Rebalancing Civ4: RtR Mod

[T-hawk]

Yeah, confirmed that dead civs don't count, there's a check for team.isAlive() guarding the increment of iPossibleKnownCount. I could have sworn I remembered it the other way too.

Also I can make the changes to era-multipliers this evening, if considered nescessary.

Make sure you pull from Github first to pick up my circumnavigation change (only pulling the threshold limit out to a global define.)

[pindicator]

I think I've had this argument with Noble every time we're in a game together

[Krill]

iKnownCount = Number of civs knowing the tech
IPossibleKnownCount = Number of alive players
TECH_COST_TOTAL_KNOWN_TEAM_MODIFIER = Comes from Xml - Krill has it now 50%
highestEra = The era of the most techonolically advanced player (0...6)

iModifier = 100 (This just means no modifier) + (highestEra*TECH_COST_TOTAL_KNOWN_TEAM_MODIFIER*iKnownCount/iPossibleKnownCount)

OK. Here's what I'm thinking , it works for both PB18 and for the generic mod.

Keep the rate from Ind era onwards, so it doesn't increase in the Modern or Future era. Change iPossibleKnownCount to a constant: that means that it's possible to to choose values that can work for both 5 player PBEMs and huge 30 players in different games.

This means there are three sets of constants that need choosing; the era constants, the known team modifier, and the iPossibleKnownCount constant. Numbers that I think work well are along the lines of:

• iPossibleKnownCount = 10
  
• TECH_COST_TOTAL_KNOWN_TEAM_MODIFIER = 20
  
• era costs of:
  
  0 = ERA_ANCIENT
  1 = ERA_CLASSICAL
  2 = ERA_MEDIEVAL
  3 = ERA_RENAISSANCE
  4 = ERA_INDUSTRIAL
  4 = ERA_MODERN
  4 = ERA_FUTURE

This way, the maximum per player (that has the tech) bonus, regardless of the total number of players in game, is 8%, once one person reaches the Industrial era. Before then, it would be 6% in the Renaissance, 4% in Medieval era etc. It scales in a similar fashion to the current implementation in PB13.

Also, thanks Fintourist, the spreadsheet helped a lot to visualise the numbers over various game sizes.

So, I suppose my main question, is "Is it possible to change iPlayerKnownCount to a constant?" I don't see why not...but then again, I rival Boldly for my technological incompetence.

[novice]

I guess this is the RB mod way, redesigning key game concepts on the eve of starting a new game.

That said I like Krill's suggestion. While we're redesigning, should it even be a requirement to have contact with the civs knowing the tech?

[plako]

iPossibleKnownCount can be easily set as constant and this is pretty good way to handle this. I can recompile this in few hours

[Krill]

I guess this is the RB mod way, redesigning key game concepts on the eve of starting a new game.

That said I like Krill's suggestion. While we're redesigning, should it even be a requirement to have contact with the civs knowing the tech?

Normally it's because I'm rushed. This time, it's because I'm lazy as well.

Honestly, as a player I'd say that forcing people to have contact is a good thing; even with map trading it's nice to have a reason to scout, and even more fun to be able to screw people over by killing their scouts so they don't get the bonus for a bit longer. But objectively I think that contact shouldn't be required, because I don't think it's a fair implementation to screw people over if they start in awkward positions on a map, so I'd probably say contact shouldn't be necessary.

Ultimately though, I'm not sure what changing the iPKC will do to requiring contact, so I wouldn't know where to begin about changing that. I'd have to ask Plako and T-hawk about it.

One thing I will say is that ideally, the era numbers could be expressed in the XML. I don't think that this can be done today though (and I don't want to put upon Plako or T-hawk to spend time doing that, when the above implementation would limit the need to tweak those numbers other than for niche, late era start games).

[Fintourist]

Hmm.. With these values the known-tech bonus is even bigger than previously in PB18 until someone reaches the modern era. (unless the max value of iKnownCount is also 10, which caps the bonus at 80 %.

Note that with these changes the maximum known-tech boost in 5-player PBEM is 32 %.

[Fintourist]

Ok, I correct myself, the fact that now eliminating players does not cause know-tech bonus to explode is a good thing. But putting the value as a constant still makes the boost quite different depending on amount of players and for small PBEMs the effect is now pretty low.

[plako]

Fintourist has again a good point. I think this could work so that we use multipliers

0 = ERA_ANCIENT
1 = ERA_CLASSICAL
2 = ERA_MEDIEVAL
3 = ERA_RENAISSANCE
4 = ERA_INDUSTRIAL
4 = ERA_MODERN
4 = ERA_FUTURE

We also keep the current equation i.e. iModifier = 100 (This just means no modifier) + (highestEra*TECH_COST_TOTAL_KNOWN_TEAM_MODIFIER*iKnownCount/iPossibleKnownCount).

TECH_COST_TOTAL_KNOWN_TEAM_MODIFIER = 40

However we cap the max bonus based on the highestplayer era:
Renessaince = 50%
Industrial = 75%
Modern = 125%

I think this would give pretty good end result to large games and manageable in smaller ones.

e.g. 24 live players in Reneccainse/industrial would give 5%/6.67% per player that knows the tech.

If 5 players are alive these would give 24/32%, but things would end up capped after 2 players in Renessaince.

[Krill]

Plako, I don't understand what you mean by capping the max bonus: using the numbers you've posted there would be an 8% bonus in the Medieval era?