[SPOILERS - PBEM17] regoarrarr - Bismarck of Inca

[regoarrarr]

Okay so I'm going to change Shoot from Fishing / Pottery / Mysticism to Pottery / Mysticism / Meditation, and change krilljs from Mysticism / Meditation / unknown to Fishing / Mysticism / Polytheism.

So I think this means that the Oracle race is BACK ON!

To me, Shoot as Fin/Exp is probably going for Stonehenge. He knows he's only got krilljs to contend with for that as we've got Terraces and the other 2 civs are Creative.

So he knows he's going to get a Prophet so wants a religion for it - makes sense.

In fact, krilljs ergo sum might be going for Henge over Oracle for the same reason, though I bet they're going for an Oracle run.

Had I thought about it, it may have made sense to go for Meditation rather than Polytheism, as that 1t might make a difference.

Ah well, I can't take it back now.

WAIT! Maybe I can claim I played in a drunken stupor and send a different save?

[regoarrarr]

Okay I think I can get a T40 Oracle (EOT39). Having it Shoot that did Meditation (first) and krill ergo sum that teched Polytheism (second) is actually quite a benefit to me, as I'm ahead of Shoot in the turn order.

So first, let's make sure I can get Priesthood by T39.

After ending turn, I'm currently at 37/95 on Polytheism, and have 3 gold in the bank. Priesthood is 56 beakers, so that's a total of 114 beakers

At 100% science, I make 32bpt and -6gpt. So that's 26 gpt at max cash. 32*3 is 96, which multiplied by 1.2 is 115, so a turn of saving gold and 3 turns of max science seem like they'll do the trick. I'll need to be careful about whipping and such, and double check the numbers, but it seems to work. Plus I've got some leeway since that will leave me with 11g in the bank, so I don't even need to go all the way down to 0% on my cash-raising turn.

[regoarrarr]

Obviously I'm breaking this up over multiple posts because have you SEEN the post-count hole I'm in?

In any case, we're assuming Priesthood on T39, which means I need to have all my workers finish their chops on that turn (or potentially the turn before, depending on what I'm overflowing off of).

So that means any worker that is chopping needs to be moving into a forest T36 (next turn! ), with some wiggle room for my one roaded forest. Hmm that actually could present a problem.

I have one worker in a roaded plains forest. My other 3 workers are all up at Mardoc on the (non-roaded ) gems.

I can definitely get 2 forests chopped by T39, and 4 seems out of the question. 3 might be doable, so let's explore the ramifications of that, which we already did earlier to some degree.

[regoarrarr]

Another post, people, another post!

The good news about all these posts is if it were anyone else making tons of posts, other players in the game might think something was going on (which it, of course, is). But luckily my reputation precedes me so I don't have that problem

So as we discussed earlier, Oracle for Ind folks like myself is 67 hammers. Forests are 13 hammers each on quick (pre-Math).

2 forests
26 hammers from forests
9 hammers from T39 (We'll be at size 5 by then - center(2) + cows (2) + wheat (1) + 3 forests (4) - so not working the "wimpy" 6/0/1 corn)
32 hammers needed from overflow

3 forests
39 hammers from forests
8 hammers from T39 (we'll only have 2 forests left)
20 hammers needed from overflow

Okay so what can we overflow from and how much can we get?

As of T36 (EOT35), plako was at 7/18 in food, and 22/40 in a Terrace. Makes 10/7 working a plains forest or 11/6 working a grass forest (or 11/5 if we work a grassland river depending on if we need to sandbag the terrace for whipping porpoises). So one option is T37 let's say 32/40 (5h doubled) and T38 work a grass instead of a cow making it T39 38/40 - whip it (5 to 4) and the 4 pop are on the cows, wheat, and 2 forests (8h), making it 86/40, or 23 hammers overflow.

Not bad, but what about a worker? I think that actually might be the best option, since you can only really get about 19-20h overflow from the whip itself - the big deal is the hammers you put in on the turn itself. And so it's a bonus to be able to put all that food into the Oracle (even at only 1:1). So I can put in hammers to the Oracle on T38 (and food!), even though I don't actually have Priesthood until T39!

One trick is going to make sure I can put in a small enough amount of hammers to still be able to double whip the worker. With a 11fpt surplus, this is trickier than you might think! I'll also explore maxing out the worker to just single pop whip it

So if I work one of the 2 food tiles on T36, I get exactly enough food to grow to size 5 on T37, where I can swap to the worker. Working corn, cows, wheat, grass forest and plains forest, that's 10fpt and 8hpt, or 20fh/t (8*1.25 for Exp workers), so I'll be at 20/40 on T38, which is the turn I need to whip . No good - that's too many hammers to double whip and I need one more turn to get in enough hammers to get a good single whip.

Here's where the math gets tricky - For Expansive workers on Normal, it's 22/60 as the magic number, since a whip gives 37 hammers. On quick, a Expansive worker whip should give 25 hammers, which makes 14/40 the sweet spot. So I'm sure that I can arrange tiles to get 14/40 (maybe work 2 forests instead of the cows and wheat or something). Hurts to not work those good tiles but I guarantee no amount of worker micro or optimal tile selection can top a free 430 beaker tech!!

So T38, I'm at 14/40 in a worker, and I double whip it to 64/40 (going from size 5 to 3). Work the corn, cows and wheat, which gives 11 food and 5 hammers (6 with bonus). So overflow is 81/40, or 41 hammers overflow which gets divided back out to 32 hammers overflow.

Uh-oh that's exactly the amount I need for a 2 forest Oracle!! . The problem with that is I assumed that we'd get 9 hammers from working on T39, but at size 3 we can only get 7, even not working the corn.

So let's see if we can get 3 forests chopped, and if not, revisit this plan to see if we can squeeze out 2 more hammers.

[regoarrarr]

Alrighty then, as I mentioned, one of my workers is on the roaded plains forest, and the other 3 are on the un-roaded gems at Mardoc. Here's a picture that I posted, oh, like 3 hours ago but is already (at least for me) on the last page



Remember - in order to finish chopping on T39, a lone worker needs to move into a forest NEXT TURN (T36).

So plains forest worker can of course make it to a forest, and for more options, should move into a non-roaded forest. Let's put him 1S next turn.

If I road the tile 1SE of the gems (1E of Mardoc) with 2 of the workers on the gems, the third worker on the tile can move SE-S-SE-SW (or in Krill-speak, 3231 , and get into the forest NW (7!) of Plako.

So that leaves one forest remaining, and 2 workers that have already moved (roaded) for T36. Those workers can make it TO the roaded forest on T37 but will be out of movement and can't chop it. But they could chop it on T38 and T39 and even have a worker turn to spare! I thought it was going to come down to 1 turn of the worker that we are producing on T39 (from whip overflow into the Oracle), but it doesn't look like we'll even need that.

Sounds like the 3 forest Oracle plan is a go!

[regoarrarr]

Ah wait, I'm an idiot. I can't have the chops come in on T39 - Priesthood doesn't come in till the END of turn 39, right? Or does it.... (I guess these cliff-hangers would work better if I waited more than 20 seconds or so between posts )

After ending turn, I'm currently at 37/95 on Polytheism, and have 3 gold in the bank. Priesthood is 56 beakers, so that's a total of 114 beakers

At 100% science, I make 32bpt and -6gpt. So that's 26 gpt at max cash.

So start of T36, I'm at 37/95 with 3 gold in the bank. Without any shenanigans, I make 25bpt. So, (25+1)*1.2 is 31. I can definitely make 3 commerce with "sub-optimal" tile choices. So that would be 32+3 or 35 total commerce, or 28bpt and +2gpt, or 31bpt and -3gpt. I think I can make the numbers work at 1 turn of 28 and 2 of 31. So 34, 38 and 38 - that's 110. Hmm 4 beakers short but it might be doable, but tight, and definitely need to be careful about the whip losing commerce. A sandbox would definitely be in order - @Cyneheard aren't you done with your finals yet?

[regoarrarr]

Okay I gotta stop posting for now but I gotta noodle on this some more, and then krill ergo darrelljs can continue yelling at me for holding the save.

[regoarrarr]

So at max science, I make 32cpt, or 33*1.2 = 39 beakers. Let's add 2 for working an incense tile instead of the wheat at Zakalwe, which makes 35*1.2 or 42 beakers. 2 turns of that gets 84 beakers, which means I need 30 beakers in the final turn, while also making 9 gold. That works out to be 24 (+1, *1.2) commerce and 15 gold. 35 commerce @ 70% is 24, and 10 gold, which leaves me 5 gold short. Hmmm...

Okay I can actually make 35cpt instead of 34 by working the grassland river, which is easy to do. T37, I've grown to size 5 in plako, and I can work an extra grass river, and swap the cows to a grass river which makes 37cpt. T38 I'm back down to 36 since I whipped plako back to size 4. I may even have to be at 35 depending on if I need the overflow, but I don't think I will if I'm whipping the worker.

So the 35 turn let's make that my cash turn, since that is even - 60% doesn't lose a beaker to overflow, 21 beakers (+1,*1.2) and 15 gold, which will be +9, leaving me with 12 in the bank, enough for 2 turns of max science.

26 beakers on T36, 45 on T37, and 44 on T38. That equals 115. Wait, that's more than 114, isn't it? Okay I think I can do a EOT39 Oracle.

[regoarrarr]

And the nice thing is that we really only have 1 turn where someone else building the Oracle would be annoying.

T36: 60% science on Polytheism, workers moving to forests
T37: Max science on Polytheism, comes in at EOT, workers chopping
T38: Max science on Priesthood, comes in at EOT, workers still chopping. If someone else builds the Oracle before I get the T38 save then we move on to Masonry / Monotheism (or other) rather than Priesthood. Maybe even make a run at Stonehenge, which, while not really useful for Inca, is good for denial at least as well as the cheapest Great Prophet I'm likely to see.

But if nobody has Oracle by the time I get the T38 save, then we proceed with the plan. This is where it would be the most annoying if I lost it, if somebody finished it between the time I got the 38 and 39 save, so either EOT38 for Shoot or EOT39 for either of the other folks. Still, I won't lose the forests, just "waste" beakers on Priesthood when I don't really need it right now. But not a huge deal because I'll definitely need / want it soon.

T39: If someone completes the Oracle before this turn, I'll cancel the workers chopping (or maybe put some of them into Henge). If not though, I complete the Oracle in one turn and due to PBEM mechanics (as I understand them), I'll get it right then and there.

[regoarrarr]

So the 35 turn let's make that my cash turn, since that is even - 60% doesn't lose a beaker to overflow, 21 beakers (+1,*1.2) and 15 gold, which will be +9, leaving me with 12 in the bank, enough for 2 turns of max science.

26 beakers on T36, 45 on T37, and 44 on T38. That equals 115. Wait, that's more than 114, isn't it? Okay I think I can do a EOT39 Oracle.

What it became painfully clear to me today, is that 21 beakers + 15 gold, sadly, does not equal 35 commerce.

No matter how I shake it out, I am 1 LOUSY GOLD short of getting Priesthood on T39