[SPOILERS] Caught in tides of war... yuris125 and Krill - PBEM56

[yuris125]

First post






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[yuris125]

This is the start Brick sent us while I was away

[Krill]

Starting tech costs
Agri, Hunting: 38 beakers
Fishing, Mining: 47 beakers
Wheel, Myst: 56 beakers

[Krill]

My suggestion is to pick Charlemagne (or whomever is IMP/PRO) of Egypt, move the warrior that should be a scout 9 to check the tiles 8, 9, 96, and 966 of the plains hill forest and then move the settler to the plains hill forest, regardless of what you see. Search for a decent capital location to the NW, plant, AH first and go WC rush someone.

And surprise, surprise, I don't like this start. There aren't any good options for wheree to settle because there is no way to get the settler to the south of the lake because of thee forests and on quick speed can't afford to lose too many turns (ie more than 1). The problem with settling in place is that a freshwater crabs is not a tile that is economical to hook up, whatever traits you have, because you can't afford the 20 hammers. But you can't settle north without giving up both food resources. So IMO the best option is to actually wander into the fog of war and hoipe there is something decent, because the lesson I learnt from PBEM50 is that double land food is better than split land and seafood bcause you can go double workers and then just get ahead in tile improvements too quickly.

[yuris125]

Interesting. I was not thrilled with the start as well, there is no obviously good place to settle.. was thinking more in direction of picking a civ with Fishing/Mining, researching Agri and BW (Agri being so cheap now), chopping a Workboat, and taking it from there

But I do like the Imp/Pro idea. From the pre-game discussion, it looks like most people are valuing Agr as the best trait.. and I was wondering how good it actually is. Sure, it makes wet corn a 7-food tile, which is amazing... but it only gives the bonus on food resources. And on flood plains. Would it be overpowered in an area with lots of flood plains?

Anyway, I don't think Agr is great for this start. And having an Imp/Pro leader, who would be similar to BtS Joao with extra bonuses, is an idea I like at lot

Moving NW feels like a huge gamble though. If there is not food resources up there, the only way to settle would be to go back to the starting spot. Do you think it's worth the risk? I agree that 2 land-based food resources would be much better, but what are the chances of actually seeing them? Considering a move to the north means giving up both resources at the starting spot

[Krill]

I would not move back if there was no food. I'd just keep moving north and west. I don't think it is possible to keep up with the expansion of the other players so don't try to. Play a different game and go rush someone. I do think double land fod is reasonably common on this map script.

[yuris125]

If the goal is not fast expansion, why take Imp? Getting a faster Settler for the horse city? Does't look like any other Imp bonus does anything to help an early rush. I feel like Org or Cre would both be better than Imp - am I missing something?

[Krill]

Because if you settle to the north west you'd be closer to a rush target and IMP would enable you to get a settler out for horses quickly. Aim would be something like worker>grow to 2>settler>get horses>build 2 chariots>rush someone.

[Krill]

Have you ever heard the saying "The only way to win is to not play"? Because that applies to this start. Can't win the game in a conventional manner with this start.

[Krill]

Another option, which is frankly insane but might work is to pick EXP/Inca, settle in place and go Terrace>work boat, research Fishing>Mining>BW and just grow vertically to size 4 and then stack whip unhappiness once you get to BW. But TBH I think that sucks because you'd be so far behind on worker improvements it isn't worthwhile. I just might be wrong.

Another choice is to pick something like Byz for maximum starting beakers and go Fishing>Agri at the start and work boat first (micro for work boat first is as follows):

T0, T1 work grass forest hill
T2 work silk
T3, T4, T5 work plains forest hill
T6-T12 work improved crab, build worker (2 hammers overflow)
T13, T14 build warrior, grow to 2 eot T14, worker moves to corn, irrigate, fin T17.

You're down in warriors to everyone else, and at absolute best equal in tile improvements IMO.

There is no reason to pick PRO because there are no available hammers to trigger to bonus (workboat is basically 1 turn sooner with PRO...and then it doesn't trigger on the worker unless you grow to 2 first, wb eot T4, grow eot T6, worker eot T11 with 2 hammers overflow). It's a complete waste on a work boat first start.