[SETUP IN PROGRESS] Pitboss 33: Industrial Era start

[mackoti]

I supose using the culture bug(I see it more like a feature) is alowed so we have here a realy fastpaced game.

[scooter]

The game cannot know beforehand though whether you are gonna settle coastal or not. However it could alter the next cost depending on whether your previous settle was coastal... So whether your last city got extra free hammers. It might even be that each coastal city raises the settler cost for all future cities. Or just ramping costs per city in general.

I know that--my thought was that settlers built in a coastal city would cost more.

I just tried to test this, and as far as I could tell it's not the case. I basically picked a civ (Peter of India since it was the leader in question), and started a game. I settled inland first, 310h. I then restarted using same leader/civ/map settings and settled coastal first - also 310h.

Brick - are you sure you don't have something screwy going on in your wbsave that has some field on leaders/civs/etc entered in incorrectly?

I guess the question is are we okay with not being 100% certain what settlers will cost before we start this thing. I am okay with it, but if someone isn't - now would be a good time to say so.

[NobleHelium]

I supose using the culture bug(I see it more like a feature) is alowed so we have here a realy fastpaced game.

And why should it be allowed? And why are you supposing it is allowed?

Has anyone besides Brick been able to reproduce 301h settlers with Peter of India?

[pindicator]

Well, I just opened hte sandbox and it's not just settler costs that are off. I'm looking at 24h work boats, 80h grenadiers, 72h knights - in fact, everything seems to cost 25% less hammers.

All the settlers were 310h in the games for Peter of India, but I only tried a handful of options.

[scooter]

Well, I just opened hte sandbox and it's not just settler costs that are off. I'm looking at 24h work boats, 80h grenadiers, 72h knights - in fact, everything seems to cost 25% less hammers.

The good news is that's correct. Industrial start does have lower production costs. If you check BtS/Assets/XML/GameInfo/Civ4ErasInfo.xml, you'll see that units for example are discounted by 20% (iTrainPercent = 80), which makes those numbers correct. That file documents all the differences except the settler thing.

[ReallyEvilMuffin]

Well, I just opened hte sandbox and it's not just settler costs that are off. I'm looking at 24h work boats, 80h grenadiers, 72h knights - in fact, everything seems to cost 25% less hammers.

All the settlers were 310h in the games for Peter of India, but I only tried a handful of options.

Yeah everything is cheaper in the older start games - just never noticed the off settler costs!

[picklepikkl]

I have also been unable to reproduce "same leader/civ combo having different hammer costs for settlers."

[BRickAstley]

I supose using the culture bug(I see it more like a feature) is alowed so we have here a realy fastpaced game.

This one right? That is definitely more an exploit than just a quirk of the game, being able to have your production do two things at once is against the basic design of the game. As such I'd say it's banned by default. As always if most all of you see differently that can be changed but I would say no by default for sure.

Well, I just opened hte sandbox and it's not just settler costs that are off. I'm looking at 24h work boats, 80h grenadiers, 72h knights - in fact, everything seems to cost 25% less hammers.

The good news is that's correct. Industrial start does have lower production costs. If you check BtS/Assets/XML/GameInfo/Civ4ErasInfo.xml, you'll see that units for example are discounted by 20% (iTrainPercent = 80), which makes those numbers correct. That file documents all the differences except the settler thing.

Thanks for answering this for me.

I have also been unable to reproduce "same leader/civ combo having different hammer costs for settlers."

That happened to me with the sandbox file, editing it to make every player Peter of India, and with the the first player and all the rest had different settler costs. I thought it might be due to that player settling by the coast, but settling off the coast didn't change the amount, and changing the entire map to bare grassland, saving the WB file, loading it fresh, and settling with the first player produced the same issue as the base sandbox file.

[BRickAstley]

Has anyone besides Brick been able to reproduce 301h settlers with Peter of India?

Here's the WB file I'm seeing it in. The first player cost is 310, the second player is 301. I'm not sure where the functional difference in their setups.

[Gaspar]

Re: culture bug, I assume exploits are banned by default as per RB ethos but if it needs to be said, I am in favor of banning any known exploits, including the culture exploit.