it was pretty clear, now I would argue with that ) make 3rd player as a target? Something like 10 turns ago I was making exactly opposite decision. Was it because you have given up on this game?