I mean other than wanting it to be over, Pacal may very well help you and declare against him, plus don't you just want to do damage to Coco for his earlier transgressions? Why go after Pacal other than a very tempting border city.
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(Spoilers) Churchill's Old General Death
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(August 23rd, 2020, 22:15)Mjmd Wrote: I mean other than wanting it to be over, Pacal may very well help you and declare against him, plus don't you just want to do damage to Coco for his earlier transgressions? Why go after Pacal other than a very tempting border city. Pacal peaced out with Coco after signalling to me with copper/copper and Horse/horse and we would have had a 3v1 vs coco. Then Pacal peaced and swapped to hitting the northern neighbor and Coco is free to march his 3-4x bigger stack into my territory. Cant really damage Coco at this point. And with 6-7t left in his peace deal with Pacal, its likely he will conquer most of my lands before Pacal could even get there. :/
"Superdeath seems to have acquired a rep for aggression somehow.
![[Image: noidea.gif]](https://www.realmsbeyond.net/forums/images/smilies/noidea.gif) In this game that's going to help us because he's going to go to the negotiating table with twitchy eyes and slightly too wide a grin and terrify the neighbors into favorable border agreements, one-sided tech deals and staggered NAPs."-Old Harry. PB48.
Is there any way of sneaking your 2-movers into Coco's backlines? Perhaps using OBS with Maya?
Completed: RB Demogame - Gillette, PBEM46, Pitboss 13, Pitboss 18, Pitboss 30, Pitboss 31, Pitboss 38, Pitboss 42, Pitboss 46, Pitboss 52 (Pindicator's game), Pitboss 57
In progress: Rimworld
Make them hurt
Mods: RtR CtH
Pitboss: PB39, PB40, PB52, PB59 Useful Collections: Pickmethods, Mapmaking, Curious Civplayer Buy me a coffee (August 23rd, 2020, 22:28)superdeath Wrote: Pacal peaced out with Coco after signalling to me with copper/copper and Horse/horse and we would have had a 3v1 vs coco. Then Pacal peaced and swapped to hitting the northern neighbor and Coco is free to march his 3-4x bigger stack into my territory. Just out of curiosity: what exactly did you think him to be signalling to you by accepting these deals you proposed? It was stated above already that we at Civforum do not "read" resource deals the same way you guys do. Why did you assume that he can "read" this deal exactly the way you mean it? BTW: I am the guy who stepped in for Mr.X /Celts from Turn 112-117. I had clear instructions on what to do in each of his cities. I doubt that what I did there was much different from what he would have done had he played these turns himself (maybe some different micro management in the cities). In Civforum it is quite normal to look for replacement players well ahead of one's vacation. Mr. X contacted me about it some 4 weeks before he ultimately went on vacation. So I stopped reading all stories in "his" neighborhood (this one as well) right the moment that was decided and also stopped reading all stories elsewhere in the world during the time I stood in for him.
One more question: who was supposed to be the third party in that 3v1 against Coco? Mr. X / Celts by any chance? What contribution could he make having barely a handful of cities? Why would he try to go for all out war?
Please don't get this wrong, but you seem to make quite a few assumptions about what other should / have to do that seem to be based solely on how you see their situations. You do not seem to be looking at things from the other player's perspectives. As you may have noticed, many wars tend to be rather short (and there is a reason for that in pretty much all of the cases, but I cannot go into details of course) and it seems other players do not hold grudges the way you do. I mean wouldn't you choke a neighbor if you had the chance? What would you hope to gain by passing up such an opportunity? So why are you mad at him for doing something to you that you very well might have done to him had roles / positions been reversed? I do not mean to provoke you here, I am really just trying to understand the "why"... Having said that, I DO understand your frustration, of course. You drew a lousy leader. You started in a part of the world that makes it difficult to get those lucrative trade routes other players have (which in turn is a must-have with these settings). And you were not fortunate enough to start next to a player or two who don't know how the game is played, giving you easy expansion opportunities. I get all that. That's totally understandable. (August 24th, 2020, 04:32)Papa Bear Wrote: As you may have noticed, many wars tend to be rather short (and there is a reason for that in pretty much all of the cases, but I cannot go into details of course) and it seems other players do not hold grudges the way you do. Ahem PB52 ahem. It's clear that both forums have a different culture about playing the game. Also there are always two people who have to sign peace. If the loosing side is going to die anyway or has no way of coming back. Why should they sign peace and relieve the aggressor from all the accumulated war weariness?
Mods: RtR CtH
Pitboss: PB39, PB40, PB52, PB59 Useful Collections: Pickmethods, Mapmaking, Curious Civplayer Buy me a coffee (August 24th, 2020, 13:56)Charriu Wrote:(August 24th, 2020, 04:32)Papa Bear Wrote: As you may have noticed, many wars tend to be rather short (and there is a reason for that in pretty much all of the cases, but I cannot go into details of course) and it seems other players do not hold grudges the way you do. Yeah. To add onto this, if you want to fight a limited war, you need to leave the person an out. Superdeath on this map and position clearly has no out, so his neighbors ought to be aware of that and know that any sort of conflict will feel existential to him. For example, imagine he's not located in southern Argentina, but instead has several other neighbors. Maybe one of those neighbors are even weaker than he is. Then he might be inclined to sign peace or get over a slight setback because the reward elsewhere for doing so is pretty good. But because every negative blow makes his game feel more and more worthless due to his geography, he's going to be more and more inclined to play for revenge or some other personal win condition that maybe inconveniences a neighbor. I think that's pretty reasonable. Also, you're playing with humans, and some humans are more wired towards revenge, and I think I've seen enough Superdeath games to know he is one of those players. Reading your opponents and figuring out how to deal with them is a skill. What I don't think is reasonable is expecting him to behave like an AI who will happily sign peace and then sit there with 4 cities for ages and wait for whenever it's convenient for you to finish them off. If you expect that from players in a game like this, I think having players who feel "done" just retire to AI is your best bet. |
