[Spoilers] PBEM3 Map Planning

[darrelljs]

Okay, I improved Biz quite a bit and the others to varying degrees, filled in the missing strategic resources, and added the inland sea. Attached .zip contains a worldbuilder both with and without the inland sea, in case we decide its a bad idea.

Darrell

[darrelljs]

To me Bismark's land is comically bad. The difference between the first two screenshots (all tundra + plains vs gold+pigs+corn+corn...) is striking.

Yeah, its true. I mocked up what I consider 5 good city sites and really boosted his capital. It still looks the worst from a sky view, but I think if you evaluate it based on city sites it might not be that bad. I'm open to more edits of course .

Darrell

[regoarrarr]

IMO the island city should either be accessible from all directions by coast or none. Currently only from the north, though maybe that's an added "bonus" for Bismark?

[Kyan]

I agree with Rego about the island.

Augustus land looks like there's a magnet in the SW corner pulling all resources that way. The east side of his land isn't too nifty. He could also do with another happy resource.

Bismarck's a lot better but i still think tehre should be a bit more grassland. You're right that there is still potential for good city sites. But that's based off knowledge of the entire area. Players will miss things and won't place absolutely perfect dotmaps. Biz' problem will be that if he messes the dotmap up a tiny bit, he is stuck with just mediocre cities at best. There are no options for him. It's a case of put a city here here and here. No tough choices to make which can define a player.

Zara is a good contrast to that as his land is very nice. Technically he is lacking 1 happy resource also but his land is already awesome so take that with a pinch of salt.

[darrelljs]

Okay, Krill IM'd me some similar comments as well. I'll green up Bismarck some more, and take a second look at Rome. I believe the island is currently unreachable (or even visible) until Optics, and unsettleable until Astronomy.

Darrell

[Krill]

With this being a normal speed, NTT game, but with generally bad teching land (ie not every city is going to be working 15 cottages), perhaps it would be nice to make sure every civ has something like a grassland gems in the capital?

EDIT: chat comments posted here for everyone else to comment on. Don't want to do anything behind the scenes here...and yes, I was using the PBEM2 gchat login, but there aren't any spoilers there.

(8:59:37 PM) de krill of Fronce: bismarks land still needs improving
(9:00:18 PM) de krill of Fronce: basically, he can't cottage anything
(9:00:27 PM) de krill of Fronce: except his capital
(9:01:08 PM) de krill of Fronce: Zara has awesome land
(9:29:08 PM) Darrell: okay, so nerf zara and boost biz
(9:29:48 PM) de krill of Fronce: Quick tip on how I balance maps. Might not be for you, or you might already do it:
(9:30:02 PM) de krill of Fronce: Figure out how they are going to research.
(9:30:13 PM) de krill of Fronce: and think how each start gets played out
(9:30:26 PM) de krill of Fronce: likely second and third cities, and what the cottage numbers are like
(9:30:33 PM) Darrell: I basically just looked at first 5 city sites and made sure everyone had them
(9:30:41 PM) Darrell: not reserach though, more resources and food
(9:30:57 PM) de krill of Fronce: That's the other critical thing
(9:31:06 PM) de krill of Fronce: Bismarks is OK. little worse, but ok
(9:31:23 PM) de krill of Fronce: but come ren era
(9:31:30 PM) de krill of Fronce: will get blown out of hte water
(9:31:52 PM) Darrell: so if I green about 3-4 more city spots?
(9:32:02 PM) de krill of Fronce: probably fine then
(9:32:09 PM) Darrell: maybe some rivers too
(9:32:10 PM) Darrell: he has none
(9:32:23 PM) de krill of Fronce: basically, if you do what Sullla does, and make sure everyone has x city cites with a food res that makes y fpt...
(9:32:31 PM) de krill of Fronce: then it is a playable map
(9:32:37 PM) de krill of Fronce: but no strategy in it
(9:32:45 PM) de krill of Fronce: (on that note...)
(9:32:52 PM) de krill of Fronce: rerandomize where everyone starts
(9:32:56 PM) de krill of Fronce: after the map is finished
(9:33:14 PM) Darrell: err...there is an option for that when creating the game I assume?
(9:33:24 PM) de krill of Fronce: nah
(9:33:46 PM) de krill of Fronce: do it by online rng
(9:33:50 PM) de krill of Fronce: just design a quick method
(9:33:56 PM) de krill of Fronce: or let someone else do it
(9:33:59 PM) de krill of Fronce: only takes 5 minutes
(9:34:06 PM) de krill of Fronce: then have to edit the worldbuilderfile
(9:34:08 PM) Darrell: oh and the worldbuild
(9:34:09 PM) Darrell: yeah
(9:34:25 PM) Darrell: change chagne the coords in the text editor, or manually do it in worldbuilder
(9:34:43 PM) de krill of Fronce: and don;t forget to change the FoW
(9:34:58 PM) Darrell: what does "shuffle teams" do
(9:35:01 PM) Darrell: when setting up a PBEM
(9:35:04 PM) de krill of Fronce: ah
(9:35:11 PM) de krill of Fronce: lets say 2 players are in a team
(9:35:14 PM) de krill of Fronce: so, 2 teams of 3
(9:35:20 PM) de krill of Fronce: or 3 teams of 2, whatever
(9:35:29 PM) de krill of Fronce: it randomizes who is on which team
(9:35:32 PM) Darrell: got it

Bismarck's a lot better but i still think tehre should be a bit more grassland. You're right that there is still potential for good city sites. But that's based off knowledge of the entire area. Players will miss things and won't place absolutely perfect dotmaps. Biz' problem will be that if he messes the dotmap up a tiny bit, he is stuck with just mediocre cities at best. There are no options for him. It's a case of put a city here here and here. No tough choices to make which can define a player.

Generally need a very high, or very low food map to do that. Not sure if that is the aim in this game?

[darrelljs]

Final version. I also have the game ready to go. Admin password in case I forget is darre11. Initial save password is gatech. You players better not be looking here !

DArrell

[darrelljs]

My biggest fear with this map is I missed something. My second biggest fear is that I buffed the starts so much, that it isn't as much of a highlands experience as they were looking for. It was just one of those things where after improving someone's start, someone else had the short end of the straw. Hopefully they get a good game out of it .

Darrell

[Jabah]

I don't know if this is too late or not.
Better be sure than any start could see enough of his food bonus otherwise, you will have people moving out of the initial position and possible settling a worst position (as at least one did in RB3 - not being specific because of spoiler) just because moving from 0 (visible) food to 1 visible food will be consider good enough (especially in highland 'map')

I was thinking of Hatty and Sury, at least from the last ss picture (at work, can't check the final WB)

[darrelljs]

I don't know if this is too late or not.
Better be sure than any start could see enough of his food bonus otherwise, you will have people moving out of the initial position and possible settling a worst position (as at least one did in RB3 - not being specific because of spoiler) just because moving from 0 (visible) food to 1 visible food will be consider good enough (especially in highland 'map')

I was thinking of Hatty and Sury, at least from the last ss picture (at work, can't check the final WB)

Excellent point, when I playtested all the starts I noticed the problem with Hatty and I moved the scouting unit. Sury, I did not check .

Darrell