[PB69] Naufragar turns over a new leaf. Randomly.

[Krill]

By the way, you might notice I'm making gold while researching at full bore. This is a message: "Settle more cities, dummy." Admittedly, I've got 5 cities on wealth builds, but those have paused their banks. After all, banks are useless when working 100% science slider. 

Do not troll the newbies

Your cities are so crap that even at max research the banks contribute an appreciable amount of gold to your empire

[naufragar]

Your cities are so crap

My cities are so bad!  Have a look at Innistrad, size 12 workhorse of the empire:


It doesn't work a single tile worth more than 1 commerce, so with 12 pop and its city square, its tiles contribute +13gpt. A size 4 fishing village for Pindicator would already produce +13gpt.

Innistrad has 3 trade routes for +3gpt (yippee  ) and it's got a temple and monastery for another +4gpt from Spiral Minaret.

that even at max research the banks contribute an appreciable amount of gold to your empire 

So a bank would contribute +2gpt from the temple & monastery. In other words, at max research, a bank would produce almost 20% of a city's tile income as gold. My cities are so trash.

[Krill]

Just imagine this is Pindicator (I promise it isn't me)

[Qgqqqqq]

Making money at 100% is bonkers. How much gold are you getting from wealth?

[Mjmd]

Finance screen please!

[naufragar]

Okey doke, let's pull back the curtain. It's 215, so enough of a milestone anyway.


I had 5 cities producing 94gpt through wealth last turn. I turned a couple off this turn. Let's walk through a few.

Poor little Cadia. Has never grown above size 1. Likely never will. It's in a confusing spot, because its only job is to extend our strategic depth and attempt to take those hills from Magic for defense and perhaps, later for offense... You'll notice that I put a turn into a theater. This was a mistake. That sheep tile 2W gets lots of culture from Cadia and Camorr, which puts it at risk of cultural takeover. This would be a bad move, putting strain on my relationship with Commodore. So I can't build culture or a theater. We're slowly gaining control of those hills, so this isn't a huge deal. Wish I could just pump culture here, but bigger needs prevail. At size 1 this city produces 13 hammers, which is hilarious. Might as well build wealth.

Camorr, the city next to Cadia, has developed nicely. There was a cluster of high commerce tiles here, so might as well work them. Doesn't really have much in the way of hammers. Perhaps I build a bank here, but more likely closer to when I start saving gold again. I need to cottage that grassland and convert that mine into a windmill, but my workers are busy in our newly conquered territory, where cities are losing pop to starvation because their immediate tiles are insufficient. (Foodless map, indeed.)

These next two cities should be considered as a pair:

Oar is my mediocre Moai. As I said when I settled the thing, the plan was to turn bad tiles into usable ones. Mission accomplished, I guess. I remembered to change off that spy specialist to a scientist. I forgot last turn.  It's one turn away from completing its bank for +2gpt, but that one turn of bank production would equal 27 gold through wealth builds. 14 turn payback period. I almost certainly turn the gold slider on at sometime in those 14 turns, so I should probably finish the bank. 

And here is Dunwall. This city has done nothing but build wealth, practically since I researched Currency. It doesn't do much but sit there and give Commodore a place to do Merchant trade missions. With Org. Rel., a bank costs 133 hammers and produces 5gpt, so while at max science, this thing only takes 27 turns to pay back. I know my math was the opposite in Oar, but this is truly nuts. If a 20 turn payback period is a baseline "good" return, this bank is good almost without turning on the gold slider.  This is due to Spiral Minaret and a couple of merchants. (Unrelated, Representation would be great for me. Better for Pind, but still excellent for me.)

Our most recent city. Freesdie shot our expenses up by 16gpt.  Our slider is good enough that we should be settling these, I think. After founding, our income goes up by 5 commerce (2x trade routes, 1 from the city square, 1 from Buddhist shrine with 100% gold multiplier). 82 hammers into a Temple and Monastery gives us +4 commerce, and we can get 60 of those hammers from chopping. So I still need to gain 7 commerce from somewhere to break even. But wait! Temple+monaster+city square is 5 hammers that can go into wealth builds, and getting 2 commerce is a cinch. (Pop on farms or even just 1 lumber mill.) So for very little investment (missionary, worker time for chops) a size 1 city can, with sufficient handwaving, can be worthwhile eve at turn 215. Edit: I'm bumping up against the conqueror's plateau all over, which makes me think Pind and Comm have hit it already.


Some final thoughts from looking at the Finances screen. I'm making +122gpt from Spiral Minaret & Shrine. Commodore...doesn't. This makes me think he's pretty screwed. Pindicator has better GNP than me without these (and just cashed in a Great Merchant for his Liberalism run), and the majority of his empire are small cities that have yet to grow onto Superdeath's amazing green and coastal tiles. This makes me think I'm pretty screwed.

I need to get bigger, and a couple of newly founded, foodless 1-pop cities won't do it. But I can't yet conquer Magic on my own. I think if I were to do it solo, I'd need Machine Gun cover. A problem for later.

[naufragar]

(Unrelated, Representation would be great for me. Better for Pind, but still excellent for me.)

Holy shit. We discovered Pind's Liberalism target:



No, not Constitution. That would be too pedestrian. He's going for Democracy and then presumably for Statue of Liberty, which, since this world's a pangaea, gives him a free Rep specialist in every city. Holy smokes. We're so fucked.

To unlock Constitution, Pind researched Nationalism, which obsoletes his Mausoleum, so for good measure, he threw one last 12 turn golden age before he revolted. I mean, he's going to be so far ahead of me in tech, it's almost laughable. Commodore for his part hopefully has a plan for messing with him in the next ten turns or Pind is going to be completely untouchable. I can't reach him. He's isolated from me by Comm and Magic.


Do I even try to contest Liberalism? Can I get through ~4000 beakers before Pind can get through 5000?



Here's the demos screen in which Pind has double my GNP.



Not sure what to do. Part of me wants to say, "Commodore fed him Gavagai and Bing. It's Comm's responsibility to deal with him" and continue on my trek to get bigger by founding cities and eating Magic Science. But I think the way that fanciful pipe dream ends is with Pindian bombers destroying Commodorian cannons and me impotent in a corner.

Edit: Just for my records, here are the tech differences between Pind and me.

Me:
Mil Trad 3000
Chem: 2700
Steel: 4100
Total: 9800

Pind:
Philo: 1200
Education: 2700
Printing Press: 2400
Rep Parts: 2700
Rifles: 3600
Compass+Optics: 1500

Total: 14,100

4300 beaker difference And it's only going to get worse

[naufragar]

GOD DAMMIT.


Forget Liberalizing Democracy, why not go for freaking Assembly Line? Pind just got through a 3000 beaker tech in one turn. This wasn't a bulb because there were no in-turn score increases. So he just one-banged 3000 beakers. God dammit. His expenses are just about -600gpt but who cares when his beaker output is freaking 3000 per turn. I tried looking for some alternative, like perhaps he had teched most of it and just stopped 1 turn short, but no, because he didn't have the prerequisite before last turn. I can't understand this. 3000 beakers in 1 turn? I get tech visibility on Pindicator next turn, but hell, he gets Liberalism next turn if he wants. F me. And for those keeping count, this is only turn 2 of his golden age.

Part of me wants to say, "Commodore fed him Gavagai and Bing. It's Comm's responsibility to deal with him"

But hey, a bit of good news:


Yeah, no interest on the loan, but Comm's not an idiot. If there's no interest attached, he's suggesting it's worth my while in other ways. I suspect this is to get him through Steel so he can have some semblance of protection from Pindicator's bombers. We accepted.

My culture situation is becoming tense:


Bolan-Bei gained 4th ring culture and took control of Cadia's first ring. This means Magic can kill it at will. Joker is fighting desperately against Yasodharapura's culture, but I suspect that's a losing battle in the short term before treaty expiry. So Magic can do what I did to him, pick the side I'm weakest and get in a quick city raze. Joker is way more important, so that's the one I defend. Again, Cadia is just meant to provide strategic depth.

[naufragar]

Another turn, another 3000 beaker tech Pindicator is researching in 1 turn.



Military Tradition gets him Cavalry. These make him impervious to any attacks until Machine Guns. Even if Comm were to assemble an impressive stack of Genadiers and Cannons, Pind's Cavalry would just laugh as they flanked them to pieces.

He's also drafting three Riflemen a turn. I don't really have a path of disruption. If I load up my entire army and send it through Comm's lands at Pind, Magic just kills me.

I'm all for fighting until the bitter end, but there's just no way Pindicator loses from this position. The part that pisses me off is I'm not sure how I could've played this differently even with perfect information. I didn't have an equivalent Gavagai or Superdeath/Bing. Pindicator's played really well, don't misunderstand. It just drives me crazy that he's been playing solitaire and it's going to win him the game.

Sid has a sense of humor. In '64 I mentioned how the meta has evolved:

We’re long past the lofty, Sulllan days of single-player until Liberalism.

And lo and behold... Infuriating.

Well, let's make him prove he can pull off a solo conquest two eras ahead of his victim.

[naufragar]

One last bit of rant. Notice the power ratios? To this turn, Pindicator has never had more soldiers than Magic and yet I've taken seven cities off Magic. Meanwhile, Pindicator gets the best land on the map for free after first Superdeath and then Bing gave it up for a song. Maddening.