[SPOILERS] Pindicator plays PBEM62 (not to be confused with Twitch Plays Civ)

[spacetyrantxenu]

You know what, the toroid comment was my mistake. It was pb18 that was requested to be a toroid and Commodore ignored the request.

Ha, I can see that and agree with it although I didn't really care too much about the details during the setup phase myself. I think with PB18 I was more or less ambivalent about settings because the game was never going to be "fair" or "balanced" in any meaningful way that could be controlled, given the wide, wide disparity of player skill levels of the game's participants. In PB18 I think it was only a matter of time until the best players separated themselves from the rest. Without spoilers I think that's more or less what has happened. Well, except for BGN obviously, because he sucks.

[Krill]

Xenu, please understand that all map makers make mistakes however there is a difference between a miss click on placing a resource and metadesign of the map. i think any map like this one that completely screwed over a single player is unacceptable and there was no excuse for doing that i disagree that a random map would have been as bad as this because then whilst someone may not have been able to play a perfect start because they were they had a bad position i don't believe that most maps good maps gets completely destroy a player's chance on turn zero. this map did i cannot in good faith say that the map design was either good or acceptable.

what i can say is that we need to change map design philosophy on realms beyond. i think it would be better for us to start using map script that are easily adjusted in a short space of time rather than these cute handcrafted maps take forever and a day. automation would be a good start namely rendering an awful lot of maps to find a good base map scripti have done this using the tourist world map script and it's not time consuming to sit there hitting regenerate after using good predefined by myself settings. the pit boss 20 map took about 8 hours to complete of which fools regeneration work during which i did all the stuff including watching sport. admittedly out of the next 4 hours i used novices map an awful lot in reality that was a bad idea because that rule is no match for at an experienced players eye on determining map balance.

the next bus game that is why you should the map generation process streamed online if this is done by a good map designer then they can explain the process and hopefully a lot of people can improve the skills not just in map design also in what makes a map more pliable and helps improve balance not all games are perfectly balanced some apps have quite an imbalance in the play available for each start but they are still interesting and funeven if they are harder to win from

[Bobchillingworth]

You know, I've never seen Mackoti and Krill photographed together before...

[Krill]

I have no internet. That is all from voice recognition software on my phone. You can fuck off if you think I'm editing every sodding word from a post that long.

[SevenSpirits]

I don't know how you could confuse that with mackoti, whose posts are as far removed from phone autocorrect as possible.

[The Black Sword]

Krill's post is unusually difficult to read, so I'm not sure how serious I should take it but ...

i think any map like this one that completely screwed over a single player is unacceptable and there was no excuse for doing that i disagree that a random map would have been as bad as this

This map, along with most others I assume, started out as a random map. You don't really believe the map makers make them worse do you?

I am also not convinced that this map or PB19 for that matter, completely screwed over Pindicator. I probably shouldn't talk about this map while the game is still ongoing. PB19 was a terrible confluence of events; a weak civ led to a late BW, didn't meet the neighbour until he settled directly on the borders, didn't realise that civ was the zulu for a few turns too. I think the placement of Pin in the middle could of worked and it was a good idea by Xenu. The way the land was shaped that civ pretty much had 3 borders, the same as everyone else, except 1 of them was by sea.

[pindicator]

I am very interested in hearing how you would have played this and pb19

[Krill]

This map didn't screw over pin. What did is a separate issue of leader picking but that's a bit more of a complex issue to discuss after the game for specifics.

Pb19 well. Perhaps its best said that you don't let Joao get Henge and a holy city. But Pin...early copper but that map put copper in an awkward position that if you went AH first was hard to settle without screwing long term power.

[Krill]

This map, along with most others I assume, started out as a random map. You don't really believe the map makers make them worse do you?

Intend to? No. Doesn't mean that isn't the end result of the meddling/alterations.

[Bobchillingworth]

I have no internet. That is all from voice recognition software on my phone. You can fuck off if you think I'm editing every sodding word from a post that long.

I actually assumed you were drunk